Were we spoiled by Nate the Great??

[Diesel]

Yeah... it was definitely Clickbait...

But a real question. 

Nate turned this team around in the middle of a season.   Didn't even add in his own staff; just used LP's people. 

Did that spoil Hawks fans into believing that NBA players learning new systems takes just a few games?

That is question number 1.

Here is question number 2...

Do you think in that 2020-2021 season, that our team tanked on LP and refused to win games that they could win?

 

[AHF]

I doubt the team intentionally lost games but they sure weren’t bought in on LP which may amouny yo something only a little different.  He alienated a number of players and undermined the team’s most prominent player in a really bizarre fashion that has likely been a big factor in why no team has been willing to entertain him as a head coach no matter how many kudos Pops throws his way.

The Nate season did raise expectations and accelerate things more than was warranted in hindsight.  Sadly, Nate with LP coaches and systems as the base was better than full control Nate.

[macdaddy]

And last throw blame where it's deserved.  LP not only couldn't keep the respect of the team he certainly played a role in Trae not being viewed more highly around the league.  When you're own coach is saying you don't deserve accolades how do you expect others who are already critical to react.  

But to the point.  Nate was good at implementing a system that the players could easily understand.  

[Diesel]

8 minutes ago, macdaddy said:

Nate was good at implementing a system that the players could easily understand.  

In this way, I think Nate spoiled the fanbase.  Now people look at Quin and say.. why is it taking so long for these guys to be a finished  product.. .or this team is so mediocre.

The truth is, I think we are starting to see what it takes to truly kill old habits and buy in to a new system.  That's why it seems like every game, a player gets better out of nowhere.  First Trae and Clint.   Next Dre.  I think we will be much better when our team is whole.... because everybody will have bought in.  DJ You are Next...

[macdaddy]

We weren't spoiled by Nate.  He had a lot more talent to work with.  apples and oranges

[JayBirdHawk]

I wasn't spoiled by Nate. I was already out on him 5 games into his new offense and new assistant coaches.

[Diesel]

2 hours ago, macdaddy said:

We weren't spoiled by Nate.  He had a lot more talent to work with.  apples and oranges

That's an interesting statement.  I don't know if I really agree?

You replace Kev and JC with JJ and DJ....

Then they had Cam, Gallo, Solo, and Snell as rotational guys. 

Compared to OO, Saddiq, Matthews, and Mathews.

  I don't know if there's more talent...  The League may have been weaker..  But it's an interesting dance. 

 

[Gray Mule]

Nate + LP's assistant coaches and LP's plans = success for the Hawks.

LP couldn't get it out of the team.  Nate could.

Yet, when Nate dropped all of LP's assistant coaches and his plan, he couldn't.

Now comes Quin Snyder with all new assistant coaches and his own plan.  Some players seem to fit.  Others, we're not so sure about.  Success was expected to come at once, but it's not happened and we're so disappointed.  JJ & Kobe are expected to come off the injured list before year's end.  M. Gueye, shortly after the 1st.

Slowly the offense comes around.  The defense, not so fast.  We recently again discovered how important Capela is to the defense / rebounding of this Hawk team.  

Just some of my personal thoughts.  I hope we can agree.

[macdaddy]

3 hours ago, Diesel said:

That's an interesting statement.  I don't know if I really agree?

You replace Kev and JC with JJ and DJ....

Then they had Cam, Gallo, Solo, and Snell as rotational guys. 

Compared to OO, Saddiq, Matthews, and Mathews.

  I don't know if there's more talent...  The League may have been weaker..  But it's an interesting dance. 

 

Well JJ is hurt which is one reason we're doing poorly.  You left out LouWill.  Gallo and LouWill were go to scorers off the bench.  Big time ones even at that age.  So those minutes without Trae weren't so bad with those guys to turn to.  And Tony Snell resents being compared to Mathews.

