My guy has talked around NBA circles of late

[Diesel]

Based on the Hoopshype Rumor Mill....

I'm throwing out:

JC/Bogi  for McCollum/Nance. 

If this is the trade.   Our starting lineup is then changed to:

Trae/McCollum/Hunter/Gallo/Clint. 

Nance starts with us on the IL.  I don't know if his knee is something that we should be fearful about. 

The other rendition of this is:

JC/Delon for McCollum. 

Same starters.  No injury. 

[BangHolman]

7 minutes ago, Diesel said:

Based on the Hoopshype Rumor Mill....

I'm throwing out:

JC/Bogi  for McCollum/Nance. 

If this is the trade.   Our starting lineup is then changed to:

Trae/McCollum/Hunter/Gallo/Clint. 

Nance starts with us on the IL.  I don't know if his knee is something that we should be fearful about. 

The other rendition of this is:

JC/Delon for McCollum. 

Same starters.  No injury. 

We aren't trading Collins for McCollum... 

It would be more like Gallo, Wright, and 1st. 

[ShooterSays]

I know what the rumors are, but my gut tells me JC will not be traded for McCollum. 

Only way I see us trading JC is for a Simmons, Brown, KAT, or other all-star caliber player. Something that would most likely be done in the offseason.

John's trade rumors have always been that he's available for a star player. I don't believe that has changed and I also don't believe McCollum is a star player.

[JayBirdHawk]

8 minutes ago, Diesel said:

Based on the Hoopshype Rumor Mill....

I'm throwing out:

JC/Bogi  for McCollum/Nance. 

If this is the trade.   Our starting lineup is then changed to:

Trae/McCollum/Hunter/Gallo/Clint. 

Nance starts with us on the IL.  I don't know if his knee is something that we should be fearful about. 

The other rendition of this is:

JC/Delon for McCollum. 

Same starters.  No injury. 

uuuhhhhh....NO. McCullum does not have this kind of value.

Gallo is no longer a starter.

[HawkingAwesome]

trae/mccollum/hunter/gallo/clint 

you're trying to set all time worst defense records.

[JayBirdHawk]

20 hours ago, h4wkfan said:

Bogi + OKC pick for white straight up works.

More likely the Charlotte pick would be needed.

[h4wkfan]

Just now, JayBirdHawk said:

More likely the Charlotte pick would be needed.

Fine by me. I’m a huge fan of White. If you didn’t know

[JayBirdHawk]

6 minutes ago, h4wkfan said:

Fine by me. I’m a huge fan of White. If you didn’t know

oh me too.  I advocated trading for either White or Murry (no longer an option) last offseason.

[JayBirdHawk]

TIFWIW

 

 

[bleachkit]

6 minutes ago, JayBirdHawk said:

TIFWIW

 

 

So unless something changes, we are standing pat. 

[macdaddy]

1 minute ago, bleachkit said:

So unless something changes, we are standing pat. 

Yep.  We are definitely standing pat.  Unless we make a trade. 

[Wretch]

2 hours ago, thecampster said:

One interesting nugget I heard (and don't put too much stock in it) is that Knox could be dealt for Culver in Memphis. The salaries line up and both could fit better with the new team.

As always, thank you for the updates Camp. 

I dig the Culver part.  I was high on him and while I understand he's underwhelmed teams (to include our own GM at draft time), I'd be interested in the deal if for nothing but sheer curiosity.

[marco102]

 

Edited February 8, 2022 by marco102

[thecampster]

55 minutes ago, REHawksFan said:

I understand if you can't, but if possible, can you clarify this a little bit?  The questions I have are:

1. Is Philly really considering Gallo/Bogi without JC included? 
2. When you say Philly has tried to swap Bogi and Huerter, is that just in the JC deal or also in the Gallo deal?
3. Is the "Heavily favored deal" favored by Philly, Hawks, or Both? 
4. Is swapping Huerter and Bogi enough to get the deal done or is Philly asking for more that the Hawks don't want to give? 

Thanks.  

I have been sitting on some stuff for a while that deals with the whole behind the scenes info in Philly.  I'm going to give some basic info now as I'm cleared to do so and this should start hitting media any time now. I'm hoping it adds some clarity to this.  Others on the board were made aware of this well over a week ago but I'm going to go into a little more detail here (what I can).

There were formal complaints leveled against Philly (I will not and can not go into the teams) and their dealings as it came to the Simmons and Harden situation. 

