Top 3 In the East

[gurpilo]

Miami, Boston, Celeveland, Milwaukee and Philly are better than us.

We are a tier below with New York, Toronto, Brooklin, Charlotte fighting for the playoffs.

For Atlanta to go for next tier we need a step forward from Hunter, JJ and OO and to be lucky with injuries

[sillent]

38 minutes ago, gurpilo said:

Miami, Boston, Celeveland, Milwaukee and Philly are better than us.

We are a tier below with New York, Toronto, Brooklin, Charlotte fighting for the playoffs.

For Atlanta to go for next tier we need a step forward from Hunter, JJ and OO and to be lucky with injuries

What was our record against Milwaukee last year? And that was against a 41 - 41 team. We are better than the team we were last year and that record and we have the right orchestrator in Quinn to prove it.

Does Philly really believe what you're saying or do you think ultimately in their hearts there's some worry there?

People have been putting Cleveland on top of us for the past 2 seasons and we've been climbing that mountain and standing on top of it. They have to prove it before I believe it although I do think they've made some improvements every change needs an adjusting period.

Miami even if they get Dame are not the team they were last year. I like seeing Quinn and Spoelstra go head to head but overall we have the pieces to prevail as was shown in the play in. We're only going to take that blue print and dig further into it.

Honestly Boston is the biggest wild card to me. On one hand we've seen them deep before (Tatum, Brown, Hayward, Horford, Smart, Marcus Morris, Robert Williams, Terry Rozier, Kyrie Irving) and it didn't work. On paper they definitely have the squad but it will all depend on the fit between Porzingis and the 2 other stars.

Either way right now I only see Boston as the clear team ahead of us. Every other picture looks a little cloudy.

 

[RedDawg#8]

Even if we get better it doesn’t mean we have necessarily closed the gap between us and other contenders.

Boston and Cleveland are my top threats 

Philly and Milwaukee are poised to fall back a bit under new coaching.

NY will get too high on their own hype and disappoint. Atlanta is a better team than them and anyone left.

So, 5th seed is my safe bet. There is plenty opportunity to be in the hunt for the 3rd seed though.

[bird_dirt]

IDC how many teams have supposedly regressed so far, there’s no way the Hawks have jumped into the top three without more moves coming. 
And if we’re being real, the Hawks have regressed at this point getting rid of Collins without bringing in any more quality depth with NBA experience. 
Barring anything else happening, I’m expecting 7 seed, maaaaybe 6 just due to a coaching bump. A lot of teams ahead of us would need to implode for us to make it to the fifth seed.

[Gray Mule]

We hear it every summer.  Count on it.  Every team in the east except the Atlanta Hawks are improved over last season.  And, we tend to agree with this every summer.  It's happening again!

We just lost the great JC and have done nothing to replace him.  Gloom, dispair and agony to me, if it weren't for bad luck I'd have no luck at all!  (He-Haw)

Over and over, we've done nothing.  We have all this $$$ payroll space because we lost JC and we haven't spent any of it.  We really don't know what we need right now but, for gosh sakes, spend it all right now!!

I don't know who is available.  Find him and sign him now!  We will figure out later how to use him!!  After all, he's exactly what we need.

[Diesel]

2 hours ago, gurpilo said:

Miami, Boston, Celeveland, Milwaukee and Philly are better than us.

We are a tier below with New York, Toronto, Brooklin, Charlotte fighting for the playoffs.

For Atlanta to go for next tier we need a step forward from Hunter, JJ and OO and to be lucky with injuries

What is your basis??

Unless Miami gets Lillard, they are going to be a good dumpster team. Not the top tier team and not better than us. 

You said Charlotte and Toronto?

[Gray Mule]

Seriously, remember this.  All those great eastern teams we see this summer, they must play each other when the season opens.  They will be beating up on each other.  They can't all have perfect records.  Meanwhile, Atlanta will be winning their share of games.  We set our aim high.  3rd is not too high of a goal!

GO ATL HAWKS!

[Packfill]

East appears wide open this year.  Opportunity is absolutely there for the Hawks.  I am taking a wait and see approach though. Hopefully the coaching is good enough to unlock some things because absent that I don't see a roster built to contend for a championship in the near term.  I will be happy to be proven wrong on that.

In any event, it is about time for a new power to arise in the east.  Whether that is a current fringy playoff team like Atlanta or Cleveland, or one of the bottom feeders that finally coalesce around their young talent (Detroit and Orlando, in my view, both have undeniable talent, but that talent needs to convert into production/winning, which is no easy feet).

The west seems stacked to me.

[gurpilo]

Cita

What is your basis??

Unless Miami gets Lillard, they are going to be a good dumpster team. Not the top tier team and not better than us. 

