CAM REDDISH TO NY FOR KEVIN KNOX AND FIRST!?!

[NBASupes]

8 hours ago, bleachkit said:

Interesting fact. Trae, Kevin and Cam all have almost the exact FG% on 2's. .455

All three have been shit at finishing. Not such a surprise for Kevin and Cam. If Trae floater isn't on mark, same for him. 

[NBASupes]

8 hours ago, TheNorthCydeRises said:

If it's very different situations, why are people crying about Cam and his slow development?   

Our fan base had very high hopes for Cam, even elevating him over Hunter at the start of the season ( due to how Cam finished last season ).  Now with Cam struggling again, expectations have been tempered.  They probably shouldn't have been elevated in the first place.  Let the kid learn what he does best in this league and hope the coach puts him in the correct situations.

Right now, Cam is a bad 3 point shooter and a very poor finisher in the paint.  It shocked me to see that he's only 4 - 27 on shots from 3 - 10 feet.  Coaching staff needs to find out what he can do consistently as an offensive player, and just stick with that.  Might be time to take baby steps with Cam offensively.

Our fanbase and the national media had every reason to have Cam over Hunter before TC started based on what we saw from January to March. Hunter made improvements to his efficiency which was better than most on our team throughout the season as a rookie but he couldn't score if he couldn't get to his spots, he was limited athletically and he couldn't defend at the 3 at all. Teams saw his flaws on tape and started to abuse him. This was highly noticeable. 

As for Cam, with the exception of people like me, it wasn't like people thought Cam was this no brainer starter. They just thought Hunter wasn't good at all. They didn't trust Cam and for good reason. He played the first half of the rookie season being one of the worst offensive players to get minutes in NBA history along with Jordan Poole. John Hollinger stated that both players are backups and that Cam was one of the worse ball handlers in the league coming into the season with his season review on the Hawks. So it wasn't like this overwhelming support for Cam. Even someone like me was pushing for Gordon Hayward at the 3. Both players had a lot to prove coming into year 2. 

Cam needed to build on his end to the year offensively while making a jump defensively and while Hunter showed efficiency, he sucked overall. He needed to show he belonged. He improved his athleticism considerably, he learned how to score when the defense stopped him from getting to spots by using his body. He became a much better perimeter defender by being able to use his athletic ability and strength. He was always a disciplined defender even based on his rookie year. 

Cam did make strides in terms of playing with high energy a lot more often, his defensive discipline has considerably improved while it's not where I want it to be, it at least exist this year and his communication is miles better. We see it in our impact stats as well. His defense is much better this year on a game to game basis. His energy on offense is too. Also, I see him being more consistent at getting to the FT line as we saw in the 2nd half of last year. He's close to 4 attempts a game on 36.8 touches per game.

But he's regressed to rookie first half Cam shooting and ball handling wise. Like Ant Man, Cam uses his 3 point shot to setup the rest of his game. The problem is, his mechanics with his legs, feet, and just being shot ready in general is broke, confident is broke, instead of his shooting being loose, its tight while his handles are loose not tight like on a string.

Since so much of Cam efficiency is locked into his 3 point shooting, he will appear a lot better just being a Bazemore-esque average not really that reliable 3 point shooter. But he's like a Josh Smith three point shooter. While mechanics wise, Smoove in his prime wasn't a mess, Smoove had one of the worst shooting motions/strokes I've seen in recent memory. Like, it just looks broke. He shot that ish with confidence too. He actually can make it consistently in shooting practice but considering he was closer to a high energy player, he was always kinda burned out (settling) while taking that shot and it just looked bad. I said this last year before VC and Melvin Hunt fixed Cam, that Cam has to take a lot more real practice 3s where he's tired and playing hard. That's the mark of how good of a shooter you really are. Its frustrating because Cam has one of the prettiest shot releases I've seen. Ray Allen like. Then again, so does Ben McLemore but Ben eventually did become a marksman from 3 but Ben never shot as poorly as Cam did either. 

