Official Game Thread: Warriors at Hawks

[Peoriabird]

2 minutes ago, h4wkfan said:

You won’t win this one. 

I don't even know what the objection is to what I said...Maybe you can help me out

[Peoriabird]

21 minutes ago, AHF said:

  

First, we weren't talking about Cam with this exchange.  Just how good the team's defense was right now.  For some reason when I pointed out we weren't top 10, you brought it back to LP who has nothing to do with this discussion.

Second, on the topic of Cam, I don't know that we'll even get a good chance to see him this year.  He is going to have less than 10 games remaining in the season if he returns on the 6 week timeline we were originally given.  Do you really think Nate is going to thrust him into the starting lineup in that time?  

Third, the reason I mention the last 10 games is because we played some absolute garbage teams early in Nate's tenure.  We weren't winning all those games under LP so winning those was very important.  But playing against garbage competition doesn't give you a good sense of how you stand against competitive teams.  Our last 10 games have been an upgrade in competition (even if a few are still D-League level opposition) and we have given up 111 per game over that time suggesting that we need our injured players back to become a top 10 defense (assuming we are capable of that this season).  JC and Capela were here when we gave up 108 to the Kings, 108 to the Warriors, 126 to the Nuggets, and 117 to the Suns.  I fully agree if you are suggesting that we need more talent (Hunter, Cam and Dunn would be huge for us) back to reach that upper third of the league on a consistent basis but what you said above is that we were a top 10 defense without them and that I don't agree with.

 

 

So do you think that I was saying top 10 for the season or under Nate.  Clearly I was talking about under Nate and the actual ranking was 13th over the last 15 games.  I could not add the other 3 games he coached.  13th under Nate without Hunter and Reddish and partly without Capela and Collins.

[Atlantaholic]

1 hour ago, AHF said:

Right.  Clearly not top 10.

We built up some outstanding DRtg numbers during the opening "weak sisters of the poor" part of our schedule and have fallen back significantly since.  See the numbers above against a more normal mix of teams over our last 10.

But I don't disagree with you that we have been better on defense during Nate's tenure.  We are a better team on both ends of the floor, IMO.  Just not a great defense.  Middle of the pack.  If/when, Cam and Hunter return we have the potential to take another step forward.

The thing to keep in mind is that we have been missing some of the key defensive pieaces lately, including Clint who missed a few games and looked out of sorts coming back from the injury in a few others. Overall, the team is giving much better effort, and if we had everyone back I think we would be top 10 for sure. 

[Peoriabird]

5 minutes ago, Atlantaholic said:

The thing to keep in mind is that we have been missing some of the key defensive pieaces lately, including Clint who missed a few games and looked out of sorts coming back from the injury in a few others. Overall, the team is giving much better effort, and if we had everyone back I think we would be top 10 for sure. 

Thank you. Was my point that unclear? You seem to understand it but others did not

[AHF]

14 minutes ago, Peoriabird said:

Thank you. Was my point that unclear? You seem to understand it but others did not

WITHOUT HUNTER AND CAM.

This is the big issue I have with the statement.  Healthy I think we could get there but that means Cam and especially Hunter back.  I don't think we get there without them which is what you said on this thread that I responded to.

Over our last 10, we haven't been close and that includes the games with both JC and Capela.

[AHF]

36 minutes ago, Peoriabird said:

I don't even know what the objection is to what I said...Maybe you can help me out

You said I was responding to something on another thread when I was responding to this thread.

24 minutes ago, Peoriabird said:

So do you think that I was saying top 10 for the season or under Nate.  Clearly I was talking about under Nate and the actual ranking was 13th over the last 15 games.  I could not add the other 3 games he coached.  13th under Nate without Hunter and Reddish and partly without Capela and Collins.

In the first three games Nate coached we gave up 114, 121 and 115 points.  We won two of those despite giving up 33 and 39 points in the 4th quarter.  I don't think they would do a ton to improve our standing under the DRtg metric.

[Peoriabird]

1 minute ago, AHF said:

WITHOUT HUNTER AND CAM.

This is the big issue I have with the statement.  Healthy I think we could get there but that means Cam and especially Hunter back.  I don't think we get there without them which is what you said on this thread that I responded to.

Over our last 10, we haven't been close and that includes the games with both JC and Capela.

That's it???  My point of the post was to highlight that Nate is a defensive coach and his defensive rtgs are light years better than the previous coach even without Cam, Hunter, Capela at times and now John.  You turn the discussion into something else

[Peoriabird]

1 minute ago, AHF said:

You said I was responding to something on another thread when I was responding to this thread.

In the first three games Nate coached we gave up 114, 121 and 115 points.  We won two of those despite giving up 33 and 39 points in the 4th quarter.  I don't think they would do a ton to improve our standing under the DRtg metric.

So you don't believe Nate is more of a defensive minded coach vs Pierce?  I'm trying to understand your point.  I really am

[AHF]

1 minute ago, Peoriabird said:

That's it???  My point of the post was to highlight that Nate is a defensive coach and his defensive rtgs are light years better than the previous coach even without Cam, Hunter, Capela at times and now John.  You turn the discussion into something else

I am saying we are a league average defense without Hunter and Cam.  We aren't a top defensive team which is what "top 10 defense" says to me.  Agree we are better on that end under Nate as we are better on offense and basically everything else.  That was an upgrade for us.

