I hope the Siakam deal fails to go through.

[Diesel]

8 hours ago, AHF said:

So in the example where Gobeet is toxic and isn’t playing for the team but is demanding they pay him as he “rehabs”, if he vetos every team but LA the only options for Utah are to do a terrible deal with LA, pay Gobert 15% extra even though he is the one who made them want to move on, or hold onto him with him giving a Harden-in-Houston style performance while he poisons the locker room?  

The thing is that I agree that when a player becomes toxic and sit out games that it hurts the team and the fans.  I don't know why the league doesn't just garnish his pay.  I mean, they started it with Simmons.  But no follow through.    Proposed.. there can be some type of toxicity penalty because as proposed, the player can demand to be traded and the team can make a good faith effort to do so. 

So if Gobert demanded a trade to LA, Utah can make a good faith effort to do that.  If he goes, he pays 15%.   If they can't make that happen... then the other trades are fair game. 

Gobert can object to going to a place... but that doesn't mean that he won't go.  It just means that Philly has to pay 15% for sending him.

So Gobert is toxic and isn't playing for the team and demanding that they pay him as he rehabs.   If he demanded a trade to LA, he would have to be able to pass the physical for that trade to happen.   So he would have to wait until rehabbing was over to be traded to LA.  If no deal with LA could be struck, and If Orlando says we will give you  X, Y, and Z for Gobert and Gobert objects.   If Orlando and Philly still agrees to a deal, Gobert goes to Orlando with the 15% raise.  

 

Quote

None of those seem to serve the fan base as well as trading him to Minnesota for a real return without needing to add a kicker.  That also gives a huge incentive for players to do things like that to get themselves out of a team they don’t like and a 15% pay raise to boot.  It also gives teams like LA very little incentive to offer a fair deal because they know any deal with a team other than them will cost Utah say $30M extra (assuming a $200M contract as you used earlier).  

Nothing is really fair to the fan base in this scenario.   Regardless of what CBA you follow... I mean, Gobert  sitting out is not fair.   Gobert being traded is not fair.   IN this CBA he was traded for several draft picks.    Fortunately, the Jazz restart was a good one but had it not been, it would have been disastrous for the fanbase.   Because a restart is rarely good for the fanbase.   You remember Pre-Trae?

As far as the other team, it depends on if they want the player.   The trade for them really hasn't changed, they have to get a trade that Utah will agree to.   Just because he wants to go to LA doesn't mean that he will.   In order for a trade to happen a deal has to be agreed upon...   So.. for Portland and Miami.. nothing would change.  A deal would still have to be made.  If they couldn't come up with a deal, then either Lillard stays or is traded elsewhere.   There is no "must". 

 

[Spud2nique]

2 hours ago, swanlee said:

AJ and OO should be off limits at least for a few years

FOREVER! PREACH!!!

[JayBirdHawk]

 

[Diesel]

Well, after listening to schlender and friends...  our offer with AJ is very strong.   More importantly, we should not be offering AJ. 

 

[bird_dirt]

Lord grant me the confidence of @Diesel, the patience of @AHF, and the wisdom to never get involved in an argument with either one of them. Amen. 

[JayBirdHawk]

Hawks weren't interested in including Kobe Bufkin in Pascal Siakam trade talks

While talks for Siakam centered around De’Andre Hunter, AJ Griffin, and draft pick compensation never materialized, there was a young player the Hawks didn’t want to include that’s worth noting should the teams revisit trade discussions. The Hawks were unwilling to part with rookie guard Kobe Bufkin in trade talks for Siakam, league sources told HoopsHype.

 

– via Michael Scotto @ HoopsHype

[ShooterSays]

Really? Kobe was the deal breaker and not AJ??? 

[theheroatl]

22 minutes ago, JayBirdHawk said:

Hawks weren't interested in including Kobe Bufkin in Pascal Siakam trade talks

While talks for Siakam centered around De’Andre Hunter, AJ Griffin, and draft pick compensation never materialized, there was a young player the Hawks didn’t want to include that’s worth noting should the teams revisit trade discussions. The Hawks were unwilling to part with rookie guard Kobe Bufkin in trade talks for Siakam, league sources told HoopsHype.

 

– via Michael Scotto @ HoopsHype

I saw this. The whole negotiation timetable is unknown and who knows what frameworks we’re thrown around.

I would’ve kept AJ over Bufkin but who knows what is going on still.

 

It’s still weird and awkward that Toronto is going into camp with all these question marks. I still think a last minute deal gets done somewhere on one of their guys.

[AHF]

14 hours ago, ShooterSays said:

Really? Kobe was the deal breaker and not AJ??? 

Tough to tell.  I always take these reports with a grain of salt but it might have been a reflection about how highly the Hawks value AJ.  I.e., "AJ is so good that you get nothing else from us if we are including him."  

I'm happy to give up Kobe in this deal, frankly, but I also can't believe Toronto would value him in the context of a "take Kobe or AJ" sort of discussion.  I can't imagine that the Hawks prefer giving up AJ rather than Kobe.  So I don't think the way to view this situation is to look at it as an either/or choice.

[Diesel]

I don't think AJ should be a throw in on a rental. 

