2020-21 The Current Ask Supes

[kg01]

1 hour ago, capstone21 said:

What bu pgs are we targeting?

I'm hoping we end up with Dragic but after getting screwed on money/years by MIA he'll probably be looking to go to the highest bidder, which won't likely be us.

[NBASupes]

2 hours ago, thecampster said:

1). We are in the dead period an all trades involving players need to be completed after 8/2.  GS does not/will not have TPE's to use in this space.

2). Philly has TPE's to use but nothing close to what would absorb Ball's new salary.

3). I can confirm that backup PG is their number 1 priority in the draft, F/A, pick up games in the neighborhood, trade, games of horse after practice. They are looking everywhere for Trae's backup. Bruno/Dunn are being shopped but as filler/pick swaps.

4. ATL won't pass on a SG but it is not their focus. Their number one mission is to use 20 to improve the roster. They are interested in PG/PF/C in that order. This one threw me for a loop.

5. They are looking to move down or package 20. They are looking to move up, package future picks with 48.

1. Where is GS getting a TPE at? They are in the LT, they would have to trade player/picks for player.

2. Toronto can give Philly a TPE for Simmons (33)/picks (9) which would equal up to 24 million but they have to clear space and can only have 3 players on their active roster that to happen.

3 and 4. Same thing being heard.

5. I haven't heard anything concrete on this front from my guy other than typical chatter. 

[thecampster]

Just now, NBASupes said:

1. Where is GS getting a TPE at? They are in the LT, they would have to trade player/picks for player.

2. Toronto can give Philly a TPE for Simmons (33)/picks (9) which would equal up to 24 million but they have to clear space and can only have 3 players on their active roster that to happen.

3 and 4. Same thing being heard.

5. I haven't heard anything concrete on this front from my guy other than typical chatter. 

My numbers are from your list. See the bolded in my reply. I identified those 5 things to talk about.

Yours stated TP in both situations.

[georgia]

Question:    If we sign Collins to an extension, does that money kick in the upcoming season or next?

[thecampster]

8 hours ago, NBASupes said:

Here's the BIG news: 

1) I am also told they are looking to trade 7th/14th overall/TPE for Ben Simmons.

They have to get rid of Malachi Flynn to make the money work and are targeting a couple of 2nds and someone who can take him with a TPE. I am told Atlanta is very interested. This is massive news to Hawk fans as this one could possibly go down. 

2) Philly is targeting Lonzo Ball on a SnT with NO using the TPE to take on his salary. They are also planning on keeping 7th/14th overall to build around as well as 28th overall. Philly wants to build up their bench and get potential fits around Embiid. I am told Kuminga could be a Sixer. 

No new update on McCollum. 

I was told OKC didn't offer Shai and 6 for Cade. 

I was also told for HOU to get Cade, it will cost them a pick swap and another lightly protected 1st. I was told, HOU is out on moving up unless the cost is significantly more reasonable. They are targeting what DAL paid ATL for Luka/Trae. DET is targeting a much greater 

HOU and NY are getting closer to moving up for a higher pick but the cost is too great at this time for both teams. 

3) Atlanta is aggressively targeting backup PGs on the trade block. Bruno and Dunn have also been offered with picks. 

4) Atlanta focus is SGs in the draft which is where the most talent is in this draft. Makes me think that Atlanta is thinking about moving Kevin or Bogi sooner than later or maybe just having a backup just in case they leave. There are players Atlanta loves but they don't expect that player to be there at 20. If there, Atlanta could draft in a different direction.

I can confirm, Cam Reddish WON'T be traded for a pick. A star, possibly but he's extremely valuable to them and maybe too valuable to where he's not traded at all which is personally what I hope happens. 

5) I was told Atlanta is willing to move up or down if the price is right. As of right now, it seems like they will stick where they are.

Taken from your post...the numbers used/bolded. It was hidden for you (especially if you were on mobile).

[NBASupes]

1 hour ago, capstone21 said:

What bu pgs are we targeting?

Tyus Jones was getting some action. 

Aaron Holiday, Malachi Flynn, etc.

Atlanta had interest in White but they wanted a core player and that wasn't appealing to TS. 

As I continue to State, TS is aggressive but he's extremely protective of the core. You gonna have to offer the world to get him to move just Hureter. The core as TS sees it is Cam, Kev, Trae, DAH, and Okongwu. Critical players are Bogi and Capela. He values Gallo but could move him if a critical player became available and as put him in talks recently but nothing came of it 

[thecampster]

1 minute ago, georgia said:

Question:    If we sign Collins to an extension, does that money kick in the upcoming season or next?

Until we sign Collins, he has a cap hold of about $12 million in place. For purposes of cap discussion.