1. Issue 1 - Teams were not sure if Philly was dealing with them in good faith (this is common and by itself not a smoking gun).  There were several deals that teams thought were mostly done that were pulled off the table. As has been widely speculated here on the Squawk, the Cam deal was about acquiring an asset to include in a deal with Philly. Philly pulling out of a deal that left the Hawks having made a decision they may not have made otherwise (things like this is what the good faith thing is).

2. Issue 2 - Teams are okay to share he said/she said info with competing teams in a trade. What they aren't allowed to do is share written, video, official communications. No recording calls, etc.  Teams have reason to believe Philly shared official communications, specifically with Brooklyn for leverage to get permission to talk with Harden (see below).

3. Issue 3 - Teams believe that Philly did tamper with James Harden and have talked to him through 3rd parties. Their dealings with Brooklyn in the last week was to get approval to speak with Harden directly to provide cover into a league investigation and they gave Brooklyn similar approval with Simmons. Because no handshake, wink wink deals were made and Harden hasn't changed teams, continues to play, there hasn't been a penalty but there is an investigation into this going on behind the scenes.

4. Issue 4 - Philly has been leaking other teams' info and Ben Simmons info into the media which is highly unethical. This caused problems in other team's locker rooms when potential trades were run in the media without the players knowing they were being discussed, etc.  This has also affected other teams' player values. The standing ethical rule is you talk about your players, not other teams' players. Leaking them to the media off the record is an ethical conundrum. The question is did Philly do so to game the trade market in their favor.

 

Okay so given that information, here are the answers to your 4 questions.

1. There were more than 10 packages (provided safe estimates) on Philly's table to consider a deal to move Simmons. teams were interested. There were a few from the Hawks most of which eventually made it to the media. The Gallo/Bogi deal I leaked a month+ ago and it was the first real deal Philly was considering. It moved to Philly wanting to include Cam/JC instead when they heard Cam was unhappy here and then led to Philly pulling their offer when they did their due diligence on Cam and adding Harris. This riled the Hawks since Cam was Philly's idea in the first place.  I can't answer the is Philly really considering question because per 2 different people...Philly doesn't know and nothing Philly has done in the process can be trusted (see above). Philly hasn't engaged in good faith and so no one close to the organization knows what Philly is actually thinking.

2. Pretty much everyone talking with us (erroneously) believes they can pick between Bogi and Huerter (either now or after the Poison Pill drops). To a man, almost every team prefers Huerter. He is a better team player, poorer 1v1 offensive player but plays much better man defense and at least equal if not better team defense. His body is much healthier.

3. By favored I mean, if Philly can't do a deal with Brooklyn (their preference not Brooklyns'), the JC centered deal is the most likely but not even 50% likely as they'd need to move Harris in a separate deal too. Don't read too much into the "preferred" moniker. 

4. Its not that simple. For the purpose of calculating the cap in a trade this year, Bogi is $8 million more than Huerter but for Hawk team salary is $14 million more.  Moving Bogi is much better for our cap situation this year (no tax). Moving Huerter is much better for any trade partner's salary this year.  Every team wants Huerter due to the lower salary both this year and in the future + better health/youth. Is it enough for the other team...sure but a deal where you substitute Huerter for Bogi is a $14 million change in our cap situation post trade compared to sending out Bogi. Don't oversimplify question 4. It isn't simple, its very complicated cap wise for fit/value. It isn't as simple as sub in Huerter done deal.  You make that swap, it could cost you $20 million in real dollars this year alone and cost you trade flexibility in the future. Teams love K'von and you need to sell very high on him if you are selling.

 

Please don't ask for further details on the Simmons/Harden situation than I've provided. The media should clarify some of this going forward. There is more but I'm keeping it simple to provide context to the trade minefield that is now Ben Simmons.

[macdaddy]

2 minutes ago, marco102 said:

 

I honestly would have like CJ.   I get he's got liabilities but he's going to come for very little and we could really use a bucket getter like him.   I get our defense is bad and this doesn't solve it but i actually think he would work.  Dame/CJ never had a front line like JC/Cap/OO to work with and Dame isn't the passer that Trae is.  

[bleachkit]

Well Josh Hart is off the market.

[Wretch]

9 minutes ago, thecampster said:

I have been sitting on some stuff for a while that deals with the whole behind the scenes info in Philly.  I'm going to give some basic info now as I'm cleared to do so and this should start hitting media any time now. I'm hoping it adds some clarity to this.  Others on the board were made aware of this well over a week ago but I'm going to go into a little more detail here (what I can).

There were formal complaints leveled against Philly (I will not and can not go into the teams) and their dealings as it came to the Simmons and Harden situation. 

