2022 Offseason Ramblings

[macdaddy]

1 minute ago, hawkman said:

That wasn't a cheap shot. Never initiate violence if you're unprepared for a violent response. Poole learned a lesson many of us learned at an early age. If you put your hands on another person in anger, you better be ready for whatever comes next.

Shoving someone away who's up in your face?  That's not initiating anything.  Someone comes and walks you down like that what are you supposed to do?   Unless there's more to this there is definitely an initiator and it's Draymond. 

[hawkman]

5 minutes ago, macdaddy said:

Shoving someone away who's up in your face?  That's not initiating anything.  Someone comes and walks you down like that what are you supposed to do?   Unless there's more to this there is definitely an initiator and it's Draymond. 

Walk away. De-escalate the situation. If you're going to initiate PHYSICAL CONTACT, you better get your hands up afterwards. I don't make the rules. I'm not defending Green or Poole here. They both can get suspended for all I care.

[JayBirdHawk]

13 minutes ago, hawkman said:

That wasn't a cheap shot. Never initiate violence if you're unprepared for a violent response. Poole learned a lesson many of us learned at an early age. If you put your hands on another person in anger, you better be ready for whatever comes next.

Green initiated 1st contact when he got into Poole's personal space and bumped him though.

[hawkman]

3 minutes ago, JayBirdHawk said:

Green initiated 1st contact when he got into Poole's personal space and bumped him though.

Green did indeed get into his personal space, but Poole escalated the situation when he pushed him. It became a "physical altercation" at that point. If Poole was going to take it there, he should've been prepared for what came next. Again, I'm not defending Green. I also understand if Poole didn't want to get "punked" in front of his teammates. All I'm saying is if you are going to escalate the altercation to the next level, you better get your hands up. I personally don't condone violence and would have never let things get to that point.

[kg01]

44 minutes ago, hawkman said:

That wasn't a cheap shot. Never initiate violence if you're unprepared for a violent response. Poole learned a lesson many of us learned at an early age. If you put your hands on another person in anger, you better be ready for whatever comes next.

It can be both.

A. Poole should've protected himself.

B. Green waited until Poole wasn't 'ready' then cheap shot him.  That's not what you do to a teammate.  He knew this, waited for Poole to relax (because the situation was naturally diffusing), then jacked him up.

Both were wrong, imho, but what Green did was inexcusable.

[aali34]

18 minutes ago, hawkman said:

Green did indeed get into his personal space, but Poole escalated the situation when he pushed him. It became a "physical altercation" at that point. If Poole was going to take it there, he should've been prepared for what came next. Again, I'm not defending Green. I also understand if Poole didn't want to get "punked" in front of his teammates. All I'm saying is if you are going to escalate the altercation to the next level, you better get your hands up. I personally don't condone violence and would have never let things get to that point.

These guys always refer to each other as "brothers" though. I have 5 brothers and the last time we ever put hands on each other was when we were just out of high school, never as adults.

Poole didn't expect his "brother" to try and knock him out, thats why his guard wasn't up. If it was someone on another team or a stranger, I believe he would.

NBA players in game have shoving matches and don't react like this.

[hawkman]

8 minutes ago, kg01 said:

It can be both.

A. Poole should've protected himself.

B. Green waited until Poole wasn't 'ready' then cheap shot him.  That's not what you do to a teammate.  He knew this, waited for Poole to relax (because the situation was naturally diffusing), then jacked him up.

Both were wrong, imho, but what Green did was inexcusable.

Agreed 100%.

[kg01]

8 minutes ago, hawkman said:

Agreed 100%.

I'm glad you agree.  Otherwise ....

[hawkman]

8 minutes ago, aali34 said:

These guys always refer to each other as "brothers" though. I have 5 brothers and the last time we ever put hands on each other was when we were just out of high school, never as adults.

Poole didn't expect his "brother" to try and knock him out, thats why his guard wasn't up. If it was someone on another team or a stranger, I believe he would.

NBA players in game have shoving matches and don't react like this.

"Brothers" or not, the rules don't change:

1. Never underestimate your opponent.

2. In a physical altercation, ALWAYS get into a defensive fighting stance.

On the streets, there are no refs or teammates to break up the fight. You can't push somebody and then drop your hands with the, "what are you going to do about it?", stance afterwards. That's all I'm saying. I am NOT defending Green in any way. I'm not saying Green was right for what he did. I'm saying that I'm not pushing anyone I'm not prepared to square off with. I'm expecting violence at that point.

[macdaddy]

 

NBA players seem to be weighing in.  Not sure if they are trying to sew division or just hate Dray. 

[NBASupes]

Draymond gotta get suspended for that shit. No f***ing way. Poole didn't deserve that shit

 

 

[warcore]

Anyone think Poole will request a trade??

