The Mega Super Rumor Thread (Part 2)

[JTB]

@NBASupes has your guy heard anything on this potential deal for #4 pick ?

"John Collins could be a catalyst for a major draft-day trade, potentially in a package with Kevin Huerter that would net Atlanta the No. 4 pick in the draft." (via @DraftExpress)

 

I’m assuming that would be JC + Huerter + 16th pick to Kings for #4 pick. I would be surprised if the Kings don’t see that as value for the 4th pick if this was offered.

[Peoriabird]

5 hours ago, Threezus said:

Theirs very little i wouldn't give up for Murray to pair with Trae.  I agree he is the perfect partner in crime you could ask for on what we need. 

Then go find your Murray in the draft...this does not appear to be a problem for other teams except the Hawks. The list is endless of guards or players in general who were taken late in the 1st and even in the 2nd round in some cases who Hawks fans would give up serious assets to acquire

[bleachkit]

4 hours ago, RedDawg#8 said:

Ya know, Cam Reddish is exactly the type of wing prospect we need next to Trae. Long, can defend, handles the rock, can shoot…. someone like him would be perfect.

Sucks it costs so much to trade up for a guy like that in this draft. I sure wish we had the lottery luck to select a talented wing with star potential in the top 10 to run next to Trae.

Maybe one day we will be so fortunate. Maybe it will only cost us a starting caliber veteran. That’s the price of doing business when you want to find talent. 

No use developing your own players unless you plan to trade them for more draft picks. That’s always been my motto.

Well he's constantly hurt, he's inconsistent and he wants a big contract. 

Edited June 22, 2022 by bleachkit

[NBASupes]

2 hours ago, JTB said:

@NBASupes has your guy heard anything on this potential deal for #4 pick ?

"John Collins could be a catalyst for a major draft-day trade, potentially in a package with Kevin Huerter that would net Atlanta the No. 4 pick in the draft." (via @DraftExpress)

 

I’m assuming that would be JC + Huerter + 16th pick to Kings for #4 pick. I would be surprised if the Kings don’t see that as value for the 4th pick if this was offered.

Yeah but it's not what the Kings want. Even if we move up to 8th, they want Sharpe, Mathurin, or Murray who won't be there. 

[theheroatl]

Kings are just playing their asset cards. I bet they don't draft at all first round if they can sell their pick for 2-3 good to great vets and a future first round.

[SerbianHawk]

2 hours ago, JTB said:

@NBASupes has your guy heard anything on this potential deal for #4 pick ?

"John Collins could be a catalyst for a major draft-day trade, potentially in a package with Kevin Huerter that would net Atlanta the No. 4 pick in the draft." (via @DraftExpress)

 

I’m assuming that would be JC + Huerter + 16th pick to Kings for #4 pick. I would be surprised if the Kings don’t see that as value for the 4th pick if this was offered.

This is crazy. Two core players (and the only reliable offensive players except Trae) and a pick for an 4th pick in a bad draft can end up being one of the worst moves ever.  I don't understand what they are thinking.

[Final_quest]

I'm a fan of John Collins.  The actual game impact is where I am struggling. 

He played in 54 games last season.  Our net rating was 0.5 in the games he played and ORTG was 115.1, but the 28 games he missed our net rating was 3.7 and ORTG was 121.5.  We were 24-13 in the games he missed.  Since 2020 we are 60-57 in the games he played.  

When I see trades that seem inequitable, we have to keep in mind part of that is shedding the salary to make another move down the line.  So we might not be better off initially moving Collins, but moving him also might not hurt us.  This could be a sell high moment with Collins.    

[theheroatl]

John has high value now.. would be the right time to trade him for the best value returning (#4 pick or a quality vet starter). If not you risk more downside than upside.

[sturt]

11 minutes ago, Final_quest said:

I'm a fan of John Collins.  The actual game impact is where I am struggling. 

He played in 54 games last season.  Our net rating was 0.5 in the games he played and ORTG was 115.1, but the 28 games he missed our net rating was 3.7 and ORTG was 121.5.  We were 24-13 in the games he missed.  Since 2020 we are 60-57 in the games he played.  

