Trade Deadline 2023: February 9th.

[theheroatl]

Trae isn't going to be traded. It's a bad deal for both sides.. It wouldn't be like he would be traded to a contender. Let's be realistic here folks. Trae knows it too. What's his options if he was to hypothetically ask out? Maybe OKC and they give us the house... not happening with Presti. Time for that rumor to die.

As for trades.. some JC trade will come to fruition. I can't see the FO finishing the season with him after 3 years of rumors. It's not like he's a bad player, IMO, it's just he disappears in some games with like 4-7 points. 

Dre might have to stay (not really a equal trade out there).

I vote that the most likely traded players are:

1. JC
2. Bogi
3. J Holiday

All others here by end of season. As for trade targets:

1. Ayton / Saric / Crowder
2. Dyson Daniels
3. Eric Gordon
4. Doug McDermott

 

 

[sturt]

2 hours ago, theheroatl said:

Trae isn't going to be traded. It's a bad deal for both sides.. It wouldn't be like he would be traded to a contender. Let's be realistic here folks. Trae knows it too. What's his options if he was to hypothetically ask out? Maybe OKC and they give us the house... not happening with Presti. Time for that rumor to die.

It's less that I'm making the case how it should/would get done.

It's more that I'm making the case that there is a condition where it should (not would) get done.

Every team that's going to be an elite contender must have that one guy who is a superstar capable of carrying his team with some frequency.

To the rest of your post, you do nothing to this team's prospects to nibble around the edges and modify other pieces when that primary piece isn't what you need it to be in order to get to the goal you're supposedly trying to get to.

 

Now, that's not to say I'm there.... I'm not. I'm among the limited number around these parts who is comfortable with ambiguity and avoiding getting too high or too low on this team (... and its head coach for that matter).

But what I am saying is that a reasonable case can be made if this team doesn't make enough of a case on their own ahead of the trade deadline to give serious thought to a change at the very top of the rotation.

They're 6-2 since Capela's return. If they continue at a +.700 w/l%, that's almost certainly enough of a case on their own... I'm watching and observing... we'll see.

[REHawksFan]

14 hours ago, sturt said:

18 hours later, I'm left to think that it's more popular than I'd been inclined to think.

 

 

... your thoughts, Rayford?

The Hawks as a team have evolved over the last several seasons.  Early on they needed Trae to explode to have a reasonable chance to win. Their roster was that awful. It was Trae, JC and no other NBA players.  Then they added some pieces and really needed him to be elite but not necessarily go nuclear for them to win regularly. But that wasn't good enough in the playoffs because he could be taken away too easily. So now, they've added more pieces and they really just need him to give effort defensively, take care of the ball, and shoot efficiently for them to win consistently.  He'll still be top 15 in pts and top 3 in asts but will be a more rounded player and the guy that the team NEEDS to be that leader. 

It seems to me like Trae welcomed the early roles of being the superstar guy that carried the team.  Then he was ok with just being elite but the team wasn't winning enough so he pushed for additions.  Now he needs to be more of a team player and he just hasn't evolved to that point consistently yet.  We see flashes of it.  But then the "I've got to carry this team" mentality that he justifiably had early in his career creeps back up from time to time. He forces it and when it doesn't work, he looks like a fool.  

Bottom line for me, Trae is still an ELITE player in the NBA.  He just needs to evolve his game to the point where he trusts his teammates more and doesn't feel like he has to be the hero every night.  Just be the hero when it comes naturally.  Defer to DJ or Dre or Bogi when they are hot.  Be smart. 

Do that and he can absolutely be the No. 1 on a title team.  I really believe that.    

[AHF]

10 hours ago, sturt said:

I think the reason you aren't seeing much response to this is that it is basic common sense.  LeBron James couldn't carry a team to a ring on his own.  Is Trae that much better than LeBron that he can do it?  No?  Then not much to push back on.  

LeBron needed two All-NBA players to win his rings in Miami (Wade 8x All-NBA multiple 1st team with James; Bosh 1x All-NBA with James, 11x All-Star); two All-NBA players to win in Cleveland (Kyrie 3x All-NBA; Love 2x All-NBA and multiple All-Star with LeBron); and one All-NBA level player alongside him in LA (2019-20 1st Team All-NBA; #6 in MVP voting).  When he didn't have those other stars, he "was never sufficiently excellent to carry a team" to a championship.

Trae has never had someone make an All-Star team while playing with him and has never had a teammate who was considered for All-NBA.  Of course we need to try to add a second superstar.  Easier said than done but if Travis was unwilling to try for that then that would be a good cause to let him go.  (I suspect he wasn't opposed to that if he could have made it happen.  A GM would be a moron to do so.)

So I'm not sure there is much to talk about here.  I agree with your comment.  I'd agree if you made that comment in reference to Luka or any other young star as well.

