2021 Atlanta Hawks Summer League Thread

[RedDawg#8]

41 minutes ago, bleachkit said:

I disagree. I think one of the most common misconceptions is that defense is all about effort. Makes for nice coach speak, but it's not true. Defense is a skill, like being able to shoot or being able to dunk. No amount of effort would make Shaq a great three point shooter. No amount of effort would make Trae a great dunker. Defense requires length, anticipation, instincts, lateral quickness. Most of that is God given. 

I counter your disagree with another disagree. 

All of those attributes help you to succeed on defense, but only the physical aspects are God given, like Size and quickness, and even having those does not make you a great defender.

Alex Len has size, not a great defender. Kyrie Irving has elite lateral mobility, not a great defender. Michael Porter Jr has size and mobility, not a great defender. 

Fred Van Vleet, and Kyle Lowery are both short, but can lock up on defense.

I agree that instincts and anticipation are important, but disagree on that being God-Given. Those can be developed over time through experience and reps. If you play basketball long enough, you tend to pick up on stuff eventually that you got burned on when you were younger. The mental part of the game never stops developing. Some cats may start off ahead of others but that is not a fixed attribute by any means.

It may sound like coach speak to you, but I have seen it over and over and over. Guys who are shitty defenders 90% of the time, decide they want to lock up on a guy, and they can make a stop. It's all starts inside.

If you have that mentality AND all of the physical God-given attributes, then you are cooking with hot grease.

Jalen Johnson is a great example of my point. He has been a game changer on defense at times, but down the stretch last game his "effort" waned and you saw him get beat repeatedly by guys he outmatches physically. 

You have to be locked in and willing to compete first and foremost.  My point was that Sharife has something that you can build upon, because he has the right mindset. He needs to get stronger, he needs to anticipate screens better. But you can work with him because he wont give up on the play.

I do not put dunking and shooting in the same category as defense. EVEN THOUGH you can improve both your shooting and your vertical over time. 

[Hawkmoor]

3 hours ago, terrell said:

Where is the "headcase" stuff coming from? The kid was pretty much benched after coming back from a foot injury at Duke..Why fk up his draft status by sitting on the sidelines with Coach K( who couldnt care less if he was drafted or not)?.Why not go ahead and train for the draft without having to deal with classes and everything else? Especially when he wasnt 100% healthy......Jalen didnt owe Duke a damn thing...I wouldve left too....He didnt quit. He made a calculated decision...

Which is WHY I've been saying college players should get paid.  They are exploited, and then, when they take up for themselves and try and make their family better, suddenly, the player is a problem.  The NBA inserted that one and done crap to prevent players like JJ from going straight from college to getting paid.

[Hawkmoor]

8 hours ago, NBASupes said:

You gotta fill out College Park with good gleague players. I seen enough to know that both players would be good in the Gleague.

WHY are you insisting these guys have to go to College Park?  There is nothing College Park is gonna do for them that they can't accomplish on the main squad.  Especially JJ.  Dude is already the best post player the Hawks got and that includes Collins. If they do go to College Park, it would be because Travis doesn't have room for them on the main squad (get the Hawks return of value out of Gallinari and several other contracts). It will not be because thats where they should go.

Edited August 13, 2021 by Hawkmoor

[RandomFan]

Not to mention that his teammates have deprived him of a plethora of additional assists because they couldn't catch his passes or convert easy shots when they did.  

[kg01]

21 minutes ago, Hawkmoor said:

WHY are you insisting these guys have to go to College Park?  There is nothing College Park is gonna do for them that they can't accomplish on the main squad.  Especially JJ.  Dude is already the best post player the Hawks got and that includes Collins. If they do go to College Park, it would be because Travis doesn't have room for them on the main squad (get the Hawks return of value out of Gallinari and several other contracts). It will not be because thats where they should go.

Get playing time.

I feel a lot of us are reading too much into SL.  Cooper won't help us for quite a while,despite looking good so far vs SL comp.

Thats not a knock.

[jy23]

5 hours ago, AHF said:

One of the reasons he fell was the big unknown with injuries and his leaving multiple HS and Duke.  Some have translated that into him being a head case.  I translate it into a discount buying opportunity.  Risk/reward in a good ratio as most #20 picks aren’t anything special.

Him leaving school to focus on the draft in a year where pro players skipped due to Covid, the NCAA was being sued for illegally blocking players from being paid and other basketball players opted out of the tourney to protect their pro careers makes someone’s decision to leave school need a much more nuanced analysis than if someone did it in 1995. It is a different world right now.

We’ll get to know him over time and find out if it was just a media narrative or not.

As a Duke fan I’m well aware of his history and none of that makes me feel anyway about him. The switching high school thing could be chalked up to so much that idk how anyone would try to pull anything from that. That’s what these kids do now. It’s not the old days and people need to understand that. He’s not a trouble maker, very quiet kid who goes about his business. And we’re doing a lot of talking bc he was frustrated in a summer league game. I just think the board is doing the most right now 

[NBASupes]

1 hour ago, Hawkmoor said:

WHY are you insisting these guys have to go to College Park?  There is nothing College Park is gonna do for them that they can't accomplish on the main squad.  Especially JJ.  Dude is already the best post player the Hawks got and that includes Collins. If they do go to College Park, it would be because Travis doesn't have room for them on the main squad (get the Hawks return of value out of Gallinari and several other contracts). It will not be because thats where they should go.

