Are we forced to sign or match THJ this off season ?

[willthepureshooter]

Tim Hardaway Jr will sign for a bargain. I'm pretty sure money isn't his major focus as his dad was a star in this league. I'm guessing a 4 year $42M deal.

[sturt]

These things have too many variables in play to place any firm number on it. All you need is two of 30 GMs to consider an upward-trending player to have a high ceiling, and it all escalates quickly because it's such an eBay environment.

I'll only say that in the new economy since last season, I think $18m is the new $12m... we were stuck in that $60m range for so long, and I think that's just how we've been conditioned.

 

[Alex]

1 hour ago, hazer said:

Thanks for the scoop :P

 

I think it's a formality anyway.  

[JTB]

30 minutes ago, sturt said:

These things have too many variables in play to place any firm number on it. All you need is two of 30 GMs to consider an upward-trending player to have a high ceiling, and it all escalates quickly because it's such an eBay environment.

I'll only say that in the new economy since last season, I think $18m is the new $12m... we were stuck in that $60m range for so long, and I think that's just how we've been conditioned.

 

Very good point made!

[sturt]

6 hours ago, Diesel said:

Coming in off of a great NCAA tourney but nothing really before that.

Was thinking some more about Dorsey, and when I browsed through some YouTube clips, noticed in more than one, he was being referred to as "Mr. March" by Reggie Miller and others.

So, yeah, I also would take from that that he seemed to turn things up a notch in one-and-out play.

But then again, Schlenk mentioned he was one of only two Oregon players to score 1000 pts in the space of two seasons (if I got that right). Unless he got about 400 each March, that would seem to debunk the assumption that he only played well in the tournaments. Right?

[AHF]

My first reaction to the pick was that I hoped we weren't picking him based on a hot streak in the tourney that extended to his pre-draft workouts.  Those are all good things but need to be taken for the small sample size that they are (which is why I'm not looking to ditch THJr).  

I'm trusting Schlenk to make that determination based on his entire college career and not just the tourney.

[CP61]

13 minutes ago, AHF said:

My first reaction to the pick was that I hoped we weren't picking him based on a hot streak in the tourney that extended to his pre-draft workouts.  Those are all good things but need to be taken for the small sample size that they are (which is why I'm not looking to ditch THJr).  

I'm trusting Schlenk to make that determination based on his entire college career and not just the tourney.

He's always shot well which is why he was drafted

[AHF]

12 minutes ago, CP61 said:

He's always shot well which is why he was drafted

At  his size, I'm hoping he can develop his PG skills enough to play there.  There have been plenty of guys who didn't have much other than a perimeter shot going for them who learned to be real pieces of a team's rotation.  We need the shooting so I'm crossing my fingers.

[sillent]

17 hours ago, High5 said:

For all of Timmy's shortcomings to this point, he did things last year that we haven't seen since prime Joe. And he can take it a step further with his athleticism. I'm not saying we should overpay him at all given his inconsistencies, but I do hope he sticks around and takes his game to another level. He's still only 25. 

 What he said @High5

[Thomas]

Initially feels like its heavily about whether Baze is here or not and then what to do with Marco. Most are talking about automatically trading Marco even though he would be the best three point shooter on the Hawks by default (don't want to include Moose in here because he is not a wing). Off the bench he can help. So in my almost perfect world I would have Tim at up to 12 per year starting and Marco backing him up with his three. Once again remember what was the biggest offensive problem for us in all of our games against the Wiz in the postseason, our three pointer. The last game the biggest problem was stopping theirs but if we hit ours we would have faced Boston afterwards. 

[Thomas]

19 hours ago, High5 said:

For all of Timmy's shortcomings to this point, he did things last year that we haven't seen since prime Joe. And he can take it a step further with his athleticism. I'm not saying we should overpay him at all given his inconsistencies, but I do hope he sticks around and takes his game to another level. He's still only 25. 

Exactly. A prime example being against the Spurs during our uneven season. Tim saved the day during regulation and OT. Positive comments from the Spurs would seemingly carry just a bit of weight. Would like us to be coaching that player moving forward, not someone else.

http://www.espn.com/nba/boxscore?gameId=400899374 

[wolvetigers]

On 6/25/2017 at 11:41 PM, Sothron said:

I hope he signs somewhere else. I was never sold on him and while he did FINALLY improve last season it isn't enough for me to want to invest that kind of money.

Are you serious? THJ, worked hard over the last 16months to buy into Bud's system and now he is 25years old and the 3rd leading scorer on the Hawks. And your answer is to trade him b/c you are not sold on him? Wake UP HAWKS FANS!!!

