2020-2021 Season News and Notes

[JeffS17]

3 minutes ago, REHawksFan said:

LP is extremely personable and is an excellent communicator.  I'm guessing he interviews very well.  Explaining last year's lack of success won't be a problem either due to roster limitations, but he's going to have to figure out a way to explain this season.  The fact that Nate took the same team he coached to 12-19 and went 29-12 is a real negative, imo. 

 

    

I agree but it was probably a great learning experience for LP.  As long as he is willing to learn from his mistakes and adapt, he can still be a good coach in the future.  He lost the locker room and it costs him his job.  He was also really stubborn in some ways... I still think as well as Nate has coached a large portion of our success has come from the player's being more engaged and buying into what Nate is selling.

[sturt]

To no one in particular... my suspicion is that LP enjoys a greater and wider regard among those in coaching circles than we even know. And we already know some.

https://www.si.com/nba/2021/03/02/lloyd-pierce-firing-nba-coaches-criticize-hawks-decision

 

And, with that, I suspect that LP will have ample others who will push the line of reasoning that says LP was working with a lot of new parts, and with a lot of in-and-out parts, that even if he had a roster of older players who trusted his leadership, there still would have been too much to expect good results.

[NBASupes]

LP is a tremendous talent and was critical into bringing Trae, Cam, and Hunter to Atlanta. With the exception of Cam, I don't know if we would have landed the other two without LP making a strong stance that these two were his guys. Sadly, Trae and Cam butted heads but these are young prospects who need a lot of coaching. He's a better fit with a vet squad. 

[marco102]

8 minutes ago, NBASupes said:

LP is a tremendous talent and was critical into bringing Trae, Cam, and Hunter to Atlanta. With the exception of Cam, I don't know if we would have landed the other two without LP making a strong stance that these two were his guys. Sadly, Trae and Cam butted heads but these are young prospects who need a lot of coaching. He's a better fit with a vet squad. 

Do you mean Trae and Cam butted heads with LP or is there something you know that we don't know? 

[NBASupes]

2 minutes ago, marco102 said:

Do you mean Trae and Cam butted heads with LP or is there something you know that we don't know? 

Butted heads with LP. Not with each other 

[TheNorthCydeRises]

1 hour ago, REHawksFan said:

LP is extremely personable and is an excellent communicator.  I'm guessing he interviews very well.  Explaining last year's lack of success won't be a problem either due to roster limitations, but he's going to have to figure out a way to explain this season.  The fact that Nate took the same team he coached to 12-19 and went 29-12 is a real negative, imo. 

 

    

Let's be fair. 

We started the season 4 - 2, when most of the team was intact.

Injuries decimated the team from mid Jan - early March.

Bogi's return was huge for Trae ... the day after LP got fired.

LP wouldn't have taken us to this level. But if healthy, we do make the playoffs no doubt.

[NBASupes]

4 minutes ago, TheNorthCydeRises said:

Let's be fair. 

We started the season 4 - 2, when most of the team was intact.

Injuries decimated the team from mid Jan - early March.

Bogi's return was huge for Trae ... the day after LP got fired.

LP wouldn't have taken us to this level. But if healthy, we do make the playoffs no doubt.

No. LP wasn't taking this squad to the playoffs. 

[bleachkit]

11 minutes ago, NBASupes said:

No. LP wasn't taking this squad to the playoffs. 

I disagree. Timing plays a huge part in our turnaround. Nate was already on the bench. It wasn't like he waved his magic wand. Mostly we needed to get healthy and to gel. Nate did make some subtle adjustments that benefitted the team though. 

[TheNorthCydeRises]

4 minutes ago, NBASupes said:

No. LP wasn't taking this squad to the playoffs. 

 

We were tinkering with the playoffs even before he got fired.  We were only like 1 game from 8th when he got fired, and we were 11th.  Let's not act like we were completely out of it, because we weren't.  

LOL . . weren't you a LP defender at one point?

https://www.basketball-reference.com/leagues/NBA_2021_standings_by_date_eastern_conference.html

[RedDawg#8]

We were trending in the wrong direction regardless of injuries.

Nate got Bogi back but he was playing like ass during our 8 game win streak. So Nate was basically able to win more with the same availability of players contributing as Lloyd, and even less players as the season went along. So the injury thing is not an excuse.

Nate got Kevin to play much better on defense. Nate began using Bogi the right way. Nate committed to giving OO backup minutes instead off splitting time with Knight.

That's not to mention any of the in game differences between the 2 as it relates to game management and late game execution.

LP is a bright man. He knows basketball. He is respected. That does not mean that he is cut out to be a great head coach. He may just be an organizational guy. A personnel and development guy. The way he was with the media and the things the players point out that Nate does different, clear communication, is very telling.

Guys know their roles, they know what's expected of them. Nate was able to communicate his vision clearly. LP, was very passive aggressive with the media and possibly with the players if you read between the lines. Guys don't buy in to that kind of stuff. It may work when your voice is just a contrast to another leader, but not as the Head guy. Men want to know what needs to be done so that they can do it. You see the difference in results, it's very telling on LP's coaching. Doesnt matter how much you know if you can't bring that knowledge to life.

