Hawks locker room is not healthy after "quiet" trade deadline

[TheNorthCydeRises]

Let me listen to the Capela interview, before I give my take on the situation.

[terrell]

36 minutes ago, bleachkit said:

We can do better than Tony Snell though. Yes, we need some dogs though. 

Yeah of course.. Im just saying players in that mold...

[Spud2nique]

Anyone have cliff notes for this?

[TheNorthCydeRises]

16 minutes ago, Spud2nique said:

Anyone have cliff notes for this?

It's actually worth the read.

[Spud2nique]

12 minutes ago, TheNorthCydeRises said:

It's actually worth the read.

[Spud2nique]

Kerry Kittles  I swear he said Kittles…

[HawkingAwesome]

2 hours ago, terrell said:

Trae telling the other players about his stats? Im not shocked by the other stuff, but this is crazy.. lol

it's not lol 

[HawkingAwesome]

so this is what i got 

trae would play defense if he didn't have to play so hard on offense

[Threezus]

The one thing i disagree with is their notion that we don't call white players out on defense.  Hell Bogi, Huerter, and Gallo have been the whipping boys from our slander and complaining every week.  We trash on their defense more than anyone else on the team and thats including Trae.  Mainly because trae provides a ton of offense and usage so we can somewhat look the other way on defense at times.  But those 3 don't have any reason not to give a ton of effort on defense and they just don't.   We are usually bragging more about Hunter, OO, Wright, Capel, and Collins on defense than anyone else on the team.    So i don't know wtf they are reading or seeing but they might need some better glasses because their not seeing it right at all.  It's the complete opposite of whats being thought of an said on here and Real GM. 

[JTB]

5 hours ago, terrell said:

So the coaches gave up on trying to get Trae to play defense? Wtf??  Id be pissed if I were the other guys too.. lol. 

 

Yes this is crazy that the coaches would give up on pushing Trae to play defense but also keep in mind that on a typical night Trae is also being asked to be our best scorer and playmaker 100% of the time as there really is no other player on the team that can help him with this. Not an excuse for Trae but until he gets a real second option scorer or playmaker this will always be his excuse regarding defense and unfortunately it’s not necessarily a terrible one……like @Sothron mentioned even Jordan wasn’t asked to be the best scorer and playmaker then run down on the other end be the elite defender he turned out to be. If Trae says he will be better defensively once we get a player who will take true pressure off of him offensively, I believe the front office should listen to that since two stars are the normal requirement anyways to truly win big.

 

5 hours ago, bleachkit said:

I am concerned about Trae's leadership skills. It does not seem like players naturally gravitate to him, for whatever reason. 

lol well I’m not let me tell you why…Trae is 23 years old and he doesn’t come off as a natural leader even during interviews. That’s not to say he won’t grow to be one but this generation is just different! The best player isn’t the automatic leader of the team like back in the day. Warriors as mentioned is a perfect example…I’ve heard Draymond say curry and klay are quiet locker room guys in his point of view but we all know loud mouth draymond is the locker room leader though he’s the 3rd or 4th best player on the team. Even during the Johnson era…Johnson was considered the best player but his quiet personality lead to wide speculation that horford was the true leader of the locker room and afterwards we found out that was true. How about Leonard? You think this guy went to Toronto and was a leader??? Nah the leader was Lowry in Toronto  and his time with spurs he definitely wasn’t a leader in the locker room even after Duncan, Ginoboli, Parker era.

personally I don’t believe even JC is true leader.

 

5 hours ago, Sothron said:

Collins is considered more of a leader in the locker room than Trae is because Collins has sacrificed his stats in a contract year and going forwards to try and make the team better. He also plays good defense. Trae is willing to sacrifice touches/stats but he wants a talent he can really trust in to do that. 

I question Collins leadership a bit. I’d love to know what kind of leader JC truly is. Being nice to everyone isn’t a leader. You have to hold people accountable and also  point out their flaws and be the bad guy at times as well.
Is JC in that locker room willing to find a way to go at Trae and tell him about himself while also respecting his game ?…Can Collins call out every other player and light a fire underneath them?….