1. Issue 1 - Teams were not sure if Philly was dealing with them in good faith (this is common and by itself not a smoking gun).  There were several deals that teams thought were mostly done that were pulled off the table. As has been widely speculated here on the Squawk, the Cam deal was about acquiring an asset to include in a deal with Philly. Philly pulling out of a deal that left the Hawks having made a decision they may not have made otherwise (things like this is what the good faith thing is).

2. Issue 2 - Teams are okay to share he said/she said info with competing teams in a trade. What they aren't allowed to do is share written, video, official communications. No recording calls, etc.  Teams have reason to believe Philly shared official communications, specifically with Brooklyn for leverage to get permission to talk with Harden (see below).

3. Issue 3 - Teams believe that Philly did tamper with James Harden and have talked to him through 3rd parties. Their dealings with Brooklyn in the last week was to get approval to speak with Harden directly to provide cover into a league investigation and they gave Brooklyn similar approval with Simmons. Because no handshake, wink wink deals were made and Harden hasn't changed teams, continues to play, there hasn't been a penalty but there is an investigation into this going on behind the scenes.

4. Issue 4 - Philly has been leaking other teams' info and Ben Simmons info into the media which is highly unethical. This caused problems in other team's locker rooms when potential trades were run in the media without the players knowing they were being discussed, etc.  This has also affected other teams' player values. The standing ethical rule is you talk about your players, not other teams' players. Leaking them to the media off the record is an ethical conundrum. The question is did Philly do so to game the trade market in their favor.

 

Okay so given that information, here are the answers to your 4 questions.

1. There were more than 10 packages (provided safe estimates) on Philly's table to consider a deal to move Simmons. teams were interested. There were a few from the Hawks most of which eventually made it to the media. The Gallo/Bogi deal I leaked a month+ ago and it was the first real deal Philly was considering. It moved to Philly wanting to include Cam/JC instead when they heard Cam was unhappy here and then led to Philly pulling their offer when they did their due diligence on Cam and adding Harris. This riled the Hawks since Cam was Philly's idea in the first place.  I can't answer the is Philly really considering question because per 2 different people...Philly doesn't know and nothing Philly has done in the process can be trusted (see above). Philly hasn't engaged in good faith and so no one close to the organization knows what Philly is actually thinking.

2. Pretty much everyone talking with us (erroneously) believes they can pick between Bogi and Huerter (either now or after the Poison Pill drops). To a man, almost every team prefers Huerter. He is a better team player, poorer 1v1 offensive player but plays much better man defense and at least equal if not better team defense. His body is much healthier.

3. By favored I mean, if Philly can't do a deal with Brooklyn (their preference not Brooklyns'), the JC centered deal is the most likely but not even 50% likely as they'd need to move Harris in a separate deal too. Don't read too much into the "preferred" moniker. 

4. Its not that simple. For the purpose of calculating the cap in a trade this year, Bogi is $8 million more than Huerter but for Hawk team salary is $14 million more.  Moving Bogi is much better for our cap situation this year (no tax). Moving Huerter is much better for any trade partner's salary this year.  Every team wants Huerter due to the lower salary both this year and in the future + better health/youth. Is it enough for the other team...sure but a deal where you substitute Huerter for Bogi is a $14 million change in our cap situation post trade compared to sending out Bogi. Don't oversimplify question 4. It isn't simple, its very complicated cap wise for fit/value. It isn't as simple as sub in Huerter done deal.  You make that swap, it could cost you $20 million in real dollars this year alone and cost you trade flexibility in the future. Teams love K'von and you need to sell very high on him if you are selling.

 

Please don't ask for further details on the Simmons/Harden situation than I've provided. The media should clarify some of this going forward. There is more but I'm keeping it simple to provide context to the trade minefield that is now Ben Simmons.

Just wow to the Philly FO if any of that is true........especially the first bullet.

[macdaddy]

1 minute ago, bleachkit said:

Well Josh Hart is off the market.

They got CJ for Hart and picks?   geezus.  I  know folks don't like him but I wish we'd have made something happen.

[shakes]

27 minutes ago, Wretch said:

As always, thank you for the updates Camp. 

I dig the Culver part.  I was high on him and while I understand he's underwhelmed teams (to include our own GM at draft time), I'd be interested in the deal if for nothing but sheer curiosity.

Would a deal like this just be to make Trae happy?   I don't know for sure, but I would imagine Trae and Culver are buddies.   Culver is from Lubbock and went to Texas Tech.  Trae spent a good part of his childhood in Lubbock and for a good part of his life assumed he would follow his dad to Texas Tech (used to tell his dad he was gonna break all his TT records).  I would imagine that Trae and Culver have known each other since they were little kids.

[marco102]