Official Game Thread: Grizzlies at Hawks

[NBASupes]

4 minutes ago, AHF said:

Coaches build their culture.  If LP's culture is too lax, that is going to be a problem for him.  

I'm putting your Marbury 2.0 take in with Soth's Acie Law 2.0 take.  You'll be happy to look back on that and laugh that you ever compared the two.

Marbury 2.0 from a winning stance, not a player stance. He is miles beyond the best of Marbury. Like I said, if he gets it, we won't have this issue. His talent and skill is generational.

[NBASupes]

22 minutes ago, Spud2nique said:

What? I agree with most of what you said except this. Trae is one of the best decision makers in the NBA. He’s navigating the team and making great plays, even the best assist guys throughout history will have turnovers (if ur up there in assists historically your gonna have a few turns even Stockton did) and off nights.

Im still not on board with the Marbury comparisons. Marbury never got as much pure joy from a dime that Trae gets. We just have an ultra young team and there will be bumps like last night in the road where he’s physically and mentally drained from having to carry our team most nights. This won’t be the case moving forward and on to next year.

You really believe taking shots 19 seconds into the shot clock from 30+ ft in a 3 point game is good decision making skills? 

You are confusing playmaking talent with decision making skills. He is a tremendous playmaker. He has questionable decision making skills.

Its mentality, Trae is miles better than Marbury ever was.

Edited March 3, 2020 by NBASupes

[DS5]

4 minutes ago, NBASupes said:

You really believe taking shots 19 seconds into the shot clock from 30+ ft in a 3 point game is good decision making skills? 

When he makes them, absolutely. I don't think I need to explain why. 

Man.. Some of you... It's one freaking game...Shit happens... 

[NBASupes]

Just now, DS5 said:

When he makes them, absolutely. I don't think I need to explain why. 

Man.. Some of you... It's one freaking game...Shit happens... 

We lost a lot more games than we won doing this bullshit. 

[marco102]

12 minutes ago, NBASupes said:

You really believe taking shots 19 seconds into the shot clock from 30+ ft in a 3 point game is good decision making skills? 

You are confusing playmaking talent with decision making skills. He is a tremendous playmaker. He has questionable decision making skills.

Its mentality, Trae is miles better than Marbury ever was.

@NBASupes I get it you're mad about the loss, but you act like Trae is some five year veteran.  We can pull up plenty of quotes from you discussing Trae praising him when he has a good game and now you're making these proclamations because a second year player is guess what!?! Making bad decisions?  

I really don't get all these hot takes again.  The Hawks have won 4 of 7 AND they are 11 -12 in their last 23.  The team is making progress and yet you guys want to harp on a blow out loss to Memphis.  Every team has a stinker every now again. Young teams have them more.  

I wish you guys would stop being so damn inconsistent with the, "we are going to win 60 games" to the"  we are the worst team ever with no coach and no players". Again, set your expectations for what this is, a rebuilding team, and move on. You can't say we haven't made progress because we've looked pretty decent with our young core playing.  When one misses a game, we tend to lose. Just an observation. 

[JayBirdHawk]

12 minutes ago, NBASupes said:

We lost a lot more games than we won doing this bullshit. 

C'mon man...our losses this season should not be attributed to Trae shooting a 30 footer 19 seconds in the shot clock. That's ridiculous.

Some y'all just fickle.

(I've already noted I didn't like his mind set to start the game but heaping the entirety of the blame his way is ludicrous) 

[NBASupes]

1 hour ago, JayBirdHawk said:

C'mon man...our losses this season should not be attributed to Trae shooting a 30 footer 19 seconds in the shot clock. That's ridiculous.

Some y'all just fickle.

(I've already noted I didn't like his mind set to start the game but heaping the entirety of the blame his way is ludicrous) 

That's just an example of poor decision making skills 

[JayBirdHawk]

14 minutes ago, NBASupes said:

That's just an example of poor decision making skills 

You won't find me disagreeing with that regarding decision making but your stance attributing it to this season losses is just plain wrong.

[NBASupes]

1 hour ago, marco102 said:

@NBASupes I get it you're mad about the loss, but you act like Trae is some five year veteran.  We can pull up plenty of quotes from you discussing Trae praising him when he has a good game and now you're making these proclamations because a second year player is guess what!?! Making bad decisions?  

I really don't get all these hot takes again.  The Hawks have won 4 of 7 AND they are 11 -12 in their last 23.  The team is making progress and yet you guys want to harp on a blow out loss to Memphis.  Every team has a stinker every now again. Young teams have them more.  

