I think it's pretty fair to say that Luka is better than Trae and likely will always be better than Trae

[terrell]

6 hours ago, benhillboy said:

Luka’s IQ and the impossibility of speeding him up despite his mediocre athleticism is a joy to watch from a Larry Bird Stan.  Even the areas where Legend sets himself apart (rebounding, steals, FT shooting) Luka made significant strides from last season.
 

I love watching what Trae can do, hate watching the things he can’t.  Like keeping un-drafted players like Fred Van Fleet from acting like he’s a safety cone on defense.

HIm being undrafted means nothing. Hes a baller..

[terrell]

1 hour ago, NBASupes said:

Games like tonight highlight a major issue for Trae when he is going off. When he is going off. He dominates possession. We stop using Hunter and Cam. We start running everything through Trae. Trae eventually gets tired. The other two are cold, we lose. This is what was happening last year with Kevin/Baze and Prince as well. Prince turned himself into strongside 3pt specialist but this happened this time last year. Trae has to figure out, when he dominates the rock, he doesn't help the wings, he just hurts them. He needs to be more Nash/Curry and less Harden/Westbrook.

I think he will when he gets his guys back..

[NBASupes]

5 hours ago, terrell said:

I think he will when he gets his guys back..

Lol, he always done this, to Kevin, to Baze, and now add Cam and De'Andre to the list. I remember how many times I've heard fans say we need a secondary ball handler. But Cam and Hunter have that ability. As does Kevin and we are still saying it. This is one of the flaws Trae simply has to work on.

[benhillboy]

6 hours ago, terrell said:

HIm being undrafted means nothing. Hes a baller..

I’m fully aware of that, didn’t mean it as a slight to him.  The way he plays being undrafted serves as an obvious chip so it matters a lot, same with Nunn.

Edited November 26, 2019 by benhillboy

[Sothron]

I'm just glad the race-focused talk about Doncic has stopped on this site. I was proven right in spades about Doncic. I told you all before the draft he was a generational superstar talent. He's exactly that. Trae is a superstar but he's not quite as good as Doncic. The difference between the two is where Cam Reddish winds up as a player in terms of who won the trade. 

Doncic is legit amazing. 

[AtLaS]

On 11/24/2019 at 10:34 PM, NBASupes said:

That's not a knock on Travis. I hated the trade at that time but like I said a couple of days ago to Hots. The trade was saved by the availability of Cam Reddish who really determines who won the deal. 

Luka is a top 5 player for the next 15-20 years. 

Trae is a top 10  player for the next 15-20 years. 

There is a clear gap. Mainly due to defense and off the ball skills for Luka. On the ball, I actually think Trae is better and likely will always be better. 

Cam Reddish will decide who won the trade. His potential is as low as a B- to as high as an A+ which is higher than Trae's. If he becomes a B- long term which is the level of current Aron Baynes and John Collins. We lost that deal. 

If Cam is a B+ which is current Trae Young. It was a draw with a slight edge to whoever has the better team long term. If Cam is an A- which is Jimmy Butler current level, an A which is Luka's current level as well as Dame Lillard, or an A+ which is guys like Harden, AD, and PG13, we won that deal by a mile. Even if Luka is the next MJ, you can't trade Hakeem and Magic Johnson for him and win that trade. Not possible. Cam's potential is everything for that deal. Otherwise, as of right now, Trae is a B+, Cam is a D+ and Luka is an A. We are losing the deal and badly I should add. 

That said, Hunter just moved up to a C+ in my book and that means we traded him for Hayes (C-), NAW (D+), a 2nd who's in Aussieland (unranked) and a CLE 1st which is looking like two 2nds. If Hunter keeps improving at this rate as well as a two way wing, Travis might win this trade like the Falcons won the Julio trade. A sum of parts don't equal an whole monster. 

Travis is losing the Omari trade which was: Omari for Jones and a future 2026 2nd rounder. 

Travis is currently losing the Solo Hill/Plumlee for Parsons trade. 

He might not be Ferry in terms of trades where Ferry was winning them by substantial margins. 

 

I hate Lukastans with a passion but Luka Doncic. That's a bad mothafucka

 

Here's the way I look at it.  Luka is also playing better than nearly the entire NBA.  He might be the MVP this year.  Regardless, we should look at the positive side here and be glad that we got Trae who is a superstar and will be a top 5 player for many years, IMO.

 

Trae is the best player that we have ever had (no offense to Nique).  That gives us a building block that we've never had.  I think Schlenk wants to accumulate/evaluate as much talent as possible, which gives us the ability to make moves in the future to build a contender around Trae.  We will have young assets and picks to trade for guys like Beal, Steven Adams, KAT, Embiid, etc as some will eventually become disgruntled.  Just using those guys as an example, it could be anyone else.  Players will want to play with Trae.  

 

Just think if we had Beal/Adams on this team, then Collins returns.  We are a contender this year IMO.

Doncic is just in a better position right now because his team has already traded for vets that help them win now.  With Dallas' roster, Trae has them in the playoffs as well.  If you want to compare current situations, just look at the Mavs post KP trade last year.  Trae has ZERO help right now.  That is all about to change.

