STAND PAT!!!!!!

[sturt]

21 minutes ago, macdaddy said:

How many 10th place teams made a move at the deadline and went on to win a title?   Travis is working on next year. 

How many teams were 3 games out of the traditional last playoff spot (8th) with 30-ish games left, and got there, and then made a run?

That's the more salient question.

I'll grant you that winning a title is a reach... but it's always a reach. It was a reach last year.

Get this team to the playoffs... with its youth and its budding maturity and its continuity and its playoff experience it can build off of from last year... and I'm just saying "why not us?"

There are no invincibles above us. None.

[AHF]

3 minutes ago, sturt said:

How many teams were 3 games out of the traditional last playoff spot (8th) with 30-ish games left, and got there, and then made a run?

Good question.  Would be interested to see the precedent there.   Pretty sure that doesn't describe any NBA champion.

The only team that came to my mind right away that made a big run from this potential position was the 1999 NY Knicks.  60% of the way through the season, they had a 17-13 record so they were not on the outside looking in at a similar stage.  They instead stumbled to an 8th seed after a weak 10-10 finish before going crazy in the playoffs and making the NBA Finals.

Anybody you are thinking of who had big success in this circumstance?

[sturt]

1 hour ago, AHF said:

Pretty sure that doesn't describe any NBA champion.

Champion? I'd agree.

Final four, though?

That's easier to imagine, and to be honest, that's my target until we get there.... and I don't even feel like I need precedent to justify it as a realistic target given what else I know about this particular situation.

 

(Then, of course, if we get there, then I'm sure I won't be the only one who feels strongly that we're a threat for the whole enchilada.)

 

Regardless, sounds like a great weekend research project when I get home (... ie, precedent). 

[sturt]

 

 

[Final_quest]

2 hours ago, macdaddy said:

How many 10th place teams made a move at the deadline and went on to win a title?   Travis is working on next year.  

I'm not upset we didn't make a deal, that's not really my point.  More like, how can we compare ourselves right now to a team on a Finals run?  It's closer to Jim Mora's playoffs rant.  Finals? FINALS?  The heck are we saying?    

[macdaddy]

I keep looking at our roster and all the trade freaking out.   We went to the conference finals last year with 3 of 5 starters still on rookie deals.   In reality it would have been 4 of 5 if Hunter was healthy.   

JC is now our highest paid player at 23 per.   The next 3 are Gallo, Capela, and Bogi.  All guys that most here are fine with getting rid of this summer because they are either considered ineffective or unneeded or both.  

It's crazy to even think we could go to the finals with most of our key players this young.  But here we are talking about it. 

[swanlee]

14 hours ago, hazer said:

 

JC Is great and has a good BB IQ, he's as athletic as Jsmooth was but smarter and more of a team player. If he keeps expanding his game he will be a star.

Never understood why so many want to get rid of him.

[sturt]

 

[sturt]

2 hours ago, Final_quest said:

More like, how can we compare ourselves right now to a team on a Finals run?  It's closer to Jim Mora's playoffs rant.  Finals? FINALS?  The heck are we saying?    

 

Right. I get that. And I would expect McM to have a Jim Mora reaction if he were to be asked a question that presumes we're on the Finals path.

 

But.

 

This is just us. And this is just for fun, and if you can't have fun in cheering for your team and being mostly positive and optimistic and hopeful...  then you're probably just a miserable old cynical goat with no better thing to do with your time than to grumble and complain and reassure yourself that your criticisms are all indication of just how supremely intelligent you are in comparison to all those Pollyannas.... hehehehe.

 

(NOT, and I mean this sincerely FQ, that you are the latter... I know you're trying to be as enthusiastic as you can, and I respect that.)

 

[Diesel]

We got just as good a chance as anybody.  Here are some of the things we have going for us:

1.  We're finally healthy.
2. We have what seems to be the best 2nd Unit in Basketball. 
3. We have the easiest schedule the rest of the way. 

It was hard watching us be injured, sick and getting kicked while having the third hardest schedule in basketball.  I believe a lot of our fans became fair weather and started to believe that last year was some kind of fluke.   Honestly, a lot of our fans believed that last year was a fluke before the season started. 

But Since Cam Left, we have gotten our shit together.  We don't look bad at all.   We have quality wins over good teams.  At first, I was mad about the Dallas loss but when I stepped back, I realized that Dallas has turned their season around too.  They are not slouches and we had dead legs during that game.  

Right now, I believe that we would give everybody we faced a really hard time in a 7 game series.  This is why we have to get to the 6th spot.  Without KD, Brooklyn keeps falling.  Boston and Charlotte are just teams we have to pass.  The only team that concerns me in the league is the returning champion Milwaukee Bucks.   Everybody else, I see us either matching or winning against in 7 games. 

So we have a good chance to do something special this year. 

 

 

[AHF]

5 hours ago, sturt said:

Champion? I'd agree.

Final four, though?

That's easier to imagine, and to be honest, that's my target until we get there.... and I don't even feel like I need precedent to justify it as a realistic target given what else I know about this particular situation.

 

(Then, of course, if we get there, then I'm sure I won't be the only one who feels strongly that we're a threat for the whole enchilada.)

 

Regardless, sounds like a great weekend research project when I get home (... ie, precedent). 

Legit look forward to it.  Like I said, the only team that jumped to mind was NY and they don't fit the mold since they were better early in the year than down the stretch.

