Official Game Thread: Hawks at Pistons

[Dexmethylphenidate]

9 hours ago, NBASupes said:

This team is what it is

You never know. They could be like the Braves and took off after they get over 0.500. Braves were in a similar situation and couldn't do shit until they get over 0.500 late in the season.

[shakes]

9 hours ago, Sothron said:

There is no excuse for that loss tonight. None. We literally handed that game away. One of Trae's worst shooting games and other than Bogi no one else really stepped up. 

Bogi?  Are you kidding me?  I'm so sick of all this Bogi love just cause he hits a few shots.    Aside from Trae's terrible game, Bogi 100% cost us the game with his non stop boneheaded plays on the defensive end.   First, a minute left and we have an amazing defensive possession guarding Cade.  Force him into a tough shot which he misses.  Bogi boxes his man out underneath perfectly and the ball drops to his feet.  But, instead of grabbing the ball he inexplicably taps it right into the hands of a Detroit player 4 feet from the basket who lays it in.  Bogi responds with his typical textbook Bogi move of putting both his hands on his head in woah is me fashion.

 

fast forward to the end of the game and we have a 1 point lead with 2 seconds left.  What does Bogi do?  Commit an idiotic foul 20 feet from the basket vs a player not even facing the basket..sends him to the line to tie the game up.

 

Let's also not forget the first quarter when this moron tried to commit his famous take foul on a player at the free throw line and instead commits and an 1 three point play.   And of course we get the hands on the head again.

 

I hope they do a Bogi bobblehead and it's him with his hands on his head.

 

Worst defensive player I've ever seen in the NBA.  Makes Trae look like Gary Payton.

 

[shakes]

2 hours ago, bleachkit said:

The question remains, how do we win when Trae has an off night? Usually we don't have much of an answer.

well, for starters, Trae needs to recognize when he is dog shit and look to create for others.

 

The problem with the game today was Trae hit his first 2-3 shots including 2 tough 3's.  He then fell in love with the 3 and started settling for step backs every time he got the big on a mismatch.   For a smart player he somehow never recognized this and made an adjustment.

[Diesel]

9 hours ago, Sothron said:

 All JC had to do was hit two free throws with 1.6 left in regulation and we walk out with a win. 

I would be there with you.  But this is JC's second game back and it was his first free throws of the game.  I was actually shocked that he hit the second one.   There was a lot of pressure on those FTs... I know that they get paid Millions of Dollars to do it but to hit FTs with no rhythm is very hard.   Remember, we had not gone to JC the whole qtr... He was on the floor but he was just about as cold as a fish.   That was a big pressure make.  I don't blame him that much for the miss. 

But had Bogi not fouled Cade, we'd be walking out with a win also. 

Or Had Trae hit both of his free throws before.. we'd be walking out with a win.

or had ...

Like I say, there are enough little things to go around.   No need focusing on one. 

[Diesel]

9 minutes ago, shakes said:

well, for starters, Trae needs to recognize when he is dog shit and look to create for others.

 

The problem with the game today was Trae hit his first 2-3 shots including 2 tough 3's.  He then fell in love with the 3 and started settling for step backs every time he got the big on a mismatch.   For a smart player he somehow never recognized this and made an adjustment.

For the most part I agree with this take.  I don't think it's that he fell in love with the three... Detroit did a good job of keeping a big on him.   Usually bigs back off of Trae because in a foot race, Trae can beat them and get an easy layin.  Well, Dwayne Casey is not new to coaching,   he put these long armed beasts on Trae (Bagley, Stewart, Cunningham) so that even if Trae get a step on them, they are long enough to block him from behind.  Early in the game it was Stewart... Trae danced on Stewart.   Hit those two tough threes and got an easy layup.   Later it was a mixture of Cunningham and Bagley.. mostly Bagley.  I wish that Trae would have taken Bagley off the dribble more and used a pick to create enough space to head to the basket...  Bagley is not so smart.   I think he could have gotten him into foul trouble.  Instead, Trae tried what had worked on Stewart. 