I wish you guys would stop being so damn inconsistent with the, "we are going to win 60 games" to the"  we are the worst team ever with no coach and no players". Again, set your expectations for what this is, a rebuilding team, and move on. You can't say we haven't made progress because we've looked pretty decent with our young core playing.  When one misses a game, we tend to lose. Just an observation. 

I am not mad at Trae Young. I love Trae Young. I just see what Bonkers is saying. Trae Young is an exceptional talent and player. That said, he is one with critical flaws that impact winning. Not just winning for the playoffs but winning period. He has to make an effort to improve that. This is part of the reason why the USA Team keeps passing on him but no one wants to be honest with him and tell him, your shit stinks Trae, you are golden but your shit stinks. 

 

Sorry but he is not on the same level with Tatum, Morant, Doncic or Zion in terms of winning impact. He is every bit as talented if not more talented than some of them. But he doesn't play like a winner. I know a lot y'all hate when Reddit, the idiots from the Ringer and RealGM kill Trae but it's not exactly wrong either. If you watch the games, Trae got some awful habits. I was just watching film on LaMelo Ball. He has some of the same habits. 

For the betterment of Trae's career, he needs to decide what type of NBA player he wants to be. Does he want to be Michael Vick of the NBA. The face and box office or does he want to be a legend, ATG type, and an ultimate winner. 

Bonkers and Plainview aren't exactly wrong on Young even if their tone might seem as such. 

5 minutes ago, JayBirdHawk said:

You won't find me disagreeing with that regarding decision making but your stance attributing it to this season losses is just plain wrong.

It has more than you and I think. It's not the main problem but it's in the top 5 of this season's issues. 

Edited March 3, 2020 by NBASupes

[AtLaS]

19 minutes ago, NBASupes said:

That's just an example of poor decision making skills 

Yet he's still shooting 36% on 9+ 3pt attempts per game.  You are correct, but he's also 21 so I'm going to be a bit more lenient.  He's been pretty damn good with the long ball this year.  Hell, Luka is shooting 31% from 3 on 9 attempts per game, he's just launching stepbacks from all over the court with ppl draped all over him, and not making them yet everyone here praises him as if he's perfect.  As good as both players are, they both have a lot of room to improve.  And they will.

[JayBirdHawk]

13 minutes ago, NBASupes said:

I am not mad at Trae Young. I love Trae Young. I just see what Bonkers is saying. Trae Young is an exceptional talent and player. That said, he is one with critical flaws that impact winning. Not just winning for the playoffs but winning period. He has to make an effort to improve that. This is part of the reason why the USA Team keeps passing on him but no one wants to be honest with him and tell him, your shit stinks Trae, you are golden but your shit stinks. 

 

Sorry but he is not on the same level with Tatum, Morant, Doncic or Zion in terms of winning impact. He is every bit as talented if not more talented than some of them. But he doesn't play like a winner. I know a lot y'all hate when Reddit, the idiots from the Ringer and RealGM kill Trae but it's not exactly wrong either. If you watch the games, Trae got some awful habits. I was just watching film on LaMelo Ball. He has some of the same habits. 

For the betterment of Trae's career, he needs to decide what type of NBA player he wants to be. Does he want to be Michael Vick of the NBA. The face and box office or does he want to be a legend, ATG type, and an ultimate winner. 

Bonkers and Plainview aren't exactly wrong on Young even if their tone might seem as such. 

It has more than you and I think. It's not the main problem but it's in the top 5 of this season's issues. 

I can get to at least 7 things before I get to Trae's shooting/decision making regarding losses this season.

[NBASupes]

Just now, AtLaS said:

Yet he's still shooting 36% on 9+ 3pt attempts per game.  You are correct, but he's also 21 so I'm going to be a bit more lenient.  He's been pretty damn good with the long ball this year.  Hell, Luka is shooting 31% from 3 on 9 attempts per game, he's just launching stepbacks from all over the court with ppl draped all over him, and not making them yet everyone here praises him as if he's perfect.  As good as both players are, they both have a lot of room to improve.  And they will.

You can focus on a statement and come with a reply but literally everyone in our organization and most of our fans know Trae isn't a good decision maker and when he shows signs of being one like the game v. Portland, everyone is HAPPY! I know you feel the need to protect Trae and I get it. He's getting attacked by national fans and his achievements which are real are getting rejected to some fans as they simply don't like him. 

 

I don't just like Trae. He is my favorite Hawk since Al with a chance to be my favorite Hawk of all time with Cam as well depending on his continued growth.

I just can't overlook the truth. He has critical issues to winning impact. He's not the only one. So does John. I actually like Kevin potential impact but this is the wrong starting personnel for him. Same with Hunter. Cam is a WIP. Over the last 20 games, Cam has been our most important Hawk but before January, he was our least productive one and harming the team overall, especially on offense. 

