Hawks looking to trade

[SalvorMallow]

7 minutes ago, Phunkabilly said:

@Sothron did mention talks with NOP not too long ago that were centered around DJ and T.Murphy/H.Jones.  Soth, can you blink twice for us is this is the backbone of the deal being discussed now?

 

 

Lets do it. Start Bogi and trade hunter and the door Mat(t)s. 

[JTB]

8 hours ago, bleachkit said:

You are aware these things are extremely fluid right? 

Been around long enough. I don’t get too high or too low. You should know this about me by now. I just try to get as much info as possible from the insiders to put two and two together.

8 hours ago, ryandauwalker said:

Not JTB, but there is an overall acknowledgment that things are fluid… just trying to understand how to gauge expectations based on the chatter.
 

While I am not a big poster, I’ve been here since 2006 (I had to look to check!) and have seen enough to know both that our insiders have unique insight and also that nothing is done until it’s done.

What do you mean not JTB?….ive never shared an upset post about a big trade not happening. I’ve shared post on idiotic trades such as the JC and Huerter give away.

as I stated above I just want to get as much info as possible from the insiders.

Ive been following the hawks for decades and been on this board longer than what my actual join date shows. Any true hawks fan knows that this franchise never pulls off big trades but that doesn’t meant there’s no conversations taking place in the background.

 

for me sometimes just reading some positivity that the FO is even trying to get better provides a little peace. Like hearing about the high interest and serious talks about KAT is great!…we know it ain’t happening but I believe the insiders sources that the FO tried it lol

[JTB]

4 hours ago, Mikey said:

I don’t have a restriction but haven’t confirmed what the package is. I expect he’ll be in the big apple very soon. 

as for your second point I never got any confirmation on why he signed the extension. I heard a whisper of why he did it (LOL by him by the way) but the forum can talk about that on Tuesday 

This wouldn’t shock me at all. Knick fans are killing Leon rose for the OG trade saying he gave up too much but if he swings a deal for Murray they are going to very much be in love again.

you mentioned a young player….well considering Barrett and Quickly got traded already and Obi Toppin has already been traded I’m trying to understand who’s the good young talent that could come from the Knicks plus picks .

[JTB]

4 hours ago, RedDawg#8 said:

Sellers means we are more interested in getting off of our own players and their contracts than we are in “winning” a trade.

Think the early Schlenk trades to get back assets along with filler contracts.

I do not think we are getting any young player(s) that will be needle movers in any deal.

Look no further than the trades we have made in recent memory with Kev and JC. Those are the best examples of what is about to come if we truly are sellers right now.

I’m not intending to be negative but you have to look at track record with this current front office. They have not proven the savvy or the gumption to execute winning trades with other teams. Doesn’t mean they haven’t tried, but the clear message in switching from buyers to sellers indicates they have thrown in the towel on improving via trade. It’s about clearing the books now.

Exactly.

more than likely the DJ trade will not be a great one in terms of player returns.

also this isn’t a pack filled draft class coming into the nba this offseason. I’m not really in love with any high prospect so getting more picks for this offseason is a very blah move but again expected.

it would be nice if we could gain back some kind of depth out of the trade to help save the season however the FO track record isn’t good.

the only way I wouldn’t do a move is if they think they could swing a big deal in the summer by staying intact.

[Final_quest]

9 hours ago, Mikey said:

Don’t know the full details just the team. Haven’t heard how many picks are in it either and the protections. If they land the young player in it which I think they are it’s about as good value as they can get in a djm deal imo 

NY only has one young player that you would consider as having any value, Grimes.  That return would suck.  
Please tell me you mean the other NY team, Brooklyn.  
Fournier, Grimes and picks?  That is nightmare fuel.  

[Final_quest]

5 hours ago, RedDawg#8 said:

Sellers means we are more interested in getting off of our own players and their contracts than we are in “winning” a trade.

Think the early Schlenk trades to get back assets along with filler contracts.

I do not think we are getting any young player(s) that will be needle movers in any deal.

Look no further than the trades we have made in recent memory with Kev and JC. Those are the best examples of what is about to come if we truly are sellers right now.

