8/4 UPDATE: Collins to sign $125 million deal with the Hawks per Woj

[ATLHawks3]

2 minutes ago, bleachkit said:

The longer this goes on the more you would have to think this favors the Hawks. Who is going to suddenly offer JC a monster deal?

Hawks reportedly don’t even want to do a sign and trade with any other team. It’s JC or bust.

[Peoriabird]

42 minutes ago, sillent said:

It's still looking a little shaky from a relationship standpoint but I agree we are the best option for him in every possible way. 

What part is shaky?  The Hawks made John an offer, John and his agent thought he could get more on the open market.  It didn't happen so the Hawks were right.  John and his agent have to now admit that they overvalued John's worth to the rest of the league and come back to the table with less leverage.  Sound pretty simple to me.

[FL_BRYANT]

Neither wants to over play their hand.

[sturt]

We're not the only ones scratching our collective head on this one...

 

 

[sillent]

17 minutes ago, Peoriabird said:

What part is shaky?  The Hawks made John an offer, John and his agent thought he could get more on the open market.  It didn't happen so the Hawks were right.  John and his agent have to now admit that they overvalued John's worth to the rest of the league and come back to the table with less leverage.  Sound pretty simple to me.

How does that not shake the ego a bit?

Not trying to put too much into it but  shaking the ego in this league is a dangerous thing. It's what drives most of the players in the league. A late draft pick or undrafted, a missed allstar team, a want to be the man, a player that wants a bigger contract.

All of these things give players an edge. Hopefully it works out for us seeing that we are offering him more than other teams and he takes it out on other teams. 

Usually money situations that don't go well for that players team the opposite effect occurs. Again though we have offered the most out of all so far so hopefully he excepts it and takes his edge out on other teams.

Either way things are shakier than expected going into free agency. I and many just thought and expected it would go alot smoother. Especially with John wanting to be here and getting more than the original offer. It's definitely near as max as it's most likely going to get.

Edited August 4, 2021 by sillent

[Peoriabird]

9 hours ago, sillent said:

How does that not shake the ego a bit?

 

This has nothing to do with ego.  The NBA is a business and John's agent knows this.  They gambled and lost.  End of story

[sillent]

8 minutes ago, Peoriabird said:

This has nothing to do with ego.  The NBA is a business and John's agent knows this.  The gambled and lost.  End of story

If you've never been a competitor true end if story. It don't take much for a competitor. Believe me 

[Peoriabird]

16 minutes ago, sillent said:

If you've never been a competitor true end if story. It don't take much for a competitor. Believe me 

This whole debacle is probably agent driven

[skimaskway23]

At this point, if 125 ain't enough he can bounce.

Anybody think collins is feeling some type of way since Trae got the max at 12:01? Hope he doesn't feel jealous. The frustrating part about this is Collins views himself on trae's level

[bleachkit]

Maybe Hawks and JC are working out a sign and trade. Those can get pretty complicated, maybe even a third team involved. 

[Peoriabird]

10 minutes ago, bleachkit said:

Maybe Hawks and JC are working out a sign and trade. Those can get pretty complicated, maybe even a third team involved. 

How would this benefit the Hawks?  They would have to accept the same dollar amount back in a trade.

[bleachkit]

3 minutes ago, Peoriabird said:

How would this benefit the Hawks?  They would have to accept the same dollar amount back in a trade.

Draft compensation? That's all i can think of. Doubt we would get any good players in a sign and trade.

[Peoriabird]

Just now, bleachkit said:

Draft compensation? That's all i can think of. Doubt we would get any good players in a sign and trade.

You think he would arrange a sign and trade to a lottery team or would the draft capital not be be worth the trouble either

[bleachkit]

4 minutes ago, Peoriabird said:

You think he would arrange a sign and trade to a lottery team or would the draft capital not be be worth the trouble either

I dont know, but the fact that nothing has been announced by now is kind of unusual. Usually after about 48 hours, it mostly MLEs and vet minimums. 