You said Charlotte and Toronto?

Miami got the finals, they added Josh Richardson and Thomas Bryant, that are real quality pieces, to an already deep team, you think we are better than them? Why? Because we won one game? If they avoid injuries and If they add Lillard... Orlando Robinson is growing a lot too...

Charlotte had a injury depleted roster last year. Lamelo is back and also Hayward and Miles Bridges. Mark Williams and Nick Richards will give them an improvement, they might be fighting with us.

Toronto, they added Portal that is a real upgrade, sure they lost Van Vleet but they still have Barnes, Trent, Anunoby Siakam, Boucher,  Achiuwa, Portal, they are really a good team.

And I forgot about Chicago.

We barely made the playoffs last year, we lost Collins and added nothing, why you think we should be ahead of those teams this year?

[Diesel]

1 hour ago, gurpilo said:

Miami got the finals, they added Josh Richardson and Thomas Bryant, that are real quality pieces, to an already deep team, you think we are better than them? Why? Because we won one game? If they avoid injuries and If they add Lillard... Orlando Robinson is growing a lot too...

Charlotte had a injury depleted roster last year. Lamelo is back and also Hayward and Miles Bridges. Mark Williams and Nick Richards will give them an improvement, they might be fighting with us.

Toronto, they added Portal that is a real upgrade, sure they lost Van Vleet but they still have Barnes, Trent, Anunoby Siakam, Boucher,  Achiuwa, Portal, they are really a good team.

And I forgot about Chicago.

We barely made the playoffs last year, we lost Collins and added nothing, why you think we should be ahead of those teams this year?

Miami has lost a lot waiting on Lillard.  IF they don't get Lillard, it's a wrap.

They lost Strus, Vincent, and another player.   Those guys were good for the squad because everybody else except Bam is Old. 

 

[Diesel]

Just now, Diesel said:

Charlotte had a injury depleted roster last year. Lamelo is back and also Hayward and Miles Bridges. Mark Williams and Nick Richards will give them an improvement, they might be fighting with us.

Toronto, they added Portal that is a real upgrade, sure they lost Van Vleet but they still have Barnes, Trent, Anunoby Siakam, Boucher,  Achiuwa, Portal, they are really a good team.

Charlotte with Melo is not anything to be so excited about.  The most that they can hope is that Williams gets better. 

Toronto will have a new coach.   That will mess with their comfort.   They don't have a lot of cohesive pieces to start with .. now, you bring in a new coach.  Expect problems. 

Chicago is interesting but they are not a problem. 

Philly may have taken a step backwards.   Nurse will have his hands full.  He has to actually deal with a real star. 

 

 

[sillent]

5 hours ago, gurpilo said:

Miami got the finals, they added Josh Richardson and Thomas Bryant, that are real quality pieces, to an already deep team, you think we are better than them? Why? Because we won one game? If they avoid injuries and If they add Lillard... Orlando Robinson is growing a lot too...

Charlotte had a injury depleted roster last year. Lamelo is back and also Hayward and Miles Bridges. Mark Williams and Nick Richards will give them an improvement, they might be fighting with us.

Toronto, they added Portal that is a real upgrade, sure they lost Van Vleet but they still have Barnes, Trent, Anunoby Siakam, Boucher,  Achiuwa, Portal, they are really a good team.

And I forgot about Chicago.

We barely made the playoffs last year, we lost Collins and added nothing, why you think we should be ahead of those teams this year?

If Miami adds Lillard that means they would be losing depth to an already depleted team.

I get what you're saying about Charlotte their young and should improve. Sounds like another team I know that should have improved chemistry from continuity as well as a better system with a new coach having a year to actually implement his system. We've seen a small glimpse of it with our summer league team winning games even when their best pick isn't playing well and we've been down double digits in a few games if not most.

Toronto has been in shambles last year and are only continuing to fall apart which is why Fred Van Fleet left and Siakam is the next foot out the door.

You forgot about Chicago because they are forgettable. A young team staying pat and growing from within is understandable. An older team doing that is a cry for mediocrity.

Funny how you got 2 - 4 teams on here that have lost players or have stood pat but now they're better than us when they weren't even better than us record wise then Great logic (grass always greener).

[sillent]

If you really want some insight to these other teams start seeing what they're fan based are saying about them.

If I closed my eyes and replaced some names I would think I was listening to some squawkers.

Some are going thru way more internal turmoil than we are for staying pat like Toronto for instance. 

Check them out though and you will have a lot better perspective for us and what we've been doing with our team.

Although we might've saw the depth of Denver not many expected them to go all the way because they didn't change must and didn't seem to have the grit to put them over the hump. 

What a difference a yr makes!!