I’m not intending to be negative but you have to look at track record with this current front office. They have not proven the savvy or the gumption to execute winning trades with other teams. Doesn’t mean they haven’t tried, but the clear message in switching from buyers to sellers indicates they have thrown in the towel on improving via trade. It’s about clearing the books now.

The way the NBA created the Play In there are very few sellers.  JC was different because he had such a big contract relative to his impact.  

But the Play In created multiple tiers where most teams have something to play for, and therefore fewer teams selling.  My hope is we can take advantage of that and get a good return.  

Hearing NY as the team for Murray sounds like a sick joke.  I’d be stunned.  Grimes and picks?  Can we at least get Josh Hart, too?  

[Bonzaii58]

If Murray goes to the Knicks I will be upset. I could live with and  prefer the Nets where we get some defenders and draft picks back from them. 
 

If we truly are trying to get younger and play the rookies, that doesn’t necessarily scream win now to me. Hard to think Trae would be onboard with wasting this year but who knows. 

Edited January 7 by Bonzaii58

[AHF]

6 hours ago, RedDawg#8 said:

Sellers means we are more interested in getting off of our own players and their contracts than we are in “winning” a trade.

Think the early Schlenk trades to get back assets along with filler contracts.

I do not think we are getting any young player(s) that will be needle movers in any deal.

Look no further than the trades we have made in recent memory with Kev and JC. Those are the best examples of what is about to come if we truly are sellers right now.

I’m not intending to be negative but you have to look at track record with this current front office. They have not proven the savvy or the gumption to execute winning trades with other teams. Doesn’t mean they haven’t tried, but the clear message in switching from buyers to sellers indicates they have thrown in the towel on improving via trade. It’s about clearing the books now.

That only works if you own your own picks.  The Hawks have to retool not do a tear down rebuild.  I’m hoping we would deal with a team like OKC, Houston, etc. with a bunch of young talent and picks which wants a former All-Star vet in his prime on a good longterm contract. 
 

The picks we get back in a trade are only of significant value if we can flip them promptly as part of a rebuild or the team we are trading with has a good chance to suck (like trading him to Detroit would be great from that perspective).  A first round pick that will be the 26th in the draft is not worth much to us in our current position.

Let me also add that both the Kev and JC trades were dump trades with clear motivations.  Kev was traded in the offseason to make sure we had zero chance of paying the tax (no risk of trying to deal him mid season and him getting hurt) but his contract and his play had value so we got a first back.  JC was a toxic contract traded at the absolute low point of his career to again ensure there was zero chance of us paying the tax.

Right now we are roughly $10M below the tax line.  There is zero risk of us paying the tax already.  Unlike JC, DM is quite valuable on his contract which looks amazing compared to someone like FVV’s deal. There is no rushing need to deal him other than that you need to reshape the roster.  Unlike the Kev and JC deals, this deal is about where we want to be as a franchise in a few years not about getting off a bad contract or getting under the tax line.  This better be a trade for basketball value not a dump deal where you hope to just get back something.

[Vol4ever]

Wonder how Trae feels about getting no help?   I thought this is what it was all about.  The front office was gonna go all in and get someone here to help Trae win. 

Now? They are sellers for nobody players and hopefully picks.  

In the next two years Trae will be the next big salary leaving town..........for nothing but role players and pics.   History tells us we don't know how to draft players.  

Buckle up buttercups!

[Final_quest]

13 minutes ago, AHF said:

That only works if you own your own picks.  The Hawks have to retool not do a tear down rebuild.  I’m hoping we would deal with a team like OKC, Houston, etc. with a bunch of young talent and picks which wants a former All-Star vet in his prime on a good longterm contract. 
 

The picks we get back in a trade are only of significant value if we can flip them promptly as part of a rebuild or the team we are trading with has a good chance to suck (like trading him to Detroit would be great from that perspective).  A first round pick that will be the 26th in the draft is not worth much to us in our current position.

Let me also add that both the Kev and JC trades were dump trades with clear motivations.  Kev was traded in the offseason to make sure we had zero chance of paying the tax (no risk of trying to deal him mid season and him getting hurt) but his contract and his play had value so we got a first back.  JC was a toxic contract traded at the absolute low point of his career to again ensure there was zero chance of us paying the tax.