Draymond can call out Curry and Klay ….and we all know Curry and Klay are night and day better offensive talents then Draymond but Draymond is still going there with them! ….Marcus Smart knows he’s not as good offensively (and maybe not even defensively) as Tatum and Brown but he’s still going at them!

Can Collins do that to Trae and the rest of his team ???

As a fan I think Collins leadership is overrated a bit because he’s seen jollying around before tip off and smiling at all his teammates, dapping it up….and fans take that as “leader”. That’s cool and all  but if he’s not being strategically critical and demanding respect behind close doors then it’s not helping his team.

Has our leader called a players only meeting with the team being down right now?….or is he too worried about putting everyone flaws out there including his own?….If you’re going to wear that leader title then wear it!

[TheNorthCydeRises]

8 hours ago, Plainview1981 said:

Could it be that Trae, Collins and Capella get much critisism because they're signed long term and are expected to be the team's best players?

People have been critical of Gallo all season. Bogi has been injuried, but we all know he isn't a long term piece to the puzzle. He is only a one trick pony role player.

Until recently, most people haven't been that critical of Hunter and OO.

I think Huerter deserves more attention because he just signed an extension that he doesn't deserve, but to pull the race card is absurd.

If this is true, it sounds like the players are trying to blame fans for their lackluster play. Everyone but OO deserves some blame.

I have defended Gallo all season, because I think he's being used wrong.

Since the players, media, and coaching staff reads the Squawk, tell Nate to play Gallo AT THE DAMN 3, so that our lineup can be bigger.

Gallo's defense is weakest in transition, around the basket, and in defensive rotations.  Where he's actually strong defensively, is when he gets to face his man straight up.  His length defensively bothers smaller guards and wings, and he actually prevents people from driving around him.

Offensively, he has a size advantage over smaller players.  And Nate likes to go to him as a favorable matchup in the halfcourt.  So if he is already doing this, play Gallo at the 3 alongside 2 bigs.

[Diesel]

Losing has this effect.   Honestly, it has to be the whole team who feels like we're not where we should be.  Losing forces people to use the finger to point blame.   That's the nature of losing.  The good news is that our guys are responsive to losing.   I've have seen other teams that lose and have reached a level of acceptance.   I agree with Jay when she said this will either make them stronger or make them fold. 

I'm sure that Travis is doing what he can do to keep the team on track while at the same time keep most players happy. 

In the meanwhile, this team has to come together and win.. like Last night. 

Win the games that nobody expected you to win!  That's been our way. 

[TheNorthCydeRises]

As for the problems on the team, here's how I see it.

Trae is the alpha dog player, but he is NOT the leader of the team.  He never has been.  And as I said earlier in the season, I think there's been a power struggle going on in that locker room between Trae and John Collins as to who is the vocal leader of the team.  Trae has even said in interviews that he is not much of a "talker", and would rather just go out on the court and do it.  JC is the opposite.  I see him as trying to be the vocal leader.  He sometimes passively takes shots at Trae ( as well as Nate ), when they mention the turnovers.   I'm sure that rubs Trae the wrong way, especially when some of those turnovers are a result of Trae trying to make a difficult pass to a big like JC.

The problem with JC being the leader that can hold people accountable, is that he has obvious flaws in his game as well.  That has been talked about extensively here, but it really comes to the forefront when he faces elite players.  He wants to take that next step offensively, but he has more to work on his game, before being able to be that trusted #2 option.

Bogi is also in the mix here too.  You'll see the Hawks at times when Bogi feels that he MUST shoot the ball, regardless of the situation, instead of just playing his role.  Bogi presents leadership qualities, but once again, he has his flaws as a player and that prevents him from being that critical voice in the locker room.

