John Collins Traded - Fare thee well!

[kg01]

Just now, Atlantaholic said:

To put another way... if we HAVE to keep Gay as a result of this trade it's essentially us wasting a roster spot, on top of losing Collins. 

I wouldn't say we "have" to, per se.  There's plenty of non-washed dudes that could just be a body.   Now if he comes here in Jeff Green mode being a dirt worker and a mentor type, cool.  He can stick around for that.  I'm not holding my breath on it tho. 

[hawkman]

Just now, Atlantaholic said:

Remember when fans were livid at a Lauri for Collins swap a couple of years ago... Ah,  memories. 

Would definitely like a do-over on that one. 

[Atlantaholic]

1 minute ago, AHF said:

I'm expecting Vince Carter in Atlanta type impact on the floor.

Lol. I'm expecting Carmelo Anthony type of impact. 

[thecampster]

1 thing to consider....

Statistically speaking, the last 30 games, Jalen Johnson wiped the floor with JC stats wise, effectiveness wise, defensively vs his man.

[RedDawg#8]

Braves have been letting fan favorites walk out the door for years because Anthopoulos takes a hard line stance on contract value regardless of who the name is.

He has managed to bet correctly and replace outgoing talent with incoming or internal replacements.

Nobody is calling the Braves cheap or a Mickey Mouse organization.

Why is it with the Hawks, we feel like being financially savvy is such a black-eye?

We knew from day one of the rebuild, the plan was never to be an early exit playoff treadmill team. That's what we did for 10 years straight. It makes no sense to spend big on mediocrity.

We can debate the causes of our stale results, and JC is by no means the sole reason we have under-performed; but at some point, you have to make tough decisions and cut loses where you can.

We were stuck in a no win situation. Nobody was biting on the assets we wanted to move, nobody was offering fair value in return, and time was not on our side as values continued to drop by running the same roster back.

If teams are not willing to play ball with us via trade, then yeah, opening up cap room to be able to sign talent outright may be the way to go.

I am a believer in JJ's ability, and this Gueye kid looks the part as another developmental big to fill JJ's role. Bey is also a safety net if JJ isn't ready yet. We have options, we will survive. Not to mention the possible domino transactions to come after this move.

I am looking forward to the next chapter for the Hawks.

[AHF]

1 minute ago, thecampster said:

1 thing to consider....

Statistically speaking, the last 30 games, Jalen Johnson wiped the floor with JC stats wise, effectiveness wise, defensively vs his man.

I think most of us are having less trouble with the idea of a Bey / JJ pairing at PF than we are with the total lack of returning value in this trade.  I know I expected more than a pure salary dump.  I guess I should be grateful we didn't attach a pick?

[Atlantaholic]

1 minute ago, thecampster said:

1 thing to consider....

Statistically speaking, the last 30 games, Jalen Johnson wiped the floor with JC stats wise, effectiveness wise, defensively vs his man.

And that's cool and all, but what do we do if JJ gets hurt? Who plays the 4? Saddiq?? Rudy Gay's rotting corpse?

[aali34]

This could be the David Lee trade for gsw that set up room for Draymond Green to shine. It depends on if JJ is ready.

I will say that this is a lesson to not shop players publicly for consecutive years if you aren't committed to getting rid of them. The logic was always "JC is too good for what we're getting offered, so we'll wait and see". That approach only led to our cap situation getting worse and teams getting stingier. Same thing just happened with Beal. 

You got more for dumping Cam Reddish. 

[JustSomeGuy]

I think Hawks fans overvalued John. He’s a dunker who doesn’t handle the ball/shoot well enough to be a true stretch 4 and too small, injury prone and not a good enough interior defender to be am enforcing big.
 

Great guy and I wish him well but this trade only increases our long term roster flexibility necessary to compete. 
 

Important to note too that we will only have this exception for the year and either we use it or lose it so there’s definitely another deal on the other side. Maybe for a one year rental? 

[kg01]

2 minutes ago, aali34 said:

This could be the David Lee trade for gsw that set up room for Draymond Green to shine. It depends on if JJ is ready.

I will say that this is a lesson to not shop players publicly for consecutive years if you aren't committed to getting rid of them. The logic was always "JC is too good for what we're getting offered, so we'll wait and see". That approach only led to our cap situation getting worse and teams getting stingier. Same thing just happened with Beal. 

You got more for dumping Cam Reddish. 

Well stated.

1 minute ago, JustSomeGuy said:

I think Hawks fans overvalued John. He’s a dunker who doesn’t handle the ball/shoot well enough to be a true stretch 4 and too small, injury prone and not a good enough interior defender to be am enforcing big.
 

Great guy and I wish him well but this trade only increases our long term roster flexibility necessary to compete. 
 

