Kyrie to Boston . . Thomas to Cleveland . . oh boy

[NBASupes]

3 hours ago, TheNorthCydeRises said:

It makes both of them stronger long term.  You now have Kyrie and Hayward as the young building blocks of the team.  You just give the Cavs a potential top 3 pick, which might be enough incentive for Lebron to stay in Cleveland . . but at the worst, have a young talent to pair with Kevin Love.

I guess we'll just have to bet on Dennis, Taurean, John, Deandre, and next year's draft pick.   We need at least 2 out of the 5 to become All-Stars.  Can they do it?  If they cant, it's purgatory for the next 7 years.

2

Not sure if it makes Cleveland better long term but it makes them better today and this season. 

Boston clearly gets better long term from this deal. Kyrie is just getting into this prime. 

[sturt]

My take, fwiw.

Thomas and Kyrie essentially provide the same asset as the other, or at least, close enough to call it a wash.

I agree with those who think Crowder and a 1st are the difference in this trade. Advantage, short and long term, to CLE.

Since we're a non-factor for this season, and since free agency looms for both Thomas and Kyrie before we return to relevance anyhow... I'm very "meh" where this move concerns the Hawks future.

[thecampster]

8 hours ago, Lurker said:

I'd make a very strong argument that losing Crowder will negate anything that Kyrie might bring.

and I'd join that by saying gaining Crowder more than makes up for anything Cleveland lost. This is a win for Cleveland.

[aali34]

Boston stabbed IT in the back.

[TheNorthCydeRises]

9 hours ago, Vol4ever said:

Cleveland will win 58 games, go to the finals and pick before us in the draft next year. 

That's insane.

[TheNorthCydeRises]

8 hours ago, KB21 said:

This is a weird trade in that I feel Boston gets worse in the present and long term while Cleveland actually improves now but is probably a little bit better than what they would have been long term had they not made this deal.  

Kyrie is not the superstar the media makes him out to be or that fans believe he is.  Neither is Thomas, but if Cleveland is also getting Crowder in this deal, he makes them better now.  

The good thing for the Hawks is that when LeBron leaves, if they resign IT, then it is possible that they won't fall into the top 10 and keep their pick.  We could be looking at a #12 or #13 pick in 2019.

The media?

 

Edited August 23, 2017 by TheNorthCydeRises

[thecampster]

Since the offseason began,

Notable Boston in: 

Gordon Hayward

Kyrie Irving

Marcus Morris

Jayson Tatum

Notable Boston out:

Isaiah Thomas

Jae Crowder

Avery Bradley

Kelly Olynyk

Tyler Zeller

Gerald Green

Amir Green

Jonas Jerebko

In order to drop these 8 players and add the 4 above, the Celtics increased team payroll this year by $10 million.  Am I crazy here or did they take a huge step back, especially defensively and who the heck is playing center now...Al?

 

Oh ya and they lost a 2017 and 2018 draft pick in the deal yesterday.  Just nuts.

Edited August 23, 2017 by thecampster

[PSSSHHHRRR87]

If anything, this trade dilutes the East even more... Cleveland is not the run away favorite anymore and nobody in the East should be afraid of Kyrie/Hayward/Horford.  That tandem is nowhere near the Heatles Big 3.

Sucks that we are now in a rebuild because the Hawks 2-3 years ago could've made the NBA Finals this year.  Golden State is sweeping whoever they face though.

[hazer]

15 minutes ago, PSSSHHHRRR87 said:

If anything, this trade dilutes the East even more... Cleveland is not the run away favorite anymore and nobody in the East should be afraid of Kyrie/Hayward/Horford.  That tandem is nowhere near the Heatles Big 3.

Sucks that we are now in a rebuild because the Hawks 2-3 years ago could've made the NBA Finals this year.  Golden State is sweeping whoever they face though.

Agreed. All except add up the current payroll for those 5 starters from the 60-win team and see why that's an impossibility.

[Watchman]

Looks to me like the Great Danny Ainge got taken to the cleaners.  Arguably IT is a wash for Irving, or very nearly, and to throw in Crowder and a 1st round pick?  Wow.  So much for the Danny Ainge legend.

[Alex]

Terrible trade for Boston.  Cleveland got a great haul and you can argue the players they got are better already.  Now add in a top 5 pick in next years draft.