Contrary to popular belief, while it helps that guys on a sports team get along well with each other, it's not a prerequisite. We're not the 1990s Chicago Bulls by any stretch of the imagination, but those guys weren't a close group off the floor.  Jordan was an ass that most players didn't care for ( personality wise ).  But his talent was undeniable and they respected that.  I think Trae doesn't take it personally that certain people may or may not like him.  All he wants to do is win, so he'll still pass people the ball and get it to them in the right spots.

HOWEVER . . . Trae trusts his own ability more than he trusts his teammates, or even his coaching staff.

 

It's interesting how Solo was seen as being the calming force that the team misses.  His game is garbage, but he was like the wise "old head" on the team that could talk to everyone, and everyone could talk to him.  He's been on championship teams, so he knows the characteristics of one.

With the issues going on behind the scenes, I now see why these guys don't necessarily talk to each other out on the court.  At times, it seems as if everyone is doing their own thing, and they're just out there playing, instead of communicating with each other.  Collins at least tries to do this.  I think he is best suited to be the emotional leader of THIS version of the Hawks.  But his game needs to start showing up in the biggest moments.  Get that key block or rebound.  Get that hustle put back basket.  Make the big shot when you get the ball.

That gives you credibility not only with your star player, it sets the example for the rest of the team. 

[bleachkit]

5 hours ago, Threezus said:

The one thing i disagree with is their notion that we don't call white players out on defense.  Hell Bogi, Huerter, and Gallo have been the whipping boys from our slander and complaining every week.  We trash on their defense more than anyone else on the team and thats including Trae.  Mainly because trae provides a ton of offense and usage so we can somewhat look the other way on defense at times.  But those 3 don't have any reason not to give a ton of effort on defense and they just don't.   We are usually bragging more about Hunter, OO, Wright, Capel, and Collins on defense than anyone else on the team.    So i don't know wtf they are reading or seeing but they might need some better glasses because their not seeing it right at all.  It's the complete opposite of whats being thought of an said on here and Real GM. 

Whoever said that, please trade that player, because bringing race into it is really a lame bitch move. And further more, it's just false. Who is giving who a pass? Show me what player is getting a pass? Are they talking about the fan base, the coaching staff, management? I am skeptical about that, maybe comments were taken out of context. But whatever, at the end of the day, team has to play better, and if the team isn't playing well, trades are inevitable. 

[JayBirdHawk]

1 hour ago, JTB said:

Yes this is crazy that the coaches would give up on pushing Trae to play defense but also keep in mind that on a typical night Trae is also being asked to be our best scorer and playmaker 100% of the time as there really is no other player on the team that can help him with this. Not an excuse for Trae but until he gets a real second option scorer or playmaker this will always be his excuse regarding defense and unfortunately it’s not necessarily a terrible one……like @Sothron mentioned even Jordan wasn’t asked to be the best scorer and playmaker then run down on the other end be the elite defender he turned out to be. If Trae says he will be better defensively once we get a player who will take true pressure off of him offensively, I believe the front office should listen to that since two stars are the normal requirement anyways to truly win big.

 

lol well I’m not let me tell you why…Trae is 23 years old and he doesn’t come off as a natural leader even during interviews. That’s not to say he won’t grow to be one but this generation is just different! The best player isn’t the automatic leader of the team like back in the day. Warriors as mentioned is a perfect example…I’ve heard Draymond say curry and klay are quiet locker room guys in his point of view but we all know loud mouth draymond is the locker room leader though he’s the 3rd or 4th best player on the team. Even during the Johnson era…Johnson was considered the best player but his quiet personality lead to wide speculation that horford was the true leader of the locker room and afterwards we found out that was true. How about Leonard? You think this guy went to Toronto and was a leader??? Nah the leader was Lowry in Toronto  and his time with spurs he definitely wasn’t a leader in the locker room even after Duncan, Ginoboli, Parker era.

personally I don’t believe even JC is true leader.

 

I question Collins leadership a bit. I’d love to know what kind of leader JC truly is. Being nice to everyone isn’t a leader. You have to hold people accountable and also  point out their flaws and be the bad guy at times as well.
Is JC in that locker room willing to find a way to go at Trae and tell him about himself while also respecting his game ?…Can Collins call out every other player and light a fire underneath them?….