Kobe, I haven't seen enough.  His slightness is my concern.   Still, I can see Toronto wanting him because Dennis is not their future.   Kobe can be a project and a draw, maybe even a face. 

 

 

[kg01]

*audible, obnoxious yawn*

Screw them 'Dan's.  We guud. 

[JayBirdHawk]

 

 

[kg01]

10 minutes ago, JayBirdHawk said:

 

 

Brett's boss: "Aye man, you ain't put no content out in like 6 weeks, bro.  Dredge up the Hawks-Raptors stuff again."

Brett: "Bbbbut, there ain't no new news there, boss."

Boss: Ain't gotta be new.  Just drag up the same ol, lame a** rumors as before.  Re-package, man.  That's what we do for clicks!"

Brett: "Aye-eye, captain"

 

[theheroatl]

6 minutes ago, kg01 said:

Brett's boss: "Aye man, you ain't put no content out in like 6 weeks, bro.  Dredge up the Hawks-Raptors stuff again."

Brett: "Bbbbut, there ain't no new news there, boss."

Boss: Ain't gotta be new.  Just drag up the same ol, lame a** rumors as before.  Re-package, man.  That's what we do for clicks!"

Brett: "Aye-eye, captain"

 

NBA writers be dying out here KG.. bills gotta be paid.

 

they got told that Kevin porter trade scenarios are off limits 

Edited September 14, 2023 by theheroatl

[Spud2nique]

1 hour ago, theheroatl said:

NBA writers be dying out here KG.. bills gotta be paid.

 

they got told that Kevin porter trade scenarios are off limits 

I for one like it..  

[JayBirdHawk]

https://syndication.bleacherreport.com/amp/10089564-hawks-right-not-to-include-kobe-bufkin-in-pascal-siakam-package-amid-nba-trade-rumors.amp.html

 

"The Hawks were unwilling to part with rookie guard Kobe Bufkin in trade talks for Siakam, league sources told HoopsHype. Coach Quin Snyder is said to be high on the former Michigan guard, who averaged 19.3 points on 51.9 percent shooting overall and 45 percent from beyond the arc with 5.6 rebounds in his final eight games as a Wolverine," Michael Scotto of HoopsHype reported.

 

It was the right call by a franchise that may be competitive in the Eastern Conference, but does not have a realistic shot at representing it in the NBA Finals, nor would it have even with Siakam.

 

The Raptors understandably are interested in bringing Bufkin in considering they had the opportunity to draft him earlier this year and went with Grady d*ck instead.

Executing a trade for Bufkin would deliver the team its top two favored players, a move that would be brilliant on the part of their front office but not one that appears likely.

That does not mean the Hawks are completely out of the market on Siakam.

 

Scotto's report suggests Bogdan Bogdanovich is a player worth watching in any trade movements made by the team, especially coming off a FIBA World Cup performance that saw him finish as the third-highest-ranked player. Throw in a sizeable contract ($68 million owed over the next four seasons per Scotto) and you have a piece the Hawks would hope to leverage for Siakam.

If they fail to acquire the forward, the front office can rest peacefully knowing it did not make the reactionary move and mortgage the future of the team for a quick fix that may not have gotten them to its final destination the way a young core of players led by Bufkin can in the years to come.

How well that sits with Young, who wants to win now, remains to be seen.

[theheroatl]

We still have a big hole at PF even with Jalen. And I view Saddiq as a great long term SF replacement for Dre.

If we keep Bey and AJ I think we'll be fine at 3pt shooting in the forward spots.

The question is, are we actually going to be able to fill it.

Edited September 16, 2023 by theheroatl

[AtLaS]

Why is this conversation coming back up?  You can't win with Siakam in this lineup unless major changes are made to the roster.  You have to have 3pt shooting at 4 of 5 starting positions in the modern NBA.  We are also going to have to pay him 50M+ next year which will be a horrible contract, and we would have given up a lot of young pieces to do that.

I've said 100x I actually love Siakam as a player, he just won't fit with THIS roster.  He'd be great for the Warriors or Celtics.  We already have shooting issues, it will get worse with him on this roster.

We need to be focused on KAT or Embiid or someone who can address those needs.

[yungsta]

10 hours ago, AtLaS said:

Why is this conversation coming back up?  You can't win with Siakam in this lineup unless major changes are made to the roster.  You have to have 3pt shooting at 4 of 5 starting positions in the modern NBA.  We are also going to have to pay him 50M+ next year which will be a horrible contract, and we would have given up a lot of young pieces to do that.

I've said 100x I actually love Siakam as a player, he just won't fit with THIS roster.  He'd be great for the Warriors or Celtics.  We already have shooting issues, it will get worse with him on this roster.

We need to be focused on KAT or Embiid or someone who can address those needs.

This hypothetical Siakam trade just reeks of desperation to get something done. It reminds me the Dejounte trade. Overpaying for a rental who is an awkward fit just because its a name with some accolades.

This trade leaves us with no true SF, a lot of SF/PF tweeners and little reliable shooting. and this is the team we want to mortgage the future for and go "All in" on?

[JayBirdHawk]

11 hours ago, yungsta said:

It reminds me the Dejounte trade. Overpaying for a rental.....

How so?

Murray had two years left on his contract so not what we typically call a rental.