I can hear Casey command to his team... don't give Trae an open look.   And Trae never had one.   You said that Trae has to get everybody else involved.. well he had 12 assists.  For any other PG.. that's a good day.  We just hold Trae to a much higher standard. 

I think it's incumbent on Nate to put in better offensive plays.  We need some plays that lead to scores for JC and some plays that give Trae more movement.

The problem is the 1-5 PNR usually leaves the 4 out.   I watched some of the highlights from Philly vs. Chicago... and even in the games that I have watched of theirs since they got the beard...  Philly doesn't use their 4 at all anymore.  It's the effect of the 1-5 PNR.  I know we have a 1-4 PNR and a 2-4 PNR... we need to employ some of those and also set up some screen plays...  Like I keep saying, I would love to see JC come off a curl.  With his efficiency, I believe he can be dangerous (if he can hit a midrange shot while moving).  JC and Trae should be watching those old school KG pop out plays. 

[Spud2nique]

Pretty disappointing to play down or play around with a lesser opponent and take a bad L like that. 
 

We can’t drop those games. This is the stretch run, we have to come out with a better game plan and bury teams like that. They Pistons play hard but they make mistakes, and we don’t take advantage of those.

Trae had an off night but we need the rest of the guys to step up and get the W when our superstar has an off night. It happens.

Lets bounce back,

Bucks next,

Go Hawks!

 

[Spud2nique]

10 hours ago, Diesel said:

We would not have even had an appearance by Hots.

I thought it was plainview now?  

Agreed though, we wouldn’t be having these convos but we should have beaten those clowns by 20 with some good ole execution.

I know there are 82 games and you have to get a little creative in drawing game plans, luckily for us, apparently Nate doesn’t believe in a game plan.

GO GETTEM GUYS…-Nate’s game plan 

[Atlantaholic]

12 hours ago, terrell said:

3 after Milwaukee..

They've played Milwaukee very well and Bucks are coming off a back to back. Wouldn't surprise me at all if they won that one then lost the next two against Clips and Pacers

[Spud2nique]

2 hours ago, REHawksFan said:

Hawks are 4-8 when Trae scores 20 pts or less

 

We go as he goes. We need a solid #2 that can get his own. @JayBirdHawk been sayin it for a min. 
 

I guess that guy is Bogi now.

[Diesel]

7 minutes ago, Spud2nique said:

Pretty disappointing to play down or play around with a lesser opponent and take a bad L like that. 
 

We can’t drop those games. This is the stretch run, we have to come out with a better game plan and bury teams like that. They Pistons play hard but they make mistakes, and we don’t take advantage of those.

Trae had an off night but we need the rest of the guys to step up and get the W when our superstar has an off night. It happens.

Lets bounce back,

Bucks next,

Go Hawks!

 

I've been a Hawks fan for a long time... I have seen us have teams that played down to the level of the competition.   I don't think this was that.  I think Detroit has a team that is young and well coached... When I say well coached, I think that their coach gives them a good game plan.  Do they have the talent to carry it out... some.   They are about one player away from being a playoff team.   Right now Cunningham is no longer a rookie and he's playing very good.  He's Grant Hill Smooth.   So I don't think it's a case of us playing down so much.. I think they overachieved more than we played down.  If you look at our game... we made little mistakes.  It's the same little mistakes that we always make and they took advantage of them.   Also, Trae didn't have a great game. 

I think a better way to characterize it is that we made mistakes and they played well over their head. 

 

[kg01]

12 minutes ago, Spud2nique said:

Pretty disappointing to play down or play around with a lesser opponent and take a bad L like that. 
 

We can’t drop those games. This is the stretch run, we have to come out with a better game plan and bury teams like that. They Pistons play hard but they make mistakes, and we don’t take advantage of those.

Trae had an off night but we need the rest of the guys to step up and get the W when our superstar has an off night. It happens.

Lets bounce back,

Bucks next,

Go Hawks!

 

I'm just waiting to see which direction the Trae-ters go in.

Do they lean into the bad game, saying he ain't that great and he needs to take a backset to (insert whoever)?