Draymond can call out Curry and Klay ….and we all know Curry and Klay are night and day better offensive talents then Draymond but Draymond is still going there with them! ….Marcus Smart knows he’s not as good offensively (and maybe not even defensively) as Tatum and Brown but he’s still going at them!

Can Collins do that to Trae and the rest of his team ???

As a fan I think Collins leadership is overrated a bit because he’s seen jollying around before tip off and smiling at all his teammates, dapping it up….and fans take that as “leader”. That’s cool and all  but if he’s not being strategically critical and demanding respect behind close doors then it’s not helping his team.

Has our leader called a players only meeting with the team being down right now?….or is he too worried about putting everyone flaws out there including his own?….If you’re going to wear that leader title then wear it!

Have you forgotten last year?  Collins spoke up in a film session....and it became that he was worried about touches in a contract year. So he can't win either way.  Which if I remember correctly, Capela agreed with.

Quote

Constructive criticism is part of any NBA film session.

But when the Hawks convened Tuesday at the Emory Sports Medicine Complex, the day after they had blown a 15-point lead in the second half for the second consecutive game in a loss to New York, there was something different about the most memorable message being sent: It wasn’t coming from the coach, Lloyd Pierce, but from a player.

Trae Young insists an argument he had with John Collins during a film season, which was reported by The Athletic, was overblown and not atypical.

Collins criticized Young for mismanaging the clock on offense and questioned his early shot-clock attempts.

“Of course if there’s anything out there publicly, I always go directly to [that person],” Young relayed to Yahoo Sports. “As for the John [Collins] incident, me and him talked about it as soon as it got out the next day and we were both confused. It just got out and it was over a regular film session. So there’s no beef or anything in there to begin with. There hasn’t been any locker room issues on my side. Anything that people were saying about locker room issues, there hasn’t been one. It’s all about our team and how we’ve been trying to get better in film sessions.”

...then Trae went out in the next two games one vs Charlotte and really stunk it up and appeared to be sulking.

[TheNorthCydeRises]

9 hours ago, hylndr11 said:

I mean, I see tons of critique of white players here, and Im biracial since it seems its implied if someone says what your saying is potentially true based on what your hearing, but we literally very easily find critique on all these on squawk, I would argue Huerter has been getting crucified especially lately, I hear an entire monologue on this guy on the radio today. 

Good for Clint on stepping up and seeing the big picture, I can see everyones POV on why they are upset, It all makes sense, but Clint is right, the younger guys are going to be a little more self centered its apart of being a professional - we all went through this in our 20s I would imagine, if we went on to be successful in our careers, their is a time where it kinda clicks. 

 

The Squawk is definitely equal opportunity when it comes to criticism. As Michael Jackson said ... it don't matter if you're Black or White.

[sturt]

Is there some sense that maybe Capela is trying to step in to the Solo void... albeit by speaking out?

[bleachkit]

The truth is, our personell is favored towards offense. But nothing is perfect. If you get a defensive dog that gives you nothing on offense, that doesn't work either. So it is what it is. 

[hylndr11]

25 minutes ago, sturt said:

Is there some sense that maybe Capela is trying to step in to the Solo void... albeit by speaking out?

Hopefully , always wondered why he wasn't considered for that more anyway he is older with playoff exp with a scorer like Trae plus he's big and not a total idiot .  Good for him if so, someone needs to be and the coaches prolly have talked to him about this as well 

Edited February 16, 2022 by hylndr11

[Gray Mule]

Hawks seem to mirror the married couple who are staying together for the sake of the children, not because they love each other.

Hawks have a black coach and the majority of their players.  Yet, we hear that many feel that our white players are getting a pass because of their color.  If this is really true, the only thing to do is to trade them all this summer for black players.  

Trae needs to change his tune from "me" to "we."  You know, teamwork!

Edited February 16, 2022 by Gray Mule