We need Hunter (especially) and Cam back if we want to be a top defensive team.

[Peoriabird]

4 minutes ago, AHF said:

We need Hunter (especially) and Cam back if we want to be a top defensive team.

LOL! That's some Captain Obvious stuff right there!

 

[AHF]

3 minutes ago, Peoriabird said:

LOL! That's some Captain Obvious stuff right there!

 

YOU SAID WERE TOP 10 WITHOUT THEM.  I disagree.  I think I'm suffering brain damage.

8 minutes ago, Peoriabird said:

So you don't believe Nate is more of a defensive minded coach vs Pierce?  I'm trying to understand your point.  I really am

I know I'm suffering brain damage.  The words I'm reading above seem to suggest that I've been unclear about Nate vs LP but...is that the case....

Am I reading my own posts incorrectly?  

2 hours ago, AHF said:

But I don't disagree with you that we have been better on defense during Nate's tenure.  We are a better team on both ends of the floor, IMO.  Just not a great defense.  Middle of the pack.  If/when, Cam and Hunter return we have the potential to take another step forward.

 

1 hour ago, AHF said:

Pretty sure the board is 100% of the same opinion comparing Nate and LP so not sure why we'd be comparing them.  Nate has shown himself to be an upgrade and the change in leadership has resulted in the team demonstrating significantly better focus on both ends of the floor.  Slowing down the pace has also likely resulted in better quality on both ends on a per possession basis.

I am talking about the current team so the notion that this was a top 10 defense was more interesting to me than comparing whether the team was better with Nate or LP.  That is a dead issue. 

On the live topic of how good our defense is right now, I doubt we are top 15 over our last 10 games; maybe not top 20 (all this by DRtg; other metrics may differ).  Will be interested to see how it continues.

 

1 hour ago, AHF said:

  

I fully agree if you are suggesting that we need more talent (Hunter, Cam and Dunn would be huge for us) back to reach that upper third of the league on a consistent basis but what you said above is that we were a top 10 defense without them and that I don't agree with.

 

 

 

 

[Peoriabird]

I think everyone else understood what my message was.  And even when i clarifed it to you you still won't accept it.  That's on you

[Spud2nique]

19 hours ago, terrell said:

Rondo had 106 points in 27 games with the Hawks
Lou Williams already has 41 points in 3 games

Gameball: Gallo, Capela, and Sweet Lemon Pepper Lou

I can’t hear you I have crow in my ears  

[AHF]

23 minutes ago, Peoriabird said:

I think everyone else understood what my message was.  And even when i clarifed it to you you still won't accept it.  That's on you

If your message is that Nate is doing a better job than LP, I already endorsed that message so no issue of acceptance.

If your message is that the team has been improved on defense, I already endorsed that message so no issue of acceptance.

If you message is that the team will be better with Hunter, Cam and Dunn back, I already endorsed that message so no issue of acceptance.

If your message is that the team is a top defense without these hurt players, then I disagree.

 

Saying the team is top 10 without Hunter and Cam is the only thing I took issue with on this thread.  Did you reverse your position on that and agree they are more of an average defense so far without them?  If so then I accept that change in position and we are on the same page.

[hawkzlova123]

6 hours ago, NBASupes said:

Eating McDonald's. A place I usually eat once every five years

I think I have that too. I ate their after like 5 years and my whole system gone red alert. Can't imagine eating this sh&#&# this. People make your food at home. It's been freaking awful. I feel like dying. What the f &# are they doing in there

[Peoriabird]

1 hour ago, AHF said:

If your message is that Nate is doing a better job than LP, I already endorsed that message so no issue of acceptance.

 

That was the topic being discussed period before you hijacked the discusion

[RandomFan]

16 hours ago, AHF said:

YOU SAID WERE TOP 10 WITHOUT THEM.  I disagree.  I think I'm suffering brain damage.

I know I'm suffering brain damage. 

Of course you are suffering brain damage.   

At some point you have to realize you are in a battle of wits you cannot win. But you have more patience than I do, so keep fighting the good fight and I'll just keep snickering off in the corner over here. 

Let's avoid any personal shots here. - AHF

[MarylandHawk]

Man I thought we were done arguing with each other after wins. Lol. Nate is a good defensive coach and would be even better with more good defensive players. 
 

[RedDawg#8]

We need Hunter

Cam would be a nice luxury if he can come back AND play better on both ends than he was to start this year. 

Also, I do not like Kevin starting, especially next to Bogi. I think that's stupid even if we are winning.

Remember when Hollinger predicted that LP would sell out offensively and start Trae, Bogi and Kevin together. Remember how bad we flamed him on this site for predicting something so stupid.

Well, that's become a reality. Even with Snell being consistent and playing smart and steady. Nate is getting a pass for running out that lineup because we are winnning

[Peoriabird]

58 minutes ago, MarylandHawk said:

 Nate is a good defensive coach and would be even better with more good defensive players. 
 

Why do you and other understand that simple point but some don't?