Marvin = Capable of more

[txsting]

Let me start a wild Marvin thread for once.

To me, the most valid point anywhere in the other thread is that Marvin exists as a 3rd or 4th option in the offense, whereas a guy like Deng is at least one spot up in the pecking order on his team. I submit that Marvin plays his role well, and has shown he can step up when others are down.

To wit, I gathered Marvin's stats for each game in which at least one of JJ, MB, or JS were out or were held to 5 points or less. That gave me 24 games to work with, a pretty decent sample. Marvin's scoring average in those 24 games = 16.5ppg! Or, basically the same as Deng.

I bet some of his other numbers are better as well, but I'll let anyone else who has time take a shot at that.

[set of games I used: November 9,11,12,14,15,18,19,22,26,28,29; December 10; January 25,26,28; February 4,6,7,11,23,25,27; March 4; April 14]

Edited July 24, 2009 by txsting

[Peoriabird]

Let me start a wild Marvin thread for once.

To me, the most valid point anywhere in the other thread is that Marvin exists as a 3rd or 4th option in the offense, whereas a guy like Deng is at least one spot up in the pecking order on his team. I submit that Marvin plays his role well, and has shown he can step up when others are down.

To wit, I gathered Marvin's stats for each game in which at least one of JJ, MB, or JS were out or were held to 5 points or less. That gave me 24 games to work with, a pretty decent sample. Marvin's scoring average in those 24 games = 16.5ppg! Or, basically the same as Deng.

I bet some of his other numbers are better as well, but I'll let anyone else who has time take a shot at that.

[set of games I used: November 9,11,12,14,15,18,19,22,26,28,29; December 10; January 25,26,28; February 4,6,7,11,23,25,27; March 4; April 14]

Scoring isn't everything!

[Admin]

Scoring isn't everything!

That's the only metric where Marvin didn't measure up to the numbers that Diesel placed on Marvin for this season so I can certainly see where Sting is coming from with this post.

And with that said thanks for putting in the work on this Sting. I'm sure it will be picked apart by some but will be understood by most.

[biscuit]

Marvin does his job, peroid. He can score but i think he is more of a team player, marvin is good for this team, yes he can score..if he is needed but thats why we have other players like JJ,bibby,etc. not every player going going to be a star player!!!

[exodus]

Let me start a wild Marvin thread for once.

To me, the most valid point anywhere in the other thread is that Marvin exists as a 3rd or 4th option in the offense, whereas a guy like Deng is at least one spot up in the pecking order on his team. I submit that Marvin plays his role well, and has shown he can step up when others are down.

To wit, I gathered Marvin's stats for each game in which at least one of JJ, MB, or JS were out or were held to 5 points or less. That gave me 24 games to work with, a pretty decent sample. Marvin's scoring average in those 24 games = 16.5ppg! Or, basically the same as Deng.

I bet some of his other numbers are better as well, but I'll let anyone else who has time take a shot at that.

[set of games I used: November 9,11,12,14,15,18,19,22,26,28,29; December 10; January 25,26,28; February 4,6,7,11,23,25,27; March 4; April 14]

Interesting numbers. I noticed the big jump in the games that JJ missed and in the game that Smith and Bibby both missed but i didn't go that far in depth.

The main things i wanted to see from Marvn this year was better rebounding and 3 pt shooting. He accomplished both.

Brace yourself for the haters (Diesel, Hawks1986 and 9).

[Peoriabird]

Brace yourself for the haters (Diesel, Hawks1986 and 9).

We might even get a cameo from smoovethefuture! :thumbsupsmileyanim:

[NineOhTheRino]

The whole 'Marvin is the 4th option' argument is suspect. Fact is, Marvin being the 4th option has just as much to do with Marvin than anything else. Marvin has always been reluctant to take control of the game. We blame everything on Iso-Joe but has anyone here ever heard of Marvin complaining about touches? You call it being a team player but I call it not caring enough and that's the main beef I have the guy.

