The cobbled together, stuff we held on to during the playoffs mega super rumor and team direction thread.

[Spud2nique]

Just now, shakes said:

lol, just stop.

I was gonna say that but.. a lil respect here please, for the mod 

 

But that was my first reaction too LIKE OH GEEZ  LOUISEEEEE …(yes I apparently live in 1964 here).

[Spud2nique]

2 minutes ago, shakes said:

lol, just stop.

It’s you me and @kg01 sailing drinking zimas baby! 
 

ps Bring the yellow hat.

[Diesel]

2 hours ago, marco102 said:

If you want to trade Kevin, it needs to be for a clear upgrade. Burke is not that. I don't have a problem with someone moving Kevin, but Burke is 7 years older and not a clear upgrade. 

I never said Trade Kev for Burks?

I said Trade for Burks...I believe the deal was Bogi for Burke/Noel.  That's not trading Kev.    Kev will come off the bench..

Also, in your comparison of Burke for Kev.. Like I said, Burks is not flashy.. but

• Burks is a better defender. 
• He shoots the three better.
• He handles the ball better. 
• He doesn't make the same dumb fouls that Kev makes. 

Aside from Brogdon, Delon Burkes is a big 2 who can play defense and handle the ball. 

[AHF]

33 minutes ago, Spud2nique said:

I was gonna say that but.. a lil respect here please, for the mod 

 

But that was my first reaction too LIKE OH GEEZ  LOUISEEEEE …(yes I apparently live in 1964 here).

Guess you guys forgot how much it pissed off his teammates because he apparently did the same thing touching all their stuff in the locker-room.  When asked about Gobert's apology for being "reckless" in an interview, Mitchell said on national TV that he was pissed:

Quote

“To be honest with you, it took a while for me to kind of cool off,” Mitchell told Roberts. “I read what he said, and I heard what he said, so I’m glad he’s doing OK. I’m glad I’m doing well. I’m just really happy ... that it wasn’t the whole party. At the end of the day, neither him or I have children at home. I know I have some teammates and staff who have children at home, so I’m glad we were able to kind of contain it.”

Doesn't seem to have a good sense of how to communicate with his most important teammate.  Stupid stuff pissing off Mitchell in March of 2020 and stupid comment(s) that foreseeably pissed off Mitchell in May of 2022.

[marco102]

1 hour ago, NBASupes said:

LMAO!

By the stats, the Hawks offensive personnel is very good. Come on man, do y'all even try to watch teams play that's not the Hawks?

LMAO, do you know what I'm talking about?  You were talking about defense.  How did you think I was talking about offensively? 

[Diesel]

1 hour ago, JeffS17 said:

Thanks for posting this, love Ben Taylor's videos -- he has a talent for creating easily digestible basketball material. 

This is a great highlight reel of what I've been saying... Jazz perimeter defense and defensive IQ outside of Gobert is WOAT levels.  I've never seen a team ball watch more than that squad, truly awful.  They are clueless on basic rotations.  Gobert doesn't even need to play with good perimeter defenders, just smart ones and his impact is like a defensive multiplier.  

I watched the whole series and they were not killing Gobert lol... he cannot do literally everything.  Just having teammates that understand their assignments and rotations would do wonders.  He also gets black balled on offense and any time they actually pass to him is a huge surprise.  And by the way, none of those guys are good passers -- I see people complaining about Gobert's brick hands but he's getting fast balls above his head, not the beautiful lobs Trae will feed him.

He really doesn't.  We rarely even leave Clint on an island on the perimeter to defend guards one the line and in the paint.  That Jazz team is something special with how they switch / don't switch / don't even play defense.  Gobert is quick.  He doesn't LOOK that quick because he's tall like a giraffe but he can move and recover and has amazing instincts.  He plays well.

It's probably important to point out that Gobert carries that flawed roster to the playoffs in the first place, and if he didn't, no one would have an opportunity to unjustly criticize him because the Jazz are terrible.