Important to note too that we will only have this exception for the year and either we use it or lose it so there’s definitely another deal on the other side. Maybe for a one year rental? 

I dont think he was overvalued, per se.  We just didn't want to give him away.  That's bad asset management. 

[capstone21]

John had an infectious attitude ... he was great with commentators, great in locker room.  I hope he can get back to his near all star form.   He will be missed.  

[Atlantaholic]

2 minutes ago, JustSomeGuy said:

I think Hawks fans overvalued John. He’s a dunker who doesn’t handle the ball/shoot well enough to be a true stretch 4 and too small, injury prone and not a good enough interior defender to be am enforcing big.
 

Great guy and I wish him well but this trade only increases our long term roster flexibility necessary to compete. 
 

Important to note too that we will only have this exception for the year and either we use it or lose it so there’s definitely another deal on the other side. Maybe for a one year rental? 

Depends what JC we are talking about. 2021 Collins was undervalued if anything, people seem to forget how valueable he was for us, he was key especially in the Philly series he was the driving force behind our two huge comebacks. He hasn't been the same at all since. 2022 with the injuries and 2023 he just looked like a completely different player. There is no doubt at all Hawks sold Collins at his absolute lowest value probably of his entire NBA career. 

[Atlantaholic]

Seeing this thread pop up, then clicking and reading it:

[GameTime]

Never thought a JC trade would get me this upset since I saw it coming, but this one has. Trading JC for Atlanta Hawks' Carmelo Anthony's Ghost and a future second (IF it conveys) has to be one of the worst things I could have expected. The offseason is still young so I am calming down, but if this was just a cost saving move (see the abysmal Huerter trade) for The Resslers I may be done until we get new leadership.

[NBASupes]

11 minutes ago, RedDawg#8 said:

Braves have been letting fan favorites walk out the door for years because Anthopoulos takes a hard line stance on contract value regardless of who the name is.

He has managed to bet correctly and replace outgoing talent with incoming or internal replacements.

Nobody is calling the Braves cheap or a Mickey Mouse organization.

Why is it with the Hawks, we feel like being financially savvy is such a black-eye?

We knew from day one of the rebuild, the plan was never to be an early exit playoff treadmill team. That's what we did for 10 years straight. It makes no sense to spend big on mediocrity.

We can debate the causes of our stale results, and JC is by no means the sole reason we have under-performed; but at some point, you have to make tough decisions and cut loses where you can.

We were stuck in a no win situation. Nobody was biting on the assets we wanted to move, nobody was offering fair value in return, and time was not on our side as values continued to drop by running the same roster back.

If teams are not willing to play ball with us via trade, then yeah, opening up cap room to be able to sign talent outright may be the way to go.

I am a believer in JJ's ability, and this Gueye kid looks the part as another developmental big to fill JJ's role. Bey is also a safety net if JJ isn't ready yet. We have options, we will survive. Not to mention the possible domino transactions to come after this move.

I am looking forward to the next chapter for the Hawks.

You can do that in Baseball. 

[Dynamo]

All the best to John Collins !

[NBASupes]

8 minutes ago, aali34 said:

This could be the David Lee trade for gsw that set up room for Draymond Green to shine. It depends on if JJ is ready.

I will say that this is a lesson to not shop players publicly for consecutive years if you aren't committed to getting rid of them. The logic was always "JC is too good for what we're getting offered, so we'll wait and see". That approach only led to our cap situation getting worse and teams getting stingier. Same thing just happened with Beal. 

You got more for dumping Cam Reddish. 

Wow! @AHF

[Atlantaholic]

1 minute ago, GameTime said:

Never thought a JC trade would get me this upset since I saw it coming, but this one has. Trading JC for Atlanta Hawks' Carmelo Anthony's Ghost and a future second (IF it conveys) has to be one of the worst things I could have expected. The offseason is still young so I am calming down, but if this was just a cost saving move (see the abysmal Huerter trade) for The Resslers I may be done until we get new leadership.

Oh if this is "it" as far as big moves you can bet your ass Landry/Ressler aren't getting a second of my (non pirate stream) time once again this season. 

[Atlantaholic]

14 minutes ago, kg01 said:

I wouldn't say we "have" to, per se.  There's plenty of non-washed dudes that could just be a body.   Now if he comes here in Jeff Green mode being a dirt worker and a mentor type, cool.  He can stick around for that.  I'm not holding my breath on it tho. 

He wasn't a viable NBA player last year, and he's a year older now. So yea, like I said, get whatever random guy from G-league for a fraction of the cost if you can, 

[terrell]

1 hour ago, ATLHawks3 said:

His value was THAT low? Wow.

Yes