Edited July 24, 2009 by NineOhTheRino

[Admin]

The whole 'Marvin is the 4th option' argument is suspect. Fact is, Marvin being the 4th option has just as much to do with Marvin than anything else. Marvin has always been reluctant to take control of the game. We blame everything on Iso-Joe but has anyone here ever heard of Marvin complaining about touches? You call it being a team player but I call it not caring enough and that's the main beef I have the guy.

The fact is? Please enlighten us on what "fact" you're basing that statement on.

[exodus]

The fact is? Please enlighten us on what "fact" you're basing that statement on.

Maybe it's the fact that Marvin dropped 31 in denver when Bibby and Smith were out or the fact that he is the first Hawks since Steve Smith to get to the foul line 20 times in a game... ooops there i go getting confused again.

[Final_quest]

I guess it's how you look at it, but to me it's not much of a compliment to Marvin. Basically if we had worse players he would score on average 2 points more a game. Is that really a compliment? It's not like we have one of the best teams in the league, but if we were had fewer good players Marvin would score a little bit more on average. I'm glad our purpose as a franchise isn't to see how high we could get Marvin's scoring average to go. Perhaps we should just trade away all of our good players except Marvin to see if he could score even more.

[Peoriabird]

It's not like we have one of the best teams in the league

Depends on your perspective my brother

[dakast]

Marvin's only real problem is that he was drafted at #2 over Chris Paul.

If the Hawks had been further down the board and taken him at #5 or #6 know one on this board would have a problem with him. Time to to let it go people, we have him and he's here to stay.

[pimphandstrong]

Cool.........

But why do we play better when he's not on the floor?

[tonegully]

I wish we could just give Marvin the ball and lets see what he can do. I also like the balance of our team though. JJ, Marvin, Bibby, Smoove, Horf.

[TheDude]

i like Marvin....but if he would just turn the level of has amp from 6 to at least 8, he would much better for us.

[thefloydian]

Fact is

That's actually an opinion, not a fact.

[DJlaysitup]

Maybe it's the fact that Marvin dropped 31 in denver when Bibby and Smith were out or the fact that he is the first Hawks since Steve Smith to get to the foul line 20 times in a game... ooops there i go getting confused again.

Did we win?...

Scoop is IMHO....coaching and GM took it so soft on Marvin. They (or BK) were SO afraid he would fail (with CP3 going nuts) that they didn't challenge him.

I always wondered why Marvin could hit the J within 6-8 inches inside the 3-point line - yet he never shot a three. Then when he did he was pretty good at it. Not great - but pretty good for a guy who shot a total of two the year before (and one was at half court). So what if he'd been shooting threes the year before - or the year before that?

Edited July 25, 2009 by DJlaysitup

[Diesel]

Did we win?...

Scoop is IMHO....coaching and GM took it so soft on Marvin. They (or BK) were SO afraid he would fail (with CP3 going nuts) that they didn't challenge him.

It's good to know that the excuse machine still works. I thought Lebron had broken it.

[Plainview1981]

I guess it's how you look at it, but to me it's not much of a compliment to Marvin. Basically if we had worse players he would score on average 2 points more a game. Is that really a compliment? It's not like we have one of the best teams in the league, but if we were had fewer good players Marvin would score a little bit more on average. I'm glad our purpose as a franchise isn't to see how high we could get Marvin's scoring average to go. Perhaps we should just trade away all of our good players except Marvin to see if he could score even more.

Yeah, everybody has their opinion. There seems to be ways to go however you see it.

[exodus]

Did we win?...

So losing by a point in one of the toughest places to play in the league to a team that made the WCF means that Marvin dropping 31 shooting 59% from the field, 10-10 from the line wasn't really stepping up when others were out?

During the 07/08 season Smith scored 30 or more 5 times and the Hawks lost every game. I guess that means Smith didn't step up on those games.

Edited July 25, 2009 by exodus