[gurpilo]

Cita

Funny how you got 2 - 4 teams on here that have lost players or have stood pat but now they're better than us when they weren't even better than us record wise then  Great logic (grass always greener).

Is just the opposite, we lost a starter that has not been replaced by anyone and by some magic you think doing that we are better than the east champions…. We will be with the same record next year, 0.500 and that is assuming JJ makes the expected leap and we avoid injuries that is not a guarantee.

Toronto is on the same situation but replaced Van Vleet with Schröder and Flynn is a capable PG. Van Vleet scoring will be shared by Barnes, OG, Siakam, Trent, Poetl, they have a lot of quality players. They had the same record as us last year.

Charlotte was fighting with us on a .500 record when they had Lamelo and Bridges 2seasons ago, last season they lost everyone, this season they are recovering all players and have added Brandon Miller.
Chicago had nearly the same record. They added Carter and Craig that fill their needs.

This logic is pure data and not assumptions and guesses due to change of coaching that you are making.

All these teams made more than us to improve, I am not saying they are better than us, I think they will be on the same tier but no way we are on the same tier as teams that won more than 50 games last year and Miami. We are not winning 50 this year, Milwaukee, Philly, Boston and Cleveland will do and we are not the playoff team Miami is with Bam, Butler, Herro, Lowry, Love…

 

[shakes]

on RGM they currently have a thread to rank the east.  12 people have done it and here is where we land:

 

3rd = 1 vote

6th = 2 votes

7th = 5 votes

8th = 2 votes

 9th =1 vote

11th= 1 vote

[macdaddy]

We have holes in the roster.  I'm confident we have more moves coming.   The roster as it is now is not competing for a title barring a major and improbable breakout from a young guy.  

[Gray Mule]

What do we, the posters here on the Squawk, see and know about the current Hawk team and all the players on their roster that the GM and coaches do not?  How many of us are so wise right now that we know what moves that we would make if given the opportunity?

Just remember, any trade you contemplate must meet the approval of the other team or teams that you are dealing with.  It takes two to tango, tis said, and it takes two parties in agreement to make a trade work.

I await your response.  I know that there are several who already has the answers !!

[Diesel]

42 minutes ago, macdaddy said:

We have holes in the roster.  I'm confident we have more moves coming.   The roster as it is now is not competing for a title barring a major and improbable breakout from a young guy.  

I don't really agree with this assessment. 

I think we have to be realistic about what we have without the trappings of wanting more. 

DO we really have holes...

Trae= Best PG in the game.   DJ = Allstar Guard.   Clint = Allstar like C.    JJ, AJ, OO, Bey = Young with potential.  Any of these guys can turn the corner and be an allstar. 

Bogi, Bey  Two of the best three point shooters in the game. 

AJ = Budding three point shooter. 

Dre= Nonimpact defensive specialist. 

Mills = Veteran BU PG.

Vit = Best cheerleader you can hope for. 

Bufkin and Mo G....  Really good potential.. will probably play in College Park. 

So all & all, we have a very good squad.    The test is going to be JJ, AJ, OO, Bey.. one of these guys stepping up. 

 

[macdaddy]

1 minute ago, Diesel said:

Trae= Best PG in the game.   DJ = Allstar Guard.   Clint = Allstar like C.    JJ, AJ, OO, Bey = Young with potential.  Any of these guys can turn the corner and be an allstar. 

That seems like the same assessment i made though.   So if one of those guys becomes an allstar then sure we're ok.  But most likely they won't.  Hell Trae wasn't an all star last year.

So as you point out we're good at 1,2,5.   But where are we are 3 and 4?  That's not a good place to be and out of JJ, AJ, OO, and Bey only JJ is a legit 4 and he's still very young and raw.  Not many guys go from G-league to 5ppg to allstar in in 3 seasons. 

[JayBirdHawk]

31 minutes ago, macdaddy said:

That seems like the same assessment i made though.   So if one of those guys becomes an allstar then sure we're ok.  But most likely they won't.  Hell Trae wasn't an all star last year.

So as you point out we're good at 1,2,5.   But where are we are 3 and 4?  That's not a good place to be and out of JJ, AJ, OO, and Bey only JJ is a legit 4 and he's still very young and raw.  Not many guys go from G-league to 5ppg to allstar in in 3 seasons. 

I see our issue as similar to last offseason at the 4 spot. 

We traded Gallo but didn't adequately address the backup PF spot. We had JC starting with JHol and JJ as backups...we saw what that looked like.

This season it's JJ or Bey to start and backup at the 4. 

If the season is about developing and hoping QuinMagic works and leads to wins, sure. If it's competing for top 4 and making a deep playoff run - I'm concerned.