Once we sign Collins, his 2021/22 salary is what is used to calculated cap flexibility going forward.

For that reason, we may "announce" a signing/match with Collins but will "process" his deal last if we are trying to sign/trade for someone.

 

for those not sure,  The league will "process" and "calculate" deals after the dead period in the order received, not the order they happen.  So we will submit them in the most advantageous manner for the purposes of cap calculation.

 

Moving on to Collins. We have extended a "Qualifying offer". This is the minimum the team can offer. He will undoubtedly find his own deal and we will match or not. This will invalidate the qualifying offer once he signs with us or another and the first year salary will kick in this year 21/22. Currently, Collins is not signed for 21/22 or going forward. He is a free agent but under restrictions (right to match). He can accept the Qualifying Offer or get his own Free Agent deal in a signed offer sheet. The restriction is we have the right to match that offer sheet and keep him at the deal he negotiated with another team.

[thecampster]

2 minutes ago, NBASupes said:

Tyus Jones was getting some action. 

Aaron Holiday, Malachi Flynn, etc.

Atlanta had interest in White but they wanted a core player and that wasn't appealing to TS. 

As I continue to State, TS is aggressive but he's extremely protective of the core. You gonna have to offer the world to get him to move just Hureter. The core as TS sees it is Cam, Kev, Trae, DAH, and Okongwu. Critical players are Bogi and Capela. He values Gallo but could move him if a critical player became available and as put him in talks recently but nothing came of it 

I like how you phrased that, Core, Critical, expendable...with Gallo between critical and expendable.

[NBASupes]

3 minutes ago, thecampster said:

Taken from your post...the numbers used/bolded. It was hidden for you (especially if you were on mobile).

Toronto gives the TPE/picks for Simmons. Consider it like the last deal. Just go back to the LAL AD trade that involved a lot of teams like the Hawks. Toronto at this point will already have Beal, FVV, O.G., 7th and 14th overall. With 7 incomplete roster spots considering they waive all non guaranteed and cap holds. Flynn would have to be moved to create amount salary floor for the trade so TOR can take all of Simmons salary.

[capstone21]

5 minutes ago, NBASupes said:

Tyus Jones was getting some action. 

Aaron Holiday, Malachi Flynn, etc.

Atlanta had interest in White but they wanted a core player and that wasn't appealing to TS. 

As I continue to State, TS is aggressive but he's extremely protective of the core. You gonna have to offer the world to get him to move just Hureter. The core as TS sees it is Cam, Kev, Trae, DAH, and Okongwu. Critical players are Bogi and Capela. He values Gallo but could move him if a critical player became available and as put him in talks recently but nothing came of it 

Flynn doesn't move the needle but would be very interested in us bring in Holiday.  I think he is pretty solid backup.

Personally I would like a real vet there but would be happy with anyone who is solid.

[thecampster]

Let me clarify that cap hold situation this year.

 

     Free Agent Cap Holds                        20/21                      21/22                    22/23                  23/24                                                            

Free Agent Cap Holds
Tony Snell		$ 18,267,857	$ 18,267,857	$ 18,267,857
Lou Williams		$ 15,200,000	$ 15,200,000	$ 15,200,000
John Collins		$ 12,411,906	$ 12,411,906	$ 12,411,906
Brandon Goodwin		$ 2,116,290	$ 2,116,290	$ 2,116,290
Solomon Hill		$ 1,669,193	$ 1,719,248	$ 1,805,206
Nathan Knight		$ 1,489,065	$ 1,489,065	$ 1,489,065
Skylar Mays		$ 1,489,065	$ 1,489,065	$ 1,489,065

Edited July 27, 2021 by thecampster

[gurpilo]

I would say Flynn is better than Holiday

[kg01]

Just now, capstone21 said:

Flynn doesn't move the needle but would be very interested in us bring in Holiday.  I think he is pretty solid backup.

Personally I would like a real vet there but would be happy with anyone who is solid.

That would be personally satisfying to me and my petty brain since he's one the list of guys the eggsperts said would be better than Trae.

Only thing I remember about Flynn is he lit us up in garbage time that one game.  Folks seem to be high on him.

[NBASupes]

2 minutes ago, capstone21 said:

Flynn doesn't move the needle but would be very interested in us bring in Holiday.  I think he is pretty solid backup.

Personally I would like a real vet there but would be happy with anyone who is solid.

The FA market has a number of them but competition is stiff

[thecampster]

2 minutes ago, NBASupes said:

Toronto gives the TPE/picks for Simmons. Consider it like the last deal. Just go back to the LAL AD trade that involved a lot of teams like the Hawks. Toronto at this point will already have Beal, FVV, O.G., 7th and 14th overall. With 7 incomplete roster spots considering they waive all non guaranteed and cap holds. Flynn would have to be moved to create amount salary floor for the trade so TOR can take all of Simmons salary.