There is no exoneration for Gobert in any of the video.   It's a clear indictment of the whole defense.   Him included. 

Here's something:

 

 

 

[marco102]

1 hour ago, JeffS17 said:

 

I watched the whole series and they were not killing Gobert lol... he cannot do literally everything.  Just having teammates that understand their assignments and rotations would do wonders.  He also gets black balled on offense and any time they actually pass to him is a huge surprise.  And by the way, none of those guys are good passers -- I see people complaining about Gobert's brick hands but he's getting fast balls above his head, not the beautiful lobs Trae will feed him.

 

 

The offensive part I agree with. 

Defense not so much. I saw how they were taking him at the end of the final game.  The one play you bring up he defended Luka well, but Luka isn't really blowing by anyone.  Luka got Gobert in the pick and roll and destroyed the Jazz defense with his passing and shooting.  Gobert didn't even want to go to the perimeter which I surprised to see.  He was giving half ass effort.  Now that just may be him giving up on the team, but that's not GOAT defense like I've been told. 

 

[marco102]

58 minutes ago, JeffS17 said:

Agreed, I don't really see the Suns letting Ayton walk, but if we can get him on a SnT with favorable terms I'd be happy with that as well.

IMO on offense, Ayton has the opposite phenomenon as Gobert right now which is he's playing with one of the best "true" PGs of all time.  CP3 makes almost anyone look like an offensive weapon.  Ayton does have a nice bag though so I'm definitely not discounting that.  His defense is nowhere near the level of Gobert though and he's playing with very good wing defenders and CP3 who is allowed to hand check and foul 3x a play.  I think our defense would take a step back with Ayton though and I'm not sure if we can really afford that.  I think it's even more important to bring in another solid perimeter defender if we go with Ayton.

The drop off between Ayton and Capela is it that big?  

I guess Trae's chop liver compared to CP3? 

Like again, we need to stop panning for these one way players and start getting more two way players around Trae.  Ayton's defense is really good.  I think you need to watch more Suns if you don't think he's a good defender for a young center. 

Do the wings on Phx help him? Yes, does he cover up a lot of their mistakes? Yes. 

Rudy Gobert, costs too much money and that's all of us who don't want him are saying.  The player and what he brings is not worth $35 - $40 million a year.  He will also start to decline on that contract whereas an Ayton will hopefully continue to get better. 

[Diesel]

9 minutes ago, marco102 said:

The drop off between Ayton and Capela is it that big?  

I guess Trae's chop liver compared to CP3? 

Like again, we need to stop panning for these one way players and start getting more two way players around Trae.  Ayton's defense is really good.  I think you need to watch more Suns if you don't think he's a good defender for a young center. 

Do the wings on Phx help him? Yes, does he cover up a lot of their mistakes? Yes. 

Rudy Gobert, costs too much money and that's all of us who don't want him are saying.  The player and what he brings is not worth $35 - $40 million a year.  He will also start to decline on that contract whereas an Ayton will hopefully continue to get better. 

I know Gobert will make our interior defense much stronger.   I know Gobert will help with the PNR defense (which he has mastered).. I know that he will hit free throws better than Clint.  But is that worth 20 Million dollars more than Clint?

Understand the ramifications... whatever team we have, better be locked in and we better make excellent draft picks because we will have no wiggle room with the finances. 

AND..

We have to win a title.

I won't call Utah Garbage.  Clarkson and Mitchell are two very good players.   They were the best in the West last year.  But couldn't get out of the first round because they couldn't stop the other teams from scoring. 

 

[BangHolman]

24 minutes ago, marco102 said:

The drop off between Ayton and Capela is it that big?  

I guess Trae's chop liver compared to CP3? 

Like again, we need to stop panning for these one way players and start getting more two way players around Trae.  Ayton's defense is really good.  I think you need to watch more Suns if you don't think he's a good defender for a young center. 

Do the wings on Phx help him? Yes, does he cover up a lot of their mistakes? Yes. 