Playing Time

Leadership Training

Games that matter.

Playing in front of a paying audience

Playing the role you will play for the NBA in the Gleague. 

The Gleague is invaluable for Cooper and Johnson. They will still be training and practicing with the main team but most of their PT will come from College Park.

 

Raptors 905 and Sioux Falls have done an elite job with their Gleague programs for the NBA. 

Edited August 13, 2021 by NBASupes

[NBASupes]

3 hours ago, niremetal said:

What's your (and everyone else's) prediction on what we do with Skylar? You thinking we'll give him our second two-way deal?

It depends on what he wants to do. He can take our offer or someone could offer him a roster spot which is what he's looking for. 

[bleachkit]

2 hours ago, NBASupes said:

It depends on what he wants to do. He can take our offer or someone could offer him a roster spot which is what he's looking for. 

He wont get minutes with us unfortunately. Probably wont get minutes anywhere. I think his future is as an off ball scorer, not as a natural point. 

[RandomFan]

I'm sure Mays is waiting to see if he gets a 15 man roster spot offer from any team after summer league is over, if not then he will likely stick with us again on a 2-way contract. And that's just smart business on his part.

But basketball wise, his best case scenario is as a Lou replacement for the 2022 season. And he would do well to continue to spend another season learning from Lou, get some G League burn and be ready to step into that role after next season when we'll need more minimum contract bench players after some of these contracts start kicking in. 

Edited August 14, 2021 by RandomFan

[sturt]

As I understand any two-way player's position, once he's been given a qualifying offer, he's under team control as would be any other RFA. Thus, if he gets a better offer than the two-way from ATL, Schlenk will have the opportunity to match that. Failing that, the RFA will be playing for ATL as a two-way, or I suppose his one other legit option is to look at overseas opportunities. But to the point, outside of that, he's getting paid by Tony Ressler this year again.

There was a time when I thought Schlenk might reward Mays with a standard contract, as an atta-boy gesture, and to set some precedent that if you work hard, this organization rewards that.

I'm less inclined right now to think that will happen than I did a couple of weeks ago, based on what quotes we've heard from Schlenk, who it seems is being very calculating with how he handles that one last roster slot.

[niremetal]

5 hours ago, sturt said:

As I understand any two-way player's position, once he's been given a qualifying offer, he's under team control as would be any other RFA. Thus, if he gets a better offer than the two-way from ATL, Schlenk will have the opportunity to match that. Failing that, the RFA will be playing for ATL as a two-way, or I suppose his one other legit option is to look at overseas opportunities. But to the point, outside of that, he's getting paid by Tony Ressler this year again.

There was a time when I thought Schlenk might reward Mays with a standard contract, as an atta-boy gesture, and to set some precedent that if you work hard, this organization rewards that.

I'm less inclined right now to think that will happen than I did a couple of weeks ago, based on what quotes we've heard from Schlenk, who it seems is being very calculating with how he handles that one last roster slot.

Yeah, I also had really been hoping to see both Sky and Nathan Knight get contracts. As a layman fan, I'd have rather seen them get the two roster spots than Lou and Solo.

But this is definitely one of those Trust In Travis Schlenk situations. He/Coach Nate obviously gave an infinitely better insight into how important a role those guys play in the locker room. If he views their intangible roles as more important than whatever TS sees as the ceiling for our marginal younger guys...well it's nice to be in a position where we're competitive enough that letting the younger guys go is arguably the more sensible move. 

Edited August 14, 2021 by niremetal

[hazer]

7 hours ago, niremetal said:

As a layman fan, I'd have rather seen them get the two roster spots than Lou and Solo.

 

Lou is valuable as a seasoned playoffs-experienced mentor to the young’nz (Coop, Cam, K’Von) and strong insurance at PG/SG. Solo is there for locker room voice and to knock you right the f**ck off the court if you want to f**ck around and find out. He’s the only enforcer on the team, you gotta have that. And the jokes, Solo got jokes.

[JayBirdHawk]

Early Game today:

 

 

[bleachkit]

3 hours ago, hazer said:

Lou is valuable as a seasoned playoffs-experienced mentor to the young’nz (Coop, Cam, K’Von) and strong insurance at PG/SG. Solo is there for locker room voice and to knock you right the f**ck off the court if you want to f**ck around and find out. He’s the only enforcer on the team, you gotta have that. And the jokes, Solo got jokes.

I don't understand the point of paying a guy 5 million a year to be a mentor. Why not just hire a coach to be a mentor at 1/10 the cost? 

[terrell]

 

Welp.....

 

 

Brad Rowland

 

Sharife Cooper is out today due to health and safety protocols.

Edited August 14, 2021 by terrell

[terrell]

What a block by Jalen...Was that not a goaltend? lol

[niremetal]

25 minutes ago, bleachkit said:

I don't understand the point of paying a guy 5 million a year to be a mentor. Why not just hire a coach to be a mentor at 1/10 the cost? 

I don't pretend to know the dynamics of an NBA locker room specifically. But in every setting where I've experienced it, the dynamics and relationships change pretty radically when someone goes from being a colleague to a boss/lead/trainer/etc. Making Lou or Solo a coach might kill whatever effectiveness they have as elders among equals.

[Dnice]

Rife is still present..i thought you'd have to be away. 

[hawkman]

So glad Johnson isn't a black hole when he gets the ball on offense.