[Diesel]

6 hours ago, macdaddy said:

Well JJ is hurt which is one reason we're doing poorly.  You left out LouWill.  Gallo and LouWill were go to scorers off the bench.  Big time ones even at that age.  So those minutes without Trae weren't so bad with those guys to turn to.  And Tony Snell resents being compared to Mathews.

You're right.   LouWill was amazing.   I guess that's where the breakdown comes... LouWill vs. AJ.  

Freaking AJ... Get your stuff together!!

I liked Tony Snell.  Would love some TSnell Perimeter defense right now.  Mathews is ruddy.. but the guy gets in there.  If Heart was a person, Mathews would raise his hand and try out for the role. 

 

 

[Plainview1981]

Quinn has yet to prove he is better than Nate. IMO.

[Diesel]

1 minute ago, Plainview1981 said:

Quinn has yet to prove he is better than Nate. IMO.

Nate is still the Coach that has taken this franchise the farthest that it has ever been.   It's going to take winning the 3rd game in the ECF for somebody to claim better than Nate. 

 

[Vol4ever]

10 hours ago, Diesel said:

Nate is still the Coach that has taken this franchise the farthest that it has ever been.   It's going to take winning the 3rd game in the ECF for somebody to claim better than Nate. 

 

I liked Nate a lot and believe he was the scapegoat.    I also Like Quinn and I am seeing some improvement lately in the team.  We just don't have the players.  

[Diesel]

42 minutes ago, Vol4ever said:

I liked Nate a lot and believe he was the scapegoat.    I also Like Quinn and I am seeing some improvement lately in the team.  We just don't have the players.  

Nate wasn't a scapegoat.  Nate was out of touch with today's game.   He prospered because he could take advantage of the creativity in Lloyd Pierce's coaching.   However,  he trashed that as soon as he had a chance to put his own stuff in place.   Nate lacked the creativity to make this team work and moving to his system showed that.   It was a bold move for our FO to fire him because of his standing with this team.  However, somebody had to recognize that he was not causing us to go forward. 

Quinn is a more creative coach.  He also is a student of the game and a teacher.   He's a better coach for this team.   The problem is the learning curve.. but our players are coming around.   

The whole reason for this thread is that a lot of people have given up on Quinn... when in actuality, it takes a team some time to change old habits and adopt new ones.   IF you watch closely, you see us play Quinn's system and then you see small nuggets of us reverting back to the Nate days.    Part of it is familiarity.   The other part is lazy.   Quinn has to coach that out of us if we are going to be successful.

[JayBirdHawk]

1 hour ago, Vol4ever said:

I liked Nate a lot and believe he was the scapegoat.    I also Like Quinn and I am seeing some improvement lately in the team.  We just don't have the players.  

No he wasn't. He had the same issue here that he had in Indy - antiquated system and inability to connect with his players.

[JeffS17]

No.

[Diesel]

1 hour ago, JeffS17 said:

No.

Random no..  But if it's a no to did Nate spoil us.. 
I disagree on the basis that our fanbase expected us to be good and acclimated right from the jump.   They haven't given room for Quinn's system to become routine and second nature... and thus, they observe and evaluate the Hawks as if it only takes 3 games to get it.    I say that's because they saw the success that Nate had in the middle of the season. 

 

 

[macdaddy]

Trae spoiled us.  Bogi spoiled us. Kev spoiled us. JC spoiled us.  Lou and Gallo spoiled us.  They stepped up big time on a big stage, most for the first time.  Tony on down let us down by mismanaging since then.   Nate was somewhat caught in the middle but also wasn't a good coach for this squad long term. 

[Diesel]

2 hours ago, macdaddy said:

Trae spoiled us.  Bogi spoiled us. Kev spoiled us. JC spoiled us.  Lou and Gallo spoiled us.  They stepped up big time on a big stage, most for the first time.  Tony on down let us down by mismanaging since then.   Nate was somewhat caught in the middle but also wasn't a good coach for this squad long term. 

Personnel wise. Maybe.  But the ability for the team to pick up what Nate was putting down so quickly is where I see spoilage.   After Nate got in and changed everything.. that's a different story.