1 hour ago, PSSSHHHRRR87 said:

If anything, this trade dilutes the East even more... Cleveland is not the run away favorite anymore and nobody in the East should be afraid of Kyrie/Hayward/Horford.  That tandem is nowhere near the Heatles Big 3.

Sucks that we are now in a rebuild because the Hawks 2-3 years ago could've made the NBA Finals this year.  Golden State is sweeping whoever they face though.

Cleveland is better now and in the future with this trade.  

[KB21]

9 hours ago, sturt said:

My take, fwiw.

Thomas and Kyrie essentially provide the same asset as the other, or at least, close enough to call it a wash.

I agree with those who think Crowder and a 1st are the difference in this trade. Advantage, short and long term, to CLE.

Since we're a non-factor for this season, and since free agency looms for both Thomas and Kyrie before we return to relevance anyhow... I'm very "meh" where this move concerns the Hawks future.

The more immediate impact for the Hawks will be Cleveland's pick in 2019.  When/If LeBron leaves, that will leave Cleveland with a core of IT, Jae Crowder, and Kelvin Love.  That core could potentially be a bottom level playoff team but more likely a high lottery team.  That pick Atlanta gets could be anywhere from 11-15 in that draft.   Atlanta will very likely have two lottery picks in 2019, there own which will be lower and Cleveland's, which will probably be a high lottery pick in the 11-14 range.

[HawkItus]

I'm starting to think Boston screwed up by signing Horford.   He is not the 3rd man to make this current team great.  

[Sothron]

the Nets pick will make or break this trade. Bos got the better player right now and probably going forward. If the Cavs pick a potential superstar then the trade swings in their favor.

I just find it unreal that the Cavs will make it to the Finals and still got a top 3 pick, guaranteed, in next year's draft. Hopefully for us all this means is their pick when we can get it falls in the teens range.

[capstone21]

25 minutes ago, HawkItus said:

I'm starting to think Boston screwed up by signing Horford.   He is not the 3rd man to make this current team great.  

You underestimate Horford ... he is not the greatest rebounder but he is the perfect third guy for a team ... his ability to facilitate, phenomenal mid range, willingness to play a role ... The Celtics just need to find a rebounding PF or C to put next to him

[MaceCase]

Just now, capstone21 said:

You underestimate Horford ... he is not the greatest rebounder but he is the perfect third guy for a team ... his ability to facilitate, phenomenal mid range, willingness to play a role ... The Celtics just need to find a rebounding PF or C to put next to him

They also traded one as part of the deal for Kyrie in Zizic.  It's another part of why they think Ainge got smoked in the deal, he's failed to address the Celtics biggest weakness which is rebounding and interior defense.

[capstone21]

11 minutes ago, MaceCase said:

They also traded one as part of the deal for Kyrie in Zizic.  It's another part of why they think Ainge got smoked in the deal, he's failed to address the Celtics biggest weakness which is rebounding and interior defense.

Ainge did terrible this offseason with the exception of getting Haywood

[sturt]

1 hour ago, KB21 said:

The more immediate impact for the Hawks will be Cleveland's pick in 2019.  When/If LeBron leaves, that will leave Cleveland with a core of IT, Jae Crowder, and Kelvin Love.  That core could potentially be a bottom level playoff team but more likely a high lottery team.  That pick Atlanta gets could be anywhere from 11-15 in that draft.   Atlanta will very likely have two lottery picks in 2019, there own which will be lower and Cleveland's, which will probably be a high lottery pick in the 11-14 range.

I'm optimistic.

I'm not that optimistic.

Too many variables in play.

[ATLSmith]

58 minutes ago, HawkItus said:

I'm starting to think Boston screwed up by signing Horford.   He is not the 3rd man to make this current team great.  

They will trade him before his contract expires, like they do with all their players.

[AHF]

Bear in mind one more potential scenario for the future with LeBron.  If he chooses to remain in Cleveland and the Cavs remain willing to spend, they could deal the #3 pick (or wherever it lands) for a vet stud like they did when they acquired Love.  They could then have a group of IT, LeBron, Crowder, Love and veteran stud.  

Think of the deals this offseason.  I think a #3 pick in next year's draft is better than the return that Chicago got for Butler and better than the return Indiana got for George so you could conceivably see a deal with other pieces where Cleveland adds a Butler/George type player to IT, LeBron and Love.