Right now we are roughly $10M below the tax line.  There is zero risk of us paying the tax already.  Unlike JC, DM is quite valuable on his contract which looks amazing compared to someone like FVV’s deal. There is no rushing need to deal him other than that you need to reshape the roster.  Unlike the Kev and JC deals, this deal is about where we want to be as a franchise in a few years not about getting off a bad contract or getting under the tax line.  This better be a trade for basketball value not a dump deal where you hope to just get back something.

Very well said.  Murray for Grimes would read as a hard rebuild move, nothing soft about that.  
Not sure if the low for JC saw its peak with us.  Getting benched in Utah and having the worst plus minus on the team, feels lower.  His career has taken a crazy turn.
 

[NBASupes]

6 hours ago, Phunkabilly said:

A T-wolves fan with intimate knowledge of the 'Squawk?  What was his user name?  Rothson?

Sothron post on that board already under his real name

[kg01]

6 hours ago, skimaskway23 said:

Nah bruh, tell me it ain't Grimes

Let's just hope they didn't pop in to the big crApple for an Orange Julius ..... dot dot dot ...

6 hours ago, Phunkabilly said:

A T-wolves fan with intimate knowledge of the 'Squawk?  What was his user name?  Rothson?

Now that right there is funny.

Eta.  I might have ta use this sometime.  Don't worry, I'll give you credit (blame?). 

Edited January 7 by kg01

[ryandauwalker]

3 hours ago, JTB said:

Been around long enough. I don’t get too high or too low. You should know this about me by now. I just try to get as much info as possible from the insiders to put two and two together.

What do you mean not JTB?….ive never shared an upset post about a big trade not happening. I’ve shared post on idiotic trades such as the JC and Huerter give away.

as I stated above I just want to get as much info as possible from the insiders.

Ive been following the hawks for decades and been on this board longer than what my actual join date shows. Any true hawks fan knows that this franchise never pulls off big trades but that doesn’t meant there’s no conversations taking place in the background.

 

for me sometimes just reading some positivity that the FO is even trying to get better provides a little peace. Like hearing about the high interest and serious talks about KAT is great!…we know it ain’t happening but I believe the insiders sources that the FO tried it lol

Total misunderstanding!! I just meant it like “I am not JTB, but…” because the original post was directed to you, not me.

I know you have been here a long time and are very level headed and knowledgeable. Hopefully that clears it up!

[yungsta]

1 hour ago, AHF said:

Right now we are roughly $10M below the tax line.  There is zero risk of us paying the tax already.  Unlike JC, DM is quite valuable on his contract which looks amazing compared to someone like FVV’s deal. There is no rushing need to deal him other than that you need to reshape the roster.  Unlike the Kev and JC deals, this deal is about where we want to be as a franchise in a few years not about getting off a bad contract or getting under the tax line.  This better be a trade for basketball value not a dump deal where you hope to just get back something.

The insiders are saying there was a reason to why Murray signed the team friendly extension in the offseason. This is pure speculation but there must have been "wink wink" deal with the FO to get him to his desired destination if things went south that came with that extension which is why the FO are quickly & quietly moving him without much of a fight.

Murray could have absolutely put the hawks in a very tough position and get anything he wanted but he did the complete opposite which doesn't make sense to me. He only played here for 1 year, why would he have any loyalty to the hawks? (especially to this FO)

 

[JayBirdHawk]

10 hours ago, Sothron said:

I have been told DJm could be gone literally as soon as he is eligible to be traded. 

I think Mikey and I are hearing the same things in terms of what to expect back in return. I'm not allowed to say anything more than that. Not sure if Mikey has the same restriction but if a source asks to keep something mum it stays that way. 

I can just say expect him to be gone as early as he eligible to be traded. I also now know why DJM signed the extension. I won't share that until he is no longer a Hawk because it would be moot at that point as to why he signed it. 

I hate sounding cryptic but I'm trying to let you guys and gal know what's going on without betraying sources confidence.