[sturt]

 

 

[sturt]

7 hours ago, sturt said:

 

 

Actual video:

 

 

 

[Spud2nique]

24 minutes ago, sturt said:

 

 

Did he just say it’s C&C factory chemistry and camaraderie up in here.

Yes I concur.

[Final_quest]

On 2/11/2022 at 2:33 PM, sturt said:

 

Right. I get that. And I would expect McM to have a Jim Mora reaction if he were to be asked a question that presumes we're on the Finals path.

 

But.

 

This is just us. And this is just for fun, and if you can't have fun in cheering for your team and being mostly positive and optimistic and hopeful...  then you're probably just a miserable old cynical goat with no better thing to do with your time than to grumble and complain and reassure yourself that your criticisms are all indication of just how supremely intelligent you are in comparison to all those Pollyannas.... hehehehe.

 

(NOT, and I mean this sincerely FQ, that you are the latter... I know you're trying to be as enthusiastic as you can, and I respect that.)

 

I do have fun being a Hawks fan.  This particular season it’s been the two 7 game win streaks.  When the games are on I’m openly pulling for the team and really don’t even hate on the players.  However…
 

I’m also realistic about where we’re at, and will openly share my view on that.  It’s two separate things to me.   
 

1. I’m one of the very few people who said after the playoffs we need more talent and “wing stop” wasn’t gonna be enough.  
2. I think our run to the ECF wasn’t a fluke.  It was more like early Lebron playoff runs.  What did he eventually accept?  He needed a better supporting cast, which is where I think we are.  

I don’t think we’re as bad as our record, but certainly have some work to do to get to championship level.  Anyhow, we’ll not get a chance to see another year of this roster to know if it is good enough to win it all.  

[sturt]

50 minutes ago, Final_quest said:

I think our run to the ECF wasn’t a fluke.  It was more like early Lebron playoff runs.

The difference I perceive is that early LeBron CLE teams didn't have high-ceiling youth surrounding him like was on our roster last season (and continues to be this season). Varejao was the only other significant younger piece on that 50-win 2007 team when LBJ was Trae's age.

And there is chemistry that comes from continuity that cannot be gained any other way... unfortunate as that might be... "don't know what you got till it's gone."

But then, you actually have to play together to ascend to that chemistry, and when your rotation is never available through the first four months, and worse, it gets so bad that you've actually got G-League players... not even stars, but just players... getting the call to start? Can't make any judgments based on that. Not rational ones, anyway. Emotional ones, though, are always an option.

[Final_quest]

I would say this team has had plenty of chances to show they are ascending and growing their chemistry in spite of Covid, injuries, etc. I’m not seeing a team on the rise.  I’m seeing a team that needs an adjustment.

 

[sturt]

22 minutes ago, Final_quest said:

I would say this team has had plenty of chances to show they are ascending and growing their chemistry in spite of Covid, injuries, etc.

This is the tipping point difference, then, in how we think about this.

To me, I don't even know how one makes that case.

If one sets aside the 3-ish weeks that included a 7 game win streak and wins over MIL and PHX, there's never been stability in the rotation... when did these "plenty of chances" occur?

 

The apparent desire to showcase Cam skewed the 2nd unit's development...

And while you might be able to make-do by injecting the Tony Snells and Solomon Hill types into the rotation when facing injuries, this year, things have become so ridiculous at times that McM had to inject the guy who was literally the 15th player (TLC) into the rotation so much that a 5-man that included him was the 2nd most used 5-man for the entire season last I looked (2-3 weeks ago?).

 

I just don't know how one makes that case.

 

 

[Final_quest]

1 hour ago, sturt said:

This is the tipping point difference, then, in how we think about this.

To me, I don't even know how one makes that case.

If one sets aside the 3-ish weeks that included a 7 game win streak and wins over MIL and PHX, there's never been stability in the rotation... when did these "plenty of chances" occur?

 

The apparent desire to showcase Cam skewed the 2nd unit's development...

And while you might be able to make-do by injecting the Tony Snells and Solomon Hill types into the rotation when facing injuries, this year, things have become so ridiculous at times that McM had to inject the guy who was literally the 15th player (TLC) into the rotation so much that a 5-man that included him was the 2nd most used 5-man for the entire season last I looked (2-3 weeks ago?).

 

I just don't know how one makes that case.

 

 

We’ve had four key guys playing most of the season: Trae, Capela, Collins, and Huerter.  Enough to show we are better than a 10th seed.  Enough to not lose to scrub teams that had more players out like Houston, Orlando, and Portland games as an example, but there were several others.  We just lost to the Spurs to add to the list.

So many games we had the better roster.  We lost anyways.  The injuries were worse last year and we went 27-11.  

More than that, it’s been the effort and will to win that has been lacking.  We haven’t shown the heart of a champion, but for a few moments here and there.  Even Schlenk called the team out multiple times.  

Not sure how anyone watched this season and thinks this team is headed for a title as is.  I would use the word delusional to describe that perspective.  Not as an insult, but it truly is unfathomable to see us as victims rather than under performing.
 

 

[macdaddy]

Travis obviously concluded that there wasn't a deal out there at the deadline that would make much difference this season.   This season is what it is which is likely an early playoff exit. 

This summer there is plenty of possibility for improvement.   And unless your name is Trae you're on the block.