[JayBirdHawk]

Remember this?

 

 

[aali34]

28 minutes ago, hawkman said:

"Brothers" or not, the rules don't change:

1. Never underestimate your opponent.

2. In a physical altercation, ALWAYS get into a defensive fighting stance.

On the streets, there are no refs or teammates to break up the fight. You can't push somebody and then drop your hands with the, "what are you going to do about it?", stance afterwards. That's all I'm saying. I am NOT defending Green in any way. I'm not saying Green was right for what he did. I'm saying that I'm not pushing anyone I'm not prepared to square off with. I'm expecting violence at that point.

I get what you're saying, but it's still a 33 year old man knocking out a 23 year old kid.

There's a line you don't cross with friends and family. Verbally and physically. I'm never going to expect my brother to try and knock me out if I don't deserve it. 

These aren't street dudes in a rough environment, they're multi millionaires. In a vacuum you're right, but the context surrounding this makes it shocking that it happened. Especially since Green is trying to become a respected media member in the future.

That wasn't even a "let's fight" push, more like a get off of me push. 

If Poole did this I'd get it.

[AHF]

40 minutes ago, hawkman said:

"Brothers" or not, the rules don't change:

1. Never underestimate your opponent.

2. In a physical altercation, ALWAYS get into a defensive fighting stance.

On the streets, there are no refs or teammates to break up the fight. You can't push somebody and then drop your hands with the, "what are you going to do about it?", stance afterwards. That's all I'm saying. I am NOT defending Green in any way. I'm not saying Green was right for what he did. I'm saying that I'm not pushing anyone I'm not prepared to square off with. I'm expecting violence at that point.

They aren't on the streets.  On the streets, you have no idea who you are dealing with and need to know you could be dealing with someone who is violent and doesn't give a **** about the consequences.

They are teammates in practice.  Green is a multimillionaire leader of his team and (supposedly) a professionall.  He came off and started bumping into Poole in a sign of dominance.  Pushing back to create space between them is the expected reaction to that.  Throwing a punch is not expected among teammates in a practice, especially where there was no violence leading up to it.  (I.e., Poole didn't throw an elbow into Green which triggered this or something similar.)

Green is an NBA vet in his mid-30's who is supposed to be a leader on his team.  An unproven young player a decade younger shouldn't have to worry about a punch that could have broken his jaw.

Green needs a suspension for sure.

[JayBirdHawk]

 

hope whoever it was got paid handsomely cuz...'you about to lose your job' 

[macdaddy]

3 minutes ago, JayBirdHawk said:

 

hope whoever it was got paid handsomely cuz...'you about to lose your job' 

It'll take a lot to convince me that the warriors front office didn't deliberately 'leak' that.   They will probably come down hard on Draymond and want to put the pressure on him to straighten up.  Video makes sure everyone knows he was in the wrong. 

 

[AHF]

14 minutes ago, JayBirdHawk said:

 

hope whoever it was got paid handsomely cuz...'you about to lose your job' 

Obviously leaked by someone who thought Green needed to be punished, imo.  

9 minutes ago, macdaddy said:

It'll take a lot to convince me that the warriors front office didn't deliberately 'leak' that.   They will probably come down hard on Draymond and want to put the pressure on him to straighten up.  Video makes sure everyone knows he was in the wrong. 

 

Probably the Warriors will come down more on the guy who leaked this than on Green.  Seems like they could have handled it in-house or at least have already taken some kind of meaningful action before it got leaked.

[hawkman]

7 minutes ago, AHF said:

They aren't on the streets.  On the streets, you have no idea who you are dealing with and need to know you could be dealing with someone who is violent and doesn't give a **** about the consequences.

They are teammates in practice.  Green is a multimillionaire leader of his team and (supposedly) a professionall.  He came off and started bumping into Poole in a sign of dominance.  Pushing back to create space between them is the expected reaction to that.  Throwing a punch is not expected among teammates in a practice, especially where there was no violence leading up to it.  (I.e., Poole didn't throw an elbow into Green which triggered this or something similar.)

Green is an NBA vet in his mid-30's who is supposed to be a leader on his team.  An unproven young player a decade younger shouldn't have to worry about a punch that could have broken his jaw.

Green needs a suspension for sure.

That altercation should have never got to that point. Green was being a jerk by getting in Poole's face. I have no problem with Poole pushing him off of him. But if you're going to do that, you have to be prepared for what usually comes next after that. I wasn't even shocked when Green punched him. The lead up to that punch looked like every single fight I've ever seen. Economic status and age doesn't matter when an altercation goes beyond words. The rules are the same:

1. Never underestimate your opponent.

2. In a physical altercation, ALWAYS get into a defensive fighting stance.

[JayBirdHawk]