The issue with Ant, Cam, and these AAU kids is they play that stupid AAU where effort on average is below average, defense is shit, you can unlimited shots if you are talented, it creates false belief in really how good you really are. College is real and both of them sucked ass. Ant by his own admission watching the tape, I had a lot of bad games last year. Why? Because you aren't good at Basketball. You are extremely gifted at it but good, you aren't. Cam defensively is miles better but Cam is far more high volatility due to his lack of physical attributes when it comes to attacking the rim and size that Ant Man has. Ant has so many world class attributes that you just figure he will get there at some point. Cam, it's much more murky. 

Idiots even within our own fanbase are like temper expectations, or maybe he's this and not that. Dumbass, shut up. Cam hasn't gotten less talented this year. Same ole freakish talent where he can be the best player on the court with Trae, Durant, Kyrie, and Harden at the same time. Then again, same ole, can be the worst player on the court with guys like Goodwin getting PT by a county mile. 

For me, its impossible to say he can't be the best player in the league one day just as it's impossible to say he might just be a limited role player coming off the bench long term. Because Cam game is extremely volatile. More volatile than even Trae and LaMelo. Even more than Ant Man and Kelly Oubre. This is what Cam looks like to a degree offensively when his shooting is special:

https://web.archive.org/web/20181202165819/http://www.tankathon.com:80/players/cam-reddish

This is what it looks like when it isn't:

http://www.tankathon.com/players/cam-reddish

The biggest things to take away from Cam is extremely skilled but for as big as his bag is, he can't get to most of it because his handles suck. Just having clearly below average half court handles that we saw in the 2nd half of last year, he was damn near impossible to stay in front of. That's just with below average handle. Not average or good, below average. He has to massively improve that. Its preventing him for using his skills consistently. He also needs to get stronger, build up his core and while I love that he's 6'10 now with shoes, stop growing, its f***ing up what we are trying to do development wise. 

Overall, I still believe that he could be the best player in the league in a world of Luka, Trae, Zion, and Ja. Obviously not KD and LeBron but his game is always going to be highly volatile and he's a risky player, even if he becomes a two-way superstar. 

[High5]

12 hours ago, TheNorthCydeRises said:

If it's very different situations, why are people crying about Cam and his slow development?   

Because fans cry about everything.

[bleachkit]

5 hours ago, NBASupes said:

All three have been shit at finishing. Not such a surprise for Kevin and Cam. If Trae floater isn't on mark, same for him. 

True, our most reliable play is Trae with a lob to a big.

[terrell]

7 minutes ago, bleachkit said:

True, our most reliable play is Trae with a lob to a big.

Yep.......Watching THT finishing at the rim with ease vs Denver as a rookie was disheartening, knowing most of our young guys cant even make a layup....smh

Edited February 6, 2021 by terrell

[bleachkit]

2 minutes ago, terrell said:

Yep.......Watching THT finish at the rim with ease the other night as a rookie was disheartening..smh

THT?

[terrell]

4 minutes ago, bleachkit said:

THT?

Horton-Tucker. One of the players we took Bruno over...Ugg. Kid already took Wes Matthews minutes..lol

Edited February 6, 2021 by terrell

[bleachkit]

1 minute ago, terrell said:

Horton-Tucker. One of the players we took Bruno over...Ugg

He's been pretty good. 

[bleachkit]

15 hours ago, TheNorthCydeRises said:

If it's very different situations, why are people crying about Cam and his slow development?   

Our fan base had very high hopes for Cam, even elevating him over Hunter at the start of the season ( due to how Cam finished last season ).  Now with Cam struggling again, expectations have been tempered.  They probably shouldn't have been elevated in the first place.  Let the kid learn what he does best in this league and hope the coach puts him in the correct situations.

Right now, Cam is a bad 3 point shooter and a very poor finisher in the paint.  It shocked me to see that he's only 4 - 27 on shots from 3 - 10 feet.  Coaching staff needs to find out what he can do consistently as an offensive player, and just stick with that.  Might be time to take baby steps with Cam offensively.

We are trying to win games. We need the good Cam Reddish, that's not crying. Considering how he played at the end of last year, what we have seen this year is a huge, huge disappointment. His shooting efficiency is among the worst in the NBA. 

[hawkzlova123]

It sucks you had so much certainty about cam. So far, you've been wrong. 