His career progression Arc (to date) is actually similar to Jimmy Butler from a numbers progression. Now Hardaway needs to continue to work on his defense, but him and Dennis in the backcourt could be very potent provided they continue to improve. The problem is we overpaid for Bazemore's energy but his skillset is no where near Hardaway's and Baze is two years older.

How will we ever be successful if we don't continue to grow and refine the talent we have in place. 

 

[bumpyphish1]

On 6/25/2017 at 8:13 PM, hazer said:

Hawks have Bellini, Bembry, Dorsey, and Gaze (if not traded) at SG. I'm assuming they don't match THJr at higher than $15mill/yr.

Hawks don't "have Belinelli"--his only value to us is as a trade piece.  Yeah, he'll be in the rotation if he sticks around until the deadline but his tradeable contract was the best thing we got--only thing we got--for trading Howard.  Dorsey is definitely a guy suited to come off the bench.  Sort of a combo guard and a marksman-type.  Bazemore and Bembry as much SF's as they are SG's.  So, really, you need to look at it like:  for SG/SF, we have Prince, Bazemore, Bembry, and Dorsey.  I think Hardaway is likely worth matching at around $16-17M per and I'd give him a four year deal without hesitating,

**WHY DOES NO ONE SEEM TO BE CONSIDERING THE IDEA HE COULD BE USED IN A SIGN AND TRADE???**  

On 6/25/2017 at 10:16 PM, parfait said:

I think we go maximum 3 years $36 million.

Or they push for a 2 year deal for like $30 million.

If he gets offers for 4 years and/or $15 million plus per year then Schenk says sayonara.

4 YEARS/$15M would be a fuggn bargain.  Schlenk would do a cart-wheel-and-sign in one motion if that was his offer sheet,

[Lurker]

I don't think you can sign and trade RFAs.

[hazer]

15 minutes ago, bumpyphish1 said:

Hawks don't "have Belinelli"--his only value to us is as a trade piece...

My bad, you're right, we don't have Belinelli ;)

[AHF]

1 hour ago, Lurker said:

I don't think you can sign and trade RFAs.

Pretty sure you can't sign and trade them after they have signed a sheet with someone else and you are facing a decision of whether to match or not.  Prior to them signing an offer with someone else, I am pretty sure they can be sign and traded.

[Alex]

On 6/27/2017 at 9:30 PM, wolvetigers said:

Are you serious? THJ, worked hard over the last 16months to buy into Bud's system and now he is 25years old and the 3rd leading scorer on the Hawks. And your answer is to trade him b/c you are not sold on him? Wake UP HAWKS FANS!!!

His career progression Arc (to date) is actually similar to Jimmy Butler from a numbers progression. Now Hardaway needs to continue to work on his defense, but him and Dennis in the backcourt could be very potent provided they continue to improve. The problem is we overpaid for Bazemore's energy but his skillset is no where near Hardaway's and Baze is two years older.

How will we ever be successful if we don't continue to grow and refine the talent we have in place. 

 

Homer much?

[Thomas]

15 minutes ago, Alex said:

Homer much?

Would you ask that if Tim was from MSU?

[BigDog90]

On 6/25/2017 at 5:17 PM, JTB said:

Now that the draft is over and we are heading to free agency the starting SG position is still a mystery unless we have a top priority in resigning THJ that us fans don't know about but as far as our other SGs go that are currently on the roster Baze, Bembry, our new rookie Tyler Dorsey I don't believe any are capable of being starters right now.

Further more looking ahead at this years 2017 free agency there aren't really any real options for starting SGs...the few out there aren't likely to sign with us other than THJ who I would consider the 3rd best SG in free agency available and though he's restricted the speculation is that the Hawks may or may not match an high offer that some believe THJ will get so that makes him even more of a target for teams that need a SG to go after.

A look at SGs available for 2017:

http://hoopshype.com/2017/06/15/nba-free-agency-2017-shooting-guards/

 

Moving on allow me to get to my point (I'm a long threaded poster, can't help it)....I titled this thread are we forced to sign or match THJ this off season because  after looking ahead at next years free agency 2018 I see that we are facing the same issue of not really having many capable starting SGs in free agency to sign (atleast I don't see them as starters). Avery Bradley is the best one that will be available if he doesn't receive some kind of extension. There's others that are intriguing coming off their rookie contracts but they are restricted and likely without a doubt will be resigning or matched by their current team.

 

https://www.hoopsrumors.com/2016/09/2018-nba-free-agents.html

The point is I see THJ more valuable than I originally thought! At first I just wanted him back...but looking ahead I think we NEED him back. And before someone says we'll just draft a starting SG remember that bud is known to not play rookies at any position. So we could be looking at acquiring starting SG long term if we let THJ walk.

I wouldn't pay him. He's going to be too expensive for ATL. He's a 6th man IMO. You can find that in FA. Bud needs to develop Bembry.