Rudy Gobert, costs too much money and that's all of us who don't want him are saying.  The player and what he brings is not worth $35 - $40 million a year.  He will also start to decline on that contract whereas an Ayton will hopefully continue to get better. 

Ayton should be option 1 out of the 3 no ifs, ands, or buts. Period.

[AHF]

13 minutes ago, Diesel said:

I won't call Utah Garbage.  Clarkson and Mitchell are two very good players.   They were the best in the West last year.  But couldn't get out of the first round because they couldn't stop the other teams from scoring. 

 

They are both like Trae where their value is pretty entirely on the offensive end.  I think you can make a case that everyone in their core rotation other than Gobert is below average on defense.

[AHF]

3 minutes ago, BangHolman said:

Ayton should be option 1 out of the 3 no ifs, ands, or buts. Period.

Ayton is definitely intriguing.  I do wonder how high the cost will be and whether he gets on the trade market at all.  Seems like a situation where the most likely scenario is that Phoenix doesn't shop him followed by the second most likely scenario that Phoenix starts a bidding war among suitors that commands a high price in trade.

[JayBirdHawk]

3 hours ago, Diesel said:

You can't watch Kev and not notice that he has a serious fear of going into the lane.   The lane must be cleared out before he goes into it.   It's not coaching because he plays hot potato just bringing the ball up.   It's not fluid, it's like 100 m dash when he has the ball.   And he's not good enough to look up and find an open man.  He dashes, comes to a stop and passes off to the closest person.   I think when he had his shoulder injured, he developed some type of mental block.   That dude is scared out there.  It's fear that chases him.. and for that reason, he can't be a fulltime primary ball handler.  He may come off the bench and run a few steps.. but i would seriously get him into a sports psychologist.. today and start him working on this fear.

Everything with Kevin is a stepback. He doesn't lean into his shots.

 

1 hour ago, AHF said:

 (Questions are all $$ and on-court impact.)

[Sothron]

I can't see us overpaying for Gobert like some of these trade proposals are suggesting. The longer I think about this the more I want to either move Capela for Ayton or simply hold onto Clint and use the draft capital/other players to get a star at SG or SF. 

[JayBirdHawk]

 

 

Quote

Let’s examine 10 of the most pressing questions facing the Hawks this offseason as they look to bounce back.

Does Tony Ressler want to pay the tax?

For the first time since Ressler bought the Hawks, his franchise is faced with paying the luxury tax....

Here’s what he said on the issue at the end of last season:

“If the question is are we scared of the tax, are we scared of going into the tax? I’m scared of paying the tax and not being a good team — yes, that I’m scared of,” Ressler said. “But if we have to go into the tax to be a great team for a period of time, so be it.”

Ressler has yet to speak since the season ended, so it’s unclear what his appetite is for paying the tax for a team that, as currently constructed, isn’t particularly close to being a contender. 

 

Can the Hawks attract a second star?

It’s fun to speculate who would look good in an Atlanta uniform, but pulling off these kinds of trades for a star is always difficult, especially if there isn’t an obvious attraction......The Jazz seem like the likeliest team to retool their roster. Donovan Mitchell and Rudy Gobert are both stars, but both have flaws that would make it difficult for the Hawks to add either of them. Mitchell is a terrible defender. A backcourt of Young and Mitchell would be explosive offensively, but adding another defensive problem when we just watched 82 games with bad defense shouldn’t be an option. Gobert would be an excellent partner for Young, but he’s on a max contract and the team building is limited if you add him. He’s also not that much better than Clint Capela, who offers similar things to Gobert.

Quote

Will Young embrace playing off the ball more?

He'd better

What’s the level of pressure on Nate McMillan?

What we saw this season, though, was the McMillan who ended up getting let go from Indiana after taking the Pacers to the playoffs. The Hawks looked confused coming out of timeouts all season, which was terribly on display on the final possession of Game 5 where they didn’t get a shot off. In-game adjustments were challenging more often than you’d like to see, and McMillan’s rotation rigidity didn’t lead to the creativity you sometimes need in the NBA to get wins.