[gurpilo]

At this point and after John has rejected what everybody agree is as a fantastic offer from Hawks I am ready to listen to offers. This guy is trouble, already was this year with some issues with Trae and the difficulties to sign him to a reasonable contract is clearly a red flag.

He is not a Max player. The other 2 guys we had problems to resign were Schröder and Josh Smith, both complicated characters that after the initial boom on the league quickly went down not playing to their contract levels. Well, I think John belong to this group, a guy that thinks is better than he really is and is going to be always a problem claiming a role he is not prepared to support. Long term that is a Big problem to win a Championship.

I understand this is not probably a popular statement but is what I think today. Hopefully everything is solved, he signs a reasonable contract and accepts that probably he is 3rd or 4th Guy in the team, chances It happens are really low for me. I think he ends at OKC.

Edited August 4, 2021 by gurpilo

[gurpilo]

On a side note I think we understimated the Jalen Johnson pick, I think Atlanta went PF because they already knew Collins most likely was leaving. I think we might end with Gallo as the starter and certainly this could open minutes for Reddish and Hunter. 

[LucastheThird]

Man the way some of y'all talk about these men getting their money makes me look at you sideways. 

If you were in JC's position, you would fight for every penny for your family and feel justified. But JC does that and he's a problem now? 

Some of y'all got that "owner mentality" (IYKYK) and I'll leave it at that.

[RedDawg#8]

The worst part about public contract negotiations is the obligatory character assassination that always follows the player.

There has been zero statements made from JC or his camp. It's all been third-party reading between the lines of what he "might" be thinking. Yet here we are, attributing disgruntled dialogue and selfish character traits because JC is using the entire moratorium period to do what he and the organization always said that he would do from jump.

John could very well love the Hawks' offer, he still cant "sign" anything until noon Friday. Trae's extension is not signed. Delon Wright is not a Hawk yet. Dieng is not official. 

None of these moves are inked yet. If JC  wants to use the next few days to see if what we already know doesn't exist is out there, that's his right. 

But he will almost undoubtedly be back, and right now the fanbase are the ones burning that bridge and damaging the relationship by painting his character as something different than what he has proven himself to be during his tenure.

From owner, GM, coach, down to teammate; everyone agrees that JC is a team first, unselfish, stand up guy and the heart of the organization. The man can't take 2 days of being a free agent before we turn on him?

Now, when he's back, some of y'all going to double down and act like you own the guy. Every missed shot or less than 7 rebound game you're going to be screaming to trade him; all because he hurt your feelings by making you be patient for a few days in free agency.

Meanwhile, JC and his camp remain silent. Not leaking anything to the media like the organization just did with his contract offer. Not speaking out. Moving in silence with respect. We should follow suit.

[sturt]

1 hour ago, gurpilo said:

The other 2 guys we had problems to resign were Schröder and Josh Smith, both complicated characters that after the initial boom on the league quickly went down not playing to their contract levels. Well, I think John belong to this group,

Yes, those are "complicated characters," but not even one little bit is JC that.

You don't make yourself an equivalent of Schröder or Smoove in the span of 48-72 hours. Those boys were that, not merely as a result of any contract negotiations, but by virtue of reputations built over years.

If "it's not personal, it's just business" works for one side, it works for both sides.

Mind you, I certainly agree that this seems to be, for now, a lapse in judgment by JC and his agent. But we have to acknowledge, we don't really know everything. In fact, we know very little. What little we even think we know we only think we know based on what is being reported--which sometimes, we have later found out, wasn't especially accurate.

Patience.

There will be ample time to judge. But let the actual substantive intel come to light. Don't judge based on rumor and suspicions.

[Peoriabird]

1 hour ago, gurpilo said:

On a side note I think we understimated the Jalen Johnson pick, I think Atlanta went PF because they already knew Collins most likely was leaving. I think we might end with Gallo as the starter and certainly this could open minutes for Reddish and Hunter. 

Ummm,  free agency is less than 2 days old!  There should be a little patience.  John will be a Hawks this up coming season.