And it also sucks when you have fans arguing for cam and even degrading our best players when analyzing his play.

[macdaddy]

Cam will be fine.  It's crazy to think that he's not going to improve.  He's good at the hardest part of the game already.

[NBASupes]

1 hour ago, macdaddy said:

Cam will be fine.  It's crazy to think that he's not going to improve.  He's good at the hardest part of the game already.

This is true. The things that are most difficult for most young pros is easy for Reddish which is why he has value and impact even right now. The thing is, Cam is bad at thing most young pros in his position are good at. The presumption is that he can easily improve on these but this isn't a guarantee. 

[AUhawksfan]

I’m fine giving Cam this season to regain his bearings but I feel like we should be seeing more offensive consistency by the end of this season and hopefully marked improvement by next. 
 

I feel like the offense is mostly a mental hurdle for him. Some work past it but others get dragged down by it. He can’t overthink it. 

[Cwell]

29 minutes ago, AUhawksfan said:

I’m fine giving Cam this season to regain his bearings but I feel like we should be seeing more offensive consistency by the end of this season and hopefully marked improvement by next. 
 

I feel like the offense is mostly a mental hurdle for him. Some work past it but others get dragged down by it. He can’t overthink it. 

I just hope he doesn't make a habit of those late season improvements. I don't wanna hear that Josh Jackson effect bs. And we all witnessed Taurean the end of his sophomore season when he was dropping 30 on everybody

[NBASupes]

35 minutes ago, AUhawksfan said:

I’m fine giving Cam this season to regain his bearings but I feel like we should be seeing more offensive consistency by the end of this season and hopefully marked improvement by next. 
 

I feel like the offense is mostly a mental hurdle for him. Some work past it but others get dragged down by it. He can’t overthink it. 

Right now, Cam is dead last in eFG and 3p% by a mile. For comparison, Luka has been a horrible 3pt shooter this year, he is .40 points better than Cam this year. 

If Cam shoots at his preseason or Jan to Mar rate. Cam would be considered to be a young emerging star. 38.5% from three with good volume. As of right now, 25.6% would rate as the lowest mark since 2009. For qualified players removing all of the guys from this year which is way too many stinking it up from 3, outside of Cam, Kobe would be 3rd worst in his last year(28.5) and Marcus Smart in the next year at #2 at 28.3%. Its fair to say, if Cam was shooting well, he would be playing well considering his defensive impact, FT%, and ability to get to the FT line with fairly limited touches. 

As bad as he's been offensively, his impact has been twice that of Huerter. I am wondering if maybe Kevin overachieved early in his career but in reality, Kevin is just playing bad defense and teams are exposing him on that end more than usual as they are trying to win and he's showing as many defensive flaws as Trae. Trae improvement on D has hurt Kevin as he's become the target of many teams scouting reports.

Edited February 7, 2021 by NBASupes

[HawkingAwesome]

wait cam is 6'10 now? 

[bleachkit]

57 minutes ago, HawkingAwesome said:

wait cam is 6'10 now? 

No, he's not. NBA has him listed at 6'8". Gallo is 6'10". Look at Gallo standing next to Cam, Gallo is taller. People are really bad at eyeballing heights and weights for some reason.

[NBASupes]

7 hours ago, bleachkit said:

No, he's not. NBA has him listed at 6'8". Gallo is 6'10". Look at Gallo standing next to Cam, Gallo is taller. People are really bad at eyeballing heights and weights for some reason.

He was the same height as LeBron when we played and Bron was 6'9 barefoot. Gallo is 6'10 barefoot

You are the one who's terrible at eye balling. D'Antoni said Gallo is 6'11

Edited February 7, 2021 by NBASupes

[NBASupes]

 

[bleachkit]

On 2/7/2021 at 3:35 PM, NBASupes said:

He was the same height as LeBron when we played and Bron was 6'9 barefoot. Gallo is 6'10 barefoot

You are the one who's terrible at eye balling. D'Antoni said Gallo is 6'11

You are the one that thinks Cam magically grows another 2 inches every year. It's borderline absurd. Remember when you said kilian Hayes weighed 220? Turned out he didn't, I was right. You're not good at eyeballing heights and weights, I am. Sorry.