 

Not hard to explain. Just have to be willing to ascend to the thought that when there's only 5 players on a team, the weakest link on the floor has a huge impact on the outcome... 20%.

22 of the 54 games were Gumbo Hawks games.

And those 28 games? All Real Hawks games. All of them.

 

(29-ish other teams understand his impact. Here's hoping that in Hawks FO they get that, too.)

[txsting]

7 hours ago, Sothron said:

I would give up OO to get Murray from SAS. He's a perfect fit to Trae. He can defend, shoot and pass.

all day

[theheroatl]

Now's the time when teams try really hard to dispose of their trash (when the stove is hot):

Gordon Hayward
Tobias Harris
Russell Westbrook
John Wall

[bleachkit]

3 minutes ago, theheroatl said:

Now's the time when teams try really hard to dispose of their trash (when the stove is hot):

Gordon Hayward
Tobias Harris
Russell Westbrook
John Wall

Hayward and Harris have value, just overpaid. Westbrook and Wall are toxic, at least basketball wise. 

[NBASupes]

3 minutes ago, bleachkit said:

Hayward and Harris have value, just overpaid. Westbrook and Wall are toxic, at least basketball wise. 

Way overpaid 

[JeffS17]

9 hours ago, TheNorthCydeRises said:

 

The advanced metrics with those 3 on the floor together, definitely support that.

The odd man out, is the wing that we're betting on to be very good . . . and that's De'Andre Hunter.

He's the guy who some of the other guys don't play as well with.  Why?

Because he doesn't make anyone else better on the floor.  And his defensive impact is average at best. 

A 10.6 PER .  . a -3.9 BPM . . and a end of the bench-like WS/48 number of just .034 . . . means that De'Andre Hunter was NOT an impact player for the Hawks.

But he did have this game.  And like in Texas-hold'em poker, I guess we're going All-In on what he showed here.

 

 

But also like in poker, this is like going All-In, when the 2 cards in your hand are the 4 and 6 of clubs.   If you don't get 3 more clubs on the flop, turn, and river to get you a flush, those 2 cards are going to get you nothing.

 

9 hours ago, Spud2nique said:

@Sothron these were the other jerseys I took pics of.

Got the Grind for my Memphis friend bday comin up. Don’t tell him it was half off! Or I just 60% I used some old sales skills to sweet talk the guy down $10 .

 

Reggie Theus jersey colors were awesome BUT, that guy was one of my most hated Hawks of all time.

Mutombo Nuggs was and Smitty was nice too.

Man, I love jersey’s to death I really do. I wanna have by the time I’m  

SMH why mutombo on the BOGO rack?!?!

7 hours ago, Spud2nique said:

This. OO is the man, just watch this year. He’s gonna earn a ton more fans.

@Spud2nique my fellow OO truther 

57 minutes ago, Final_quest said:

I'm a fan of John Collins.  The actual game impact is where I am struggling. 

He played in 54 games last season.  Our net rating was 0.5 in the games he played and ORTG was 115.1, but the 28 games he missed our net rating was 3.7 and ORTG was 121.5.  We were 24-13 in the games he missed.  Since 2020 we are 60-57 in the games he played.  

When I see trades that seem inequitable, we have to keep in mind part of that is shedding the salary to make another move down the line.  So we might not be better off initially moving Collins, but moving him also might not hurt us.  This could be a sell high moment with Collins.    

JC on paper is the perfect modern NBA player.  He's probably an elite third option on a championship caliber team, but he has some weaknesses that hurt pretty bad in the playoffs.  He got absolutely bodied throughout the entire Bucks series as he's just too small at his position to handle anyone in the Bucks frontcourt.  And I'm not talking about Giannis, he was getting outworked and bullied by Bobby Porter, Lopez, and even PJ Tucker was getting boards around him.  I feel like this is fixable if he puts on weight but he's going into year 6 and he's already got busted for PEDs, so idk. 