Or do they shy away, recognizing this was 'the' moment for the teammates to carry us to a win like the Trae-ters say they can?

[Diesel]

8 minutes ago, Spud2nique said:

I thought it was plainview now?  

Agreed though, we wouldn’t be having these convos but we should have beaten those clowns by 20 with some good ole execution.

I know there are 82 games and you have to get a little creative in drawing game plans, luckily for us, apparently Nate doesn’t believe in a game plan.

GO GETTEM GUYS…-Nate’s game plan 

Nawl... This Detroit team is different. 

They have only been beaten by 20+ 4 times..

Phoneix, Chicago, Milwaukee,  and Sacramento...  And they have avenged all of those losses.

And last time, we beat them by 18.. and they just beat us. 

They're record may be 18-47... but they are in every game they play...  If they make the right moves, in the next few years, they will be a team to watch. 

 

[Spud2nique]

2 minutes ago, kg01 said:

I'm just waiting to see which direction the Trae-ters go in.

If history is any indication.. then oh boooyyyyyy..

[kg01]

2 minutes ago, Diesel said:

Nawl... This Detroit team is different. 

They have only been beaten by 20+ 4 times..

Phoneix, Chicago, Milwaukee,  and Sacramento...  And they have avenged all of those losses.

And last time, we beat them by 18.. and they just beat us. 

They're record may be 18-47... but they are in every game they play...  If they make the right moves, in the next few years, they will be a team to watch. 

Nah, they gonna fire Casey and start all the way over.  I wouldn't take current results and extrapolate them for that team.

I do agree though that they are ... I won't say "better" than their record but, as you stated, they are a team that actually tries.  You have to beat them, they're not gonna lay down for you - incidentally, that's the exact type of team we simply don't consistently beat.

[Spud2nique]

9 minutes ago, Diesel said:

He's Grant Hill Smooth. 

They keep comparing the two, I don’t see it. Grant was an above the rim player. Cunningham isn’t nearly as explosive or at least doesn’t play like it.

Ya, I’ve been a Hawks fan for a min too, I’ve noticed over the years, even when we are a more talented team, there are nights that we just go through the motions. I guess the same can be said if you ask other fan bases about their teams as well,

We just aren’t and haven’t been the franchise that blows teams out. 
 

No matter how well coached, Killian Hayes and Cunningham should not be beating us  at this stage of their careers.

 

[Spud2nique]

The NBA 2 min report is in for those interested.

It states that:

The game should have been won by the Hawks because..

KILLIAN HAYES PALMS THE BALL WHEN HE DRIBBLES! THAT AIN’T BASKETBALL! -  

Its true Nique, he doesn’t even do it smooth like Iverson, he full on palms it.

I hate it when they say the ref will adjust to the player’s game! NO! THE PLAYER ISNT DRIBBLING THE BALL. He’s cheater and he’s a cheater!!!! 
 

I digress…

[Diesel]

19 minutes ago, kg01 said:

Nah, they gonna fire Casey and start all the way over.  I wouldn't take current results and extrapolate them for that team.

I do agree though that they are ... I won't say "better" than their record but, as you stated, they are a team that actually tries.  You have to beat them, they're not gonna lay down for you - incidentally, that's the exact type of team we simply don't consistently beat.

Yeah... the funny thing about last night is that I circled this game as going to be a tough one... and when we couldn't get separation in the 2nd quarter, I started to worry.   I was actually hoping that we would have left Lou and the 2nd unit out there a little longer because the ball movement always messes up opponents because our opponents plan for a ball dominant first unit.  but unfortunately Nate didn't stick with the whole second unit.   I understand it.. because you don't want the first unit to get cold and somehow they should be conditioned to these timed substitutions.  It's anti-playstation coaching.   These playstation coaches believes that you can substitute anybody at anytime and they can perform.  They think that every players comes in as vinny Johnson.   The idea of consistent timed substitutions completely goes over their heads.   Nate left Williams in for a little longer than his time but the chemistry between Williams and the first unit isn't the same as what he has with the second unit.   That's why it's a dumb argument that was had about Bogi as a reserve and Bogi as a starter and we saw it last night. 