Bruno is better than most people think he is but a lot worse than NC thinks he is. That said, he needs time to develop but the kid has talent. He just needs time to develop. 

Jeff has his moments but he's washed. Goodwin looks good for his role. Jones is trash. Dedmon is still Dedmon, maybe better in some ways than last year but a much worse shooter. He fits LP system to a T. I am surprised Dallas didn't make an offer for him. 

No one else really has winning impact. Just Kevin and De'Andre if they were on a superior team than this one. We really need development work. 

We aren't far but we aren't close. I just hope we don't land in Chicagoland where we just get stuck. Honestly, a few major adjustments from Trae alone and we could at least be a playoff level team even if no one outside of him improves, not including the addition of Capela.

Trae is our most critical to immediate success but long term is all about #22. As T. Prince said to Reddish, we only go as far as he takes us. When he said it, I was kinda shocked but it's March and I clearly see it. We only go as far as Reddish takes us. His development is just as critical as Trae.

[NBASupes]

5 minutes ago, JayBirdHawk said:

I can get to at least 7 things before I get to Trae's bad shot selection/decision making regarding losses this season.

Not really. 3, maybe. But not 7. 

1. Is the rookie wings. 

2. Lack of NBA center till Dedmon.

3. Trae lack of ability to make others better this season due to the above you stated. 

After that, it's not minor things but things that need to improve. But 1-3 were major issues regardless if you agree or not.

[JayBirdHawk]

26 minutes ago, NBASupes said:

Not really. 3, maybe. But not 7. 

1. Is the rookie wings. 

2. Lack of NBA center till Dedmon.

3. Trae lack of ability to make others better this season due to the above you stated. 

After that, it's not minor things but things that need to improve. But 1-3 were major issues regardless if you agree or not.

4. Damian Jones, 5. Roster construction (lack of vets), 6. Damian Jones, 7.John's suspensions, 8. Damian Jones, 9. no backup PG, 10. Damian Jones, 11. the defense (individual and team), 12. Damian Jones, 13. Rough strength of schedule, 14. Damian Jones, 15. Coaching, 16.Huerter's injury, 17. Jabari Parker, 18. Alex Len, 19.Damian Jones 20. Trae's defense......I can keep going.

[JayBirdHawk]

Our guards have been on a tear blocking shots, 

 

 

 

 

 

[NBASupes]

46 minutes ago, JayBirdHawk said:

4. Damian Jones, 5. Roster construction (lack of vets), 6. Damian Jones, 7.John's suspensions, 8. Damian Jones, 9. no backup PG, 10. Damian Jones, 11. the defense (individual and team), 12. Damian Jones, 13. Rough strength of schedule, 14. Damian Jones, 15. Coaching, 16.Huerter's injury, 17. Jabari Parker, 18. Alex Len, 19.Damian Jones 20. Trae's defense......I can keep going.

Jones and all centers is covered with #2. Roster construction was terribad but was it really that important. Charlotte had horrible roster construction last year and won 35+ games with a poor starting five as well.

Just look at our +/- with the core 5. John suspension is clearly #4. 

Defense can be covered by personnel grouping. You can add that at #5 but someone like Trae with his offensive metrics should more than overcome it.

Backup PG was a bad issue especially for off and on for offensive rating but our defense wasn't that bad with them either. While it was a need, did it really impact major winning? I believed it impact smaller wins and I was right but it didn't made a glandular change so its #5.

We did have a tough SOS and when it cooled down John wasn't there but we wasn't even competitive was the bigger issue.

Parker, Len, and Bembry all had positive WARs. Regardless if they fit or not, they weren't net negatives. 

Trae defense is really hurt more by his bad turnovers and decisions than most people think. I actually think his defense is better than the perception by a lot but he's a bad defender. Not this awful one that people try to make him out to be.

[NBASupes]

10 minutes ago, NBASupes said:

 Trae defense is really hurt more by his bad turnovers and decisions than most people think. I actually think his defense is better than the perception by a lot but he's a bad defender. Not this awful one that people try to make him out to be.

Speaking of the details...

 

[NBASupes]

Just now, NBASupes said:

Speaking of the details...

 

His threes are as good as turnovers at times.

[kg01]

24 minutes ago, NBASupes said:

His threes are as good as turnovers at times.

You've gone off the deep end, supers.

I feel it's my duty as de facto mod to put a hand on your shoulder here.

[bleachkit]

28 minutes ago, NBASupes said:

His threes are as good as turnovers at times.

When he's missing threes our defense gets killed, the data confirms that.