Edited November 26, 2019 by AtLaS

[terrell]

6 hours ago, NBASupes said:

Lol, he always done this, to Kevin, to Baze, and now add Cam and De'Andre to the list. I remember how many times I've heard fans say we need a secondary ball handler. But Cam and Hunter have that ability. As does Kevin and we are still saying it. This is one of the flaws Trae simply has to work on.

Cam can barely dribble most of the time. lol. And HUnter isnt that great at ball handling either..

[NBASupes]

Just now, terrell said:

Cam can barely dribble most of the time. lol. And HUnter isnt that great at ball handling either..

Not true. Cam is one of our best at generating space from nothing. Cam issue is exclusive to finishing, handling traffic wisely, pacing himself in traffic and shooting. His ball handling is excellent for his size.

[terrell]

4 hours ago, Sothron said:

I'm just glad the race-focused talk about Doncic has stopped on this site. I was proven right in spades about Doncic. I told you all before the draft he was a generational superstar talent. He's exactly that. Trae is a superstar but he's not quite as good as Doncic. The difference between the two is where Cam Reddish winds up as a player in terms of who won the trade. 

Doncic is legit amazing. 

Race-focused? REally? THats sad..If you can ball, you can ball..I do wonder if race played a role in the Hawks GM and ownership passing on him. I still cant believe they did, as much as I like Trae..

Edited November 26, 2019 by terrell

[Sothron]

1 minute ago, terrell said:

Race-focused? REally? THats sad..If you can ball, you can ball..

If the mods didn't delete the posts back then there were several posters on this site that said flat out Doncic wasn't going to be good because he was white. No other justification given besides skin color. I am so, so glad that Doncic being a MVP this season in only his second season (and remember, he's younger than Young) must have those posters TRIGGERED like mad.

[HawkItus]

When you really think about the difference to me is size.  If Trae was Luka's size he'd be just as good, maybe better.  Trae doing what he does at his size just confirms how talented he really is.

[terrell]

Please name 1? Thats crazy..And Im as black as can be..lol. Perhaps they said because he was European? And tEuroleague players are usually not as good in the NBA as they were overseas, or something like that? 

Edited November 26, 2019 by terrell

[NBASupes]

Just now, terrell said:

PLease name 1? Thats crazy..And IM as black as can be..lol

I remember foolishness being said during that draft thread. I got warned multiple times going at KB21 neck because I thought JJJ was Marvin Williams  Jr. 

[terrell]

3 minutes ago, NBASupes said:

I remember foolishness being said during that draft thread. I got warned multiple times going at KB21 neck because I thought JJJ was Marvin Williams  Jr. 

Its fair to say Euroleague players usually dont translate. But to say he s gonna suck just because hes white is ridiculous. I havent seen any comment like that..I thought he was Slovenian btw. lol

Edited November 26, 2019 by terrell

[terrell]

UGA getting spanked. Damn. Is Anthony EDwards really the #2 prospect? I didnt see much. But its just one game Ive seen of him.

[bleachkit]

There aren't many examples of a small ball dominant point guard leading their team in points on championship teams. Isaiah Thomas is the only one I can think of. Trae is a lot of fun to watch, but I'm not sure we have a winning formula long term.

[NBASupes]

Just now, terrell said:

Its fair to say Euroleague players usually dont translate. But to say he s gonna suck just because hes white is ridiculous. I havent seen any comment like that..

That was a passionate period. People had their likes and dislikes. Trae wasn't my guy literally till the last couple of days. Ask @Spud2nique

My guy was Bagley

After that, it was Doncic and Bamba. I got in on Trae late. I didn't like the games I saw but once I had time to really watch him, I was like, his ceiling is too high and higher than Luka but his floor is too low. 

Once Bagley was gone, I became team Luka as Dennis was doing something dumb again and I was done with him and I watched Real Madrid and felt he was going to be a star. Can't lie, I didn't see this. If I did, Bagley would not have been my top guy

2 minutes ago, terrell said:

UGA getting spanked. Damn. Is Anthony EDwards really the #2 prospect? I didnt see much. But its just one game Ive seen of him.

Hard to tell. There is no spacing or organization 

[AHF]

1 minute ago, bleachkit said:

There aren't many examples of a small ball dominant point guard leading their team in points on championship teams. Isaiah Thomas is the only one I can think of. Trae is a lot of fun to watch, but I'm not sure we have a winning formula long term.

I do think the window is much more open for that today than it was for most of the NBA's history.  The hand checking rules and zone defenses have changed how offenses flow to put a much greater emphasis on guard play.  I'd include Steph Curry on the list of championship leaders from a ball dominant point guard.  

[NBASupes]

3 minutes ago, bleachkit said:

There aren't many examples of a small ball dominant point guard leading their team in points on championship teams. Isaiah Thomas is the only one I can think of. Trae is a lot of fun to watch, but I'm not sure we have a winning formula long term.

Zeke won on every level too. St. Joes, Indiana, and Detroit. Trae only won with the EYBL team. Trae needs so much development 

[terrell]

4 minutes ago, bleachkit said:

There aren't many examples of a small ball dominant point guard leading their team in points on championship teams. Isaiah Thomas is the only one I can think of. Trae is a lot of fun to watch, but I'm not sure we have a winning formula long term.

Steph....We gonna have to find another star or bring one in..I think thats the plan..