Last Night Bogi didn't Bogi reserve stuff while he was out there with the starters and it ruined our 4th quarter.  with the 2nd unit, it's fine if Bogi comes down and takes the shot.   Those other guys don't need the ball as much.   However, the first unit doesn't operate the same way.   When you start doing that with the first unit, you move the first unit into a iso team.   And we suck at iso teaming.   I'd rather see us flop at the 1-5 PNR than to see us devolve into the iso team.   IsoJoe is not walking through that door. 

But they shouldn't fire Casey... He has these guys well prepared every night.   If they do.. maybe he can come over and help Nate.

 

 

 

[kg01]

17 minutes ago, Spud2nique said:

The NBA 2 min report is in for those interested.

It states that:

The game should have been won by the Hawks because..

KILLIAN HAYES PALMS THE BALL WHEN HE DRIBBLES! THAT AIN’T BASKETBALL! -  

Its true Nique, he doesn’t even do it smooth like Iverson, he full on palms it.

I hate it when they say the ref will adjust to the player’s game! NO! THE PLAYER ISNT DRIBBLING THE BALL. He’s cheater and he’s a cheater!!!! 
 

I digress…

And don't give me the whole 'everybody does it' stuff.  Nah, that kid can't dribble.  It's one thing to kinda get away with it.  What he does is literally let the ball rest in his palm, then put it back down.  That's a violation.

And, before anyone gets into their feewings, no that's not why we lost.  Just making an observation.

... and another thing, I'm sorta sick of bad shooting teams turning into Steph Curr .. Dale Ellis against us.  The janky kid with the bad hair, Lighty or w/e it is.  Dude had no 3's all game, turns into Ray Allen against us.  And don't give me the Trae Young can't defend thing.  Dude was clearly giving effort on that end.  It ain't all him.

And, nobody tell Cyde I said this, but my guy Bogd has gotta do a better job on D.  He's better than he's given credit for but last night was a series of poor choices.  STFU Cyde!

[Spud2nique]

1 minute ago, kg01 said:

Dale Ellis

 my man! (You and Dale) 

[kg01]

2 minutes ago, Diesel said:

Yeah... the funny thing about last night is that I circled this game as going to be a tough one... and when we couldn't get separation in the 2nd quarter, I started to worry.   I was actually hoping that we would have left Lou and the 2nd unit out there a little longer because the ball movement always messes up opponents because our opponents plan for a ball dominant first unit.  but unfortunately Nate didn't stick with the whole second unit.   I understand it.. because you don't want the first unit to get cold and somehow they should be conditioned to these timed substitutions.  It's anti-playstation coaching.   These playstation coaches believes that you can substitute anybody at anytime and they can perform.  They think that every players comes in as vinny Johnson.   The idea of consistent timed substitutions completely goes over their heads.   Nate left Williams in for a little longer than his time but the chemistry between Williams and the first unit isn't the same as what he has with the second unit.   That's why it's a dumb argument that was had about Bogi as a reserve and Bogi as a starter and we saw it last night. 

Last Night Bogi didn't Bogi reserve stuff while he was out there with the starters and it ruined our 4th quarter.  with the 2nd unit, it's fine if Bogi comes down and takes the shot.   Those other guys don't need the ball as much.   However, the first unit doesn't operate the same way.   When you start doing that with the first unit, you move the first unit into a iso team.   And we suck at iso teaming.   I'd rather see us flop at the 1-5 PNR than to see us devolve into the iso team.   IsoJoe is not walking through that door. 

But they shouldn't fire Casey... He has these guys well prepared every night.   If they do.. maybe he can come over and help Nate.

Don't get me wrong, I don't think they should fire him either.  I'm saying that's what I think they will do.

I hear you on Bogd but I think the issue was simply Trae being off.  And them going away from Collins, which was a fatal error, had nothing to do with Bogd early-shot taking imho.

Plus I'm now a Bogd bot-account so I'm programmed to fend off all Bogd attackers so TIFWIW.