If we can trade JC to open up cap space to acquire another star level player AND secure a top talent that will be on a rookie scale deal for 4 years, I'm for the trade.  The team clearly needs a shakeup and JCs top attribute as an elite PnR partner isn't even being utilized right now with Capela being the primary.  Shipping him out makes sense if we're going to plug him in the corner to be a spot up 3 guy and accept his mediocre defense in an important position

[Final_quest]

41 minutes ago, sturt said:

 

Not hard to explain. Just have to be willing to ascend to the thought that when there's only 5 players on a team, the weakest link on the floor has a huge impact on the outcome... 20%.

22 of the 54 games were Gumbo Hawks games.

And those 28 games? All Real Hawks games. All of them.

 

(29-ish other teams understand his impact. Here's hoping that in Hawks FO they get that, too.)

I could be convinced.  Even in your example you make a case that “Real Hawks games” don’t necessarily include Collins.  If they don’t need Collins to win games, why shouldn’t we trade him?  

[NBASupes]

8 minutes ago, JeffS17 said:

 

SMH why mutombo on the BOGO rack?!?!

@Spud2nique my fellow OO truther 

JC on paper is the perfect modern NBA player.  He's probably an elite third option on a championship caliber team, but he has some weaknesses that hurt pretty bad in the playoffs.  He got absolutely bodied throughout the entire Bucks series as he's just too small at his position to handle anyone in the Bucks frontcourt.  And I'm not talking about Giannis, he was getting outworked and bullied by Bobby Porter, Lopez, and even PJ Tucker was getting boards around him.  I feel like this is fixable if he puts on weight but he's going into year 6 and he's already got busted for PEDs, so idk. 

If we can trade JC to open up cap space to acquire another star level player AND secure a top talent that will be on a rookie scale deal for 4 years, I'm for the trade.  The team clearly needs a shakeup and JCs top attribute as an elite PnR partner isn't even being utilized right now with Capela being the primary.  Shipping him out makes sense if we're going to plug him in the corner to be a spot up 3 guy and accept his mediocre defense in an important position

JC only guards one position, that's not modern NBA ball. Ya'll love offense so much but at that position, defense is most important unless you elite on offense like a Dirk type. JC trade value is good. He's very good but you can see by Kevin having a better chance at getting us a top 10 pick in this draft that his lack of being a modern NBA big man on DEFENSE is his Achilles heel and not everyone wants that. Almost all of the teams most interested in him are non-playoff teams. Whereas most of the teams interested in Capela are playoff teams. 

[Spud2nique]

Heating up with Ayton!

 

. 

[theheroatl]

https://www.sltrib.com/sports/jazz/2022/06/22/chicago-bulls-atlanta/

Jazz beat writer seems to think the Jazz-Hawks deal is better than what's out there. I doubt Chicago includes Williams anyway so it's a non-starter. Williams has a ton of potential since he is incredibly young.

Edited June 22, 2022 by theheroatl

[nathan2331]

2 minutes ago, NBASupes said:

JC only guards one position, that's not modern NBA ball. Ya'll love offense so much but at that position, defense is most important unless you elite on offense like a Dirk type. JC trade value is good. He's very good but you can see by Kevin having a better chance at getting us a top 10 pick in this draft that his lack of being a modern NBA big man on DEFENSE is his Achilles heel and not everyone wants that. Almost all of the teams most interested in him are non-playoff teams. Whereas most of the teams interested in Capela are playoff teams. 

JC is not constantly getting killed on switches though. The criticsim would be valid if he was consistently getting targeted but that doesn't happen. Our perimeter players are consistenly failing to do their defensive jobs, and no forward or center can change that.

[Peoriabird]

1 hour ago, Final_quest said:

I'm a fan of John Collins.  The actual game impact is where I am struggling. 

He played in 54 games last season.  Our net rating was 0.5 in the games he played and ORTG was 115.1, but the 28 games he missed our net rating was 3.7 and ORTG was 121.5.  We were 24-13 in the games he missed.  Since 2020 we are 60-57 in the games he played.  

When I see trades that seem inequitable, we have to keep in mind part of that is shedding the salary to make another move down the line.  So we might not be better off initially moving Collins, but moving him also might not hurt us.  This could be a sell high moment with Collins.    

They don't feature the guy! This should be obvious to Hawk fans by now.