 

[REHawksFan]

27 minutes ago, TheNorthCydeRises said:

Let's be fair. 

We started the season 4 - 2, when most of the team was intact.

Injuries decimated the team from mid Jan - early March.

Bogi's return was huge for Trae ... the day after LP got fired.

LP wouldn't have taken us to this level. But if healthy, we do make the playoffs no doubt.

It's not worth an argument, but I'm not convinced that we were guaranteed a playoff birth with LP at the help.  They lost too many winnable games and had too many collapses in the 4th quarter under LP to believe he was all of a sudden going to turn it around.  And no, I don't attribute all of that to injuries.  LP had Bogie as a catch and shoot guy rather than a secondary playmaker.  Nate changed Bogie's role while also unlocked Trae to trust his teammates more.  Everything changed once Nate took over.  

It's really not worth an argument though.  We are in a better place now and LP will be fine.  So it's a win win.  My original post was not meant to slander him at all, because I think he's the type of dude that will continue to get opportunities because his energy is infectious and he's a likeable guy.  He also works really hard.  

[NBASupes]

16 minutes ago, TheNorthCydeRises said:

 

We were tinkering with the playoffs even before he got fired.  We were only like 1 game from 8th when he got fired, and we were 11th.  Let's not act like we were completely out of it, because we weren't.  

LOL . . weren't you a LP defender at one point?

https://www.basketball-reference.com/leagues/NBA_2021_standings_by_date_eastern_conference.html

I am a LP defender now but I do believe Nate is the biggest reason for our success. That said, that doesn't mean LP won't be a success elsewhere 

[kg01]

35 minutes ago, bleachkit said:

I disagree. Timing plays a huge part in our turnaround. Nate was already on the bench. It wasn't like he waved his magic wand. Mostly we needed to get healthy and to gel. Nate did make some subtle adjustments that benefitted the team though. 

I disagree with supes as well.  I imagine they'd make it into the play-in, at worst but not much further than that.

There seems to have been some toxicity building that was alleviated with the coaching change.  We benefited from the intangible uptick in overall mood, which has aided the current run imho.

[kg01]

Sheesh, what a day of news.  In this case, some really bad news ... 

I know the name from just reading various NBA news wires over the years.  Was the go-to for Hornets news.  RIP, Mr. Bonnell.

[Gray Mule]

Fact of life.  Whatever we do, whether it be great or small, usually is better when we have more experience.  Lloyd was not a great coach in Atlanta.  Too many things went wrong.  Too many injuries.  Then, for what ever reason, he lost the team.  They couldn't hear him.

He did a lot of good things with the Hawks along with the bad.  He is highly respected by other NBA coaches.  We all believe that he's a good human being.  Much of the growing of our young players came under the leadership of Lloyd Pierce.

A new voice was needed in Atlanta.  When he came on board, players suddenly listened.  Much of what was being said had already been there with Lloyd.  Somehow, they just couldn't hear.  Is our new coach better than our old coach?  Yes!  Experience shines thru.

Lloyd Pierce will be a head coach again.  His experience he gained with our Hawks wii be a great aid to him in the future,  He had several years as an assistant coach.  He found out just how different being the head honcho could be.  Hopefully, some day he will be a very good head coach and we can proudly say, "He was once one of ours!"

[kg01]

So ... has there ever been a more glaring example of failing-up as this Selltics news?

[macdaddy]

We were 14-20 when LP got fired.   To make the 10th spot in the playin we would have had to gone a minimum of 19-19.    Not convinced we would have done that well with the way we were playing.

[Spud2nique]

43 minutes ago, kg01 said:

We benefited from the intangible uptick in overall mood, which has aided the current run imho.

Lloyd can draw up in a pick n roll yo, players saw that and was like no, I can’t give this f!cker full effort.

Again, Lloyd was in over his head. We had the pieces then and the injuries came and went. I will say the Euros (Dani and Bogi) needed time to adjust so that could be part of the “uptick” but other than that, we had the pieces with 0 game plan.

[Spud2nique]

1 minute ago, kg01 said:

So ... has there ever been a more glaring example of failing-up as this Selltics news?

I wake up to Kyrie burning the Celts. Like 4 different updates from BR, I almost thought he literally went to TD and burned it. May as well have. 
 

1. Bye Ainge 

2. Kyrie, you being an enemy to my friend still does not make you a friend to me. (Whose lyric is that sounds familiar CARDIIIIIII?)

3. Brad Stevens struggled this year coaching the Schmelts alone so let’s be smart and give him more responsibility. 

Its 2021, it took a while but I see a fundamental shift of power here. The Hawks rising and the Schmelts falling.

 

[Thomas]

3 hours ago, bleachkit said:

Supposedly Jason Kidd did some weird things as coach. 

Uh think that was as a player in Dallas the first time around. The three J guys and a girl....