Edit: young player PLUS picks is what I am expecting at this point. I also have been told the FO has went from buyers to sellers for several other players now. Only Trae and JJ are safe. This could be a real cleaning out the locker room and making way for rookies and young guys to play the rest of the season.

I think part of that is DJ going to a team of his choice. He probably didn't have an interest in going to Toronto.

[RedDawg#8]

2 hours ago, Final_quest said:

NY only has one young player that you would consider as having any value, Grimes.  That return would suck.  
Please tell me you mean the other NY team, Brooklyn.  
Fournier, Grimes and picks?  That is nightmare fuel.  

On God I am praying that it’s Brooklyn, but all the smoke has been coming from the Knicks so I doubt it.

[NekiEcko]

8 hours ago, Mikey said:

I don’t have a restriction but haven’t confirmed what the package is. I expect he’ll be in the big apple very soon. 

as for your second point I never got any confirmation on why he signed the extension. I heard a whisper of why he did it (LOL by him by the way) but the forum can talk about that on Tuesday 

The Knicks would love to have a player like Murray, with him and Brunson I can see them doing damage against C's and Bucks but there is nobody on that team i would want but I wish we can send him to Brooklyn and they have better players and picks as well.

 

[RedDawg#8]

Murray to the Knicks makes even less sense when you consider that his whole motivation for leaving us is to go back to playing his “natural” position. That would be complete hypocrisy.

I pray it’s Brooklyn.

[RedDawg#8]

2 hours ago, AHF said:

That only works if you own your own picks.  The Hawks have to retool not do a tear down rebuild.  I’m hoping we would deal with a team like OKC, Houston, etc. with a bunch of young talent and picks which wants a former All-Star vet in his prime on a good longterm contract. 
 

The picks we get back in a trade are only of significant value if we can flip them promptly as part of a rebuild or the team we are trading with has a good chance to suck (like trading him to Detroit would be great from that perspective).  A first round pick that will be the 26th in the draft is not worth much to us in our current position.

Let me also add that both the Kev and JC trades were dump trades with clear motivations.  Kev was traded in the offseason to make sure we had zero chance of paying the tax (no risk of trying to deal him mid season and him getting hurt) but his contract and his play had value so we got a first back.  JC was a toxic contract traded at the absolute low point of his career to again ensure there was zero chance of us paying the tax.

Right now we are roughly $10M below the tax line.  There is zero risk of us paying the tax already.  Unlike JC, DM is quite valuable on his contract which looks amazing compared to someone like FVV’s deal. There is no rushing need to deal him other than that you need to reshape the roster.  Unlike the Kev and JC deals, this deal is about where we want to be as a franchise in a few years not about getting off a bad contract or getting under the tax line.  This better be a trade for basketball value not a dump deal where you hope to just get back something.

Nothing you just said is wrong in logic, but it is ignoring ALL of the smoke that has been coming out.

DJ wants to be traded, that is starting to leak with even the Shams of the world so it is true and we fans aren’t the only ones who know it. That removes the leverage that we have in controlling his value contract.

Soth says a deal is as good as done that could go down the very moment he becomes trade eligible. Mikey leaked a destination, you can do math for yourself what assets are in that entire city.

This is not about what we SHOULD do, this is dealing with the ongoing information of what we WILL do. Everything is pointing to the increasing possibility that we will get less than ideal value back in return for dealing Murray.

And that is where the comparisons come from regarding Kev and JC trades. We can explain them away in hindsight but nobody was pleased at the time with basically giving those two away. We are headed there again based on how much you believe the inside intel. We are not winning any trades and you can add DJ to the list by the sounds of it.

If you can’t get talent in return, the  only thing left is picks and capspace. What have we shown we can do between those options?

Edited January 7 by RedDawg#8

[Spud2nique]

7 hours ago, Phunkabilly said:

A T-wolves fan with intimate knowledge of the 'Squawk?  What was his user name?  Rothson?

Never heard of him but I heard he’s an insid(her)3r. 

7 hours ago, SalvorMallow said:

 

 

Lets do it. Start Bogi and trade hunter and the door Mat(t)s. 

Yes!