 

The Hawks were on the hook for a $13 million buyout when they parted ways with Mike Budenholzer in 2018. Does Ressler really want to pay another multi-year buyout for McMillan? 

Quote

What should the Hawks do with De’Andre Hunter?

It was interesting to hear Hunter admit in exit interviews a few days ago that he feels he isn’t great at anything yet and how he felt like he was just OK defensively this season and how he needs to improve his ballhandling. Looking deeper at his stats this season, Hunter finished below average at the rim and in the midrange but was great shooting the 3. His rebounding, assists, blocks and steals rates were all well below league average....

 

Quote

Have we seen the last of Collins in a Hawks jersey?

Factoring in age, skill set and contract, Collins has the most value on the Hawks other than Young. If the Hawks end up acquiring a second star, it would be stunning if Collins wasn’t involved in the deal in some capacity.

 

How will the Hawks address their lack of perimeter defense?

They have to be better next season if contending is the goal. Re-signing Wright would be a good start. They need as many role players who can defend above average as possible. The Hawks will have their midlevel exception to use in free agency, but the free-agent pool is not deep. Maybe Brooklyn doesn’t re-sign Bruce Brown with its Bird rights. He’d be someone the Hawks should look at if he comes available. Houston’s Jae’Sean Tate would be another quality option if the Rockets decline his club option. And I highly doubt it happens, but if Golden State decides it can’t afford Gary Payton II, he’d be an automatic player to consider.

 

Should we be concerned with Bogdanovic’s health?

Yes

Should we expect Jalen Johnson in the rotation next season?

This one is hard to answer right now. The rookie wasn’t in the team’s rotation this season.

What about the draft?

There’s been zero buzz or talk surrounding the Hawks and the upcoming draft, and it’s understandable why. We just talked about Johnson not playing and second-round pick Sharife Cooper played less than Johnson. I can’t imagine there’s anyone in the draft the Hawks could take at No. 16 whom McMillan would trust to put in the rotation.

 

[JeffS17]

If Gobert is a no-go, I think I'd want to ship out Bogi/Delon Wright for Simmons and Capela/Gallo/picks for Ayton.  Draft capital attached where necessary.  I think this lineup can contend for a chip

• Trae 
• Simmons
• Hunter
• JC
• Ayton

[Sothron]

4 minutes ago, JeffS17 said:

If Gobert is a no-go, I think I'd want to ship out Bogi/Delon Wright for Simmons and Capela/Gallo/picks for Ayton.  Draft capital attached where necessary.  I think this lineup can contend for a chip

• Trae 
• Simmons
• Hunter
• JC
• Ayton

That's my dream scenario this offseason FWIW. 

[kg01]

2 hours ago, Spud2nique said:

It’s you me and @kg01 sailing drinking zimas baby! 
 

ps Bring the yellow hat.

Wait, what's going on here?  We takin' a trip?

And shakes better know the bucket hat is just like Clark Kent's glasses.  Put the hat on and it's par-tay time.  Take it off and it's ... 

1 hour ago, marco102 said:

LMAO, do you know what I'm talking about?  You were talking about defense.  How did you think I was talking about offensively? 

@NBASupes is pullin' out all the stops to avoid answering the money/value question with NGobert.

[AHF]

35 minutes ago, Sothron said:

I can't see us overpaying for Gobert like some of these trade proposals are suggesting. The longer I think about this the more I want to either move Capela for Ayton or simply hold onto Clint and use the draft capital/other players to get a star at SG or SF. 

CC for Ayton seems like a an unrealistic scenario.  Seems like Ayton may not be available at all but if he is seems like someone will give materially more.

[Sothron]

1 minute ago, AHF said:

CC for Ayton seems like a an unrealistic scenario.  Seems like Ayton may not be available at all but if he is seems like someone will give materially more.

CC is not the only piece we would move for Ayton but he would be the principal player involved on our end.