No you wrote 7/14 + TPE. Those picks are held by GS.

So maybe I missed you moving 7/14 to Toronto for 4???

[NBASupes]

Just now, thecampster said:

No you wrote 7/14 + TPE. Those picks are held by GS.

So maybe I missed you moving 7/14 to Toronto for 4???

The GS/Toronto trade. Remember Siakam for Wiggins and the picks

[thecampster]

8 hours ago, NBASupes said:

Here's the BIG news: 

 

They are targeting a deal with GS which gives GS 7th and 14th overall as well as Wiggins. GS gets Siakam. 

They are also targeting a deal with Wiggins/4th overall for Beal. I was told this is extremely attractive to WAS who wants at least one potential All Star on a rookie contract and Suggs or Mobley is on the top of their list. I actually think Atlanta and Miami offers a lot more, especially Atlanta but it seems they really want one of these rookies from the top 4 of this class. 

I am also told they are looking to trade 7th/14th overall/TPE for Ben Simmons.

They have to get rid of Malachi Flynn to make the money work and are targeting a couple of 2nds and someone who can take him with a TPE. I am told Atlanta is very interested. This is massive news to Hawk fans as this one could possibly go down. 

 

Okay I understand. These are all unified thoughts. Dude that's complicated.  

[JayBirdHawk]

21 minutes ago, NBASupes said:

Tyus Jones was getting some action. 

Aaron Holiday, etc.

Had these guys on my list for a 2nd rounder or 2.

[sturt]

Flynn

Per TOR bloggersphere, Flynn stunk up the first half of the season, then lit their world on fire in the second. Was rookie of the month in April.

What makes me happy is that I'm all about seeing that whoever we get has a history of posting 20+ point games. I don't want a game manager. That's more Rondo like. I want someone who can plausibly come into a game and help the offense get going... LouWill like. Flynn got 4 of those last season. I'm good with that.

Still would prefer Derrick Rose. Someone who's been there, and made the clutch shots.

 

Free agency

Don't see why we wouldn't renounce all of our UFAs straight away, so that we actually can use cap space to make a move.

[thecampster]

3 minutes ago, NBASupes said:

The GS/Toronto trade. Remember Siakam for Wiggins and the picks

Okay so now that I understand that. there are flaws though this is pretty good.

 

There are a number of non-guaranteed contracts on Toronto. For each one they waive, they will incur a minimum roster charge for calculating.

I need some time to see if there's room for this created TPE you're creating. #1 issue is the cap hold for the picks.  But you're moving those picks to Philly. I just did the math and no, you don't have to move Flynn to make this work. They can do it without moving Flynn.

This means renouncing Lowry and not being able to use him in a SNT.  They have $31 million in non-guaranteed salaries and an amount of cap holds I need an abacus for: see below.

Free Agent Cap Holds
Lucas Nogueira	$ 8,841,915	$ 8,841,915	$ 8,841,915	$ 8,841,915
Malcolm Miller	$ 1,985,289	$ 1,985,289	$ 1,985,289	$ 1,985,289
Nando De Colo	$ 1,901,900	$ 1,901,900	$ 1,901,900	$ 1,901,900
Jason Thompson	$ 1,620,564	$ 1,669,178	$ 1,719,248	$ 1,805,206
Jeremy Lin	$ 1,620,564	$ 1,669,178	$ 1,719,248	$ 1,805,206
Jodie Meeks	$ 1,620,564	$ 1,669,178	$ 1,719,248	$ 1,805,206
Kyle Lowry		$ 39,344,900	$ 40,525,100	$ 42,551,250
OG Anunoby		$ 11,616,645	$ 11,616,645	$ 11,616,645
Patrick McCaw		$ 7,600,000	$ 7,600,000	$ 7,600,000
Stanley Johnson		$ 4,945,395	$ 4,945,395	$ 4,945,395
Gary Trent Jr.		$ 2,079,826	$ 2,079,826	$ 2,079,826
Alize Johnson		$ 2,025,705	$ 2,025,705	$ 2,025,705
Jalen Harris		$ 1,489,065	$ 1,489,065	$ 1,489,065
Paul Watson		$ 1,489,065	$ 1,489,065	$ 1,489,065

 

Worried about column 2 here. In order for this to work, they can't retain more than $10 million in the free agent cap hold players and/or the guaranteed contract players.  So theoretically this could work to get Simmons to Toronto and hold on to the 4th pick.  If it happens, god bless them. I don't have those marbles.