[JayBirdHawk]

The Magic are welcoming trade inquiries for Mo Bamba, Gary Harris, Terrence Ross and R.J. Hampton ahead of the deadline, league sources say.

 

 

– via Marc Stein @ marcstein.substack.com

Bulls think they can get two first-round picks for Alex Caruso



Jake Fischer: Someone told me last week that the Chicago Bulls think they get two first-round picks for Alex Caruso. – via Spotify

Knicks were willing to offer multiple first-round picks for OG Anunoby?



And the Knicks are interested in acquiring his services…or at least, they were. According to SNY’s Ian Begley, the Knicks made an offer for Anunoby in December, before the eight-game winning streak that vaulted them back into playoff contentionDarren Wolfson: The Wolves continue to receive a bunch of phone calls (about) Naz Reid, even Taurean Prince. – via YouTube

Andre Drummond on the move again?



Do not be surprised, league sources say, if the Bulls move former All-Star center Andre Drummond before the Feb. 9 trade. Drummond has been allotted fewer than 15 minutes in each of Chicago’s past 12 games. – via Marc Stein

 

 

 

 

[JayBirdHawk]

Everybody seems to be asking for 2 1st round picks for average players, lol.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[macdaddy]

I"d take Drummond as a backup. 

[kg01]

1 hour ago, JayBirdHawk said:

Everybody seems to be asking for 2 1st round picks for average players, lol.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Think we can get 2 2nds for Trae?

[warcore]

3 hours ago, JayBirdHawk said:

Bulls think they can get two first-round picks for Alex Caruso

[hylndr11]

It's because teams know they need bench depth to win in post season and their hoping some of those teams close will pay it because sometimes they do

[sturt]

7 hours ago, AHF said:

LeBron James couldn't carry a team to a ring on his own. 

Right. But then again, that's not what I said.

"Carry a team" is different from "carry a team to a ring," my friend.

 

Carry a team = carry your team during the regular season so that they win so much that they're on that list of conventionally contending teams.

LeBron James has always done that much.

 

If Trae cannot do that much, then how can anyone say he's capable of your words, "carry a team to a ring"...?

 

  

7 hours ago, REHawksFan said:

Bottom line for me, Trae is still an ELITE player in the NBA. 

 

He is... or he can be? 

I would disagree that he is.

But like probably you and everyone else, I'd like to think we'll be able to look back on this moment of the season and say he proved over the last half of the season to be that.

 

  

  

7 hours ago, AHF said:

So I'm not sure there is much to talk about here.  I agree with your comment.  I'd agree if you made that comment in reference to Luka or any other young star as well.

I think many people think along the lines that we can't let go of Trae... and because, he is elite already, as RE just suggested.

 

[AHF]

Given your definition:

Quote

carry your team during the regular season so that they win so much that they're on that list of conventionally contending teams.

I would say that Trae, Luka, Jokic, Ja, and others are not on that list because I don't consider any of their teams true contenders.  They are all on teams that should make the playoffs but not the finals let alone have a good chance of winning a ring.  For LeBron, I think his Cavs were good enough to clear your hurdle even though he never won a game in the Finals until he teamed up with the other All-NBA players.

Your definition for me is only the very rare elite superstar.  Even guys like Jimmy Butler, Jayson Tatum, Joel Embiid, etc. did not clear this hurdle because they needed other studs on their team to truly contend.  And guys like Steph Curry perhaps don't make the list either given that they their teams didn't content until Klay Thompson had his first All-NBA season and Green was 1st team All-NBA defense and knocking on that door.  Without those guys becoming studs, Curry was someone who had missed the playoffs most years and had one single first round playoff series win on his record.  So Curry doesn't make the cut because he has only done it with multiple other studs on his team.

LeBron made it far enough for his team to be a contender without those other stars but that is extraordinarily rare.

If what you mean is someone like Curry qualifies because when you pair him with other All-NBA talent he can consistently be on that list of contending teams then we are right back to my prior post.

[sturt]

50 minutes ago, AHF said:

Jokic

... hasn't carried his team during the regular season to your satisfaction?

Hmm. Interesting.

[JayBirdHawk]

The Portland Trail Blazers have offered Jerami Grant a four-year, $112 million extension, sources tell Jake Fischer of Yahoo Sports.

Grant has not accepted the offer as the Blazers can sign offer a five-year contract worth more money when he becomes a free agent.

Grant can sign for up to $233 million over five years, though the upper range of that contract appears unrealistic.

Grant is interested in signing with the Blazers long-term

 

This is why I had no interest in trading for him as an UFA...good luck to PTL...that's $28 mil per he passed on.

[AHF]

4 hours ago, sturt said:

... hasn't carried his team during the regular season to your satisfaction?

Hmm. Interesting.

He hasn’t convinced me that the Nuggets are serious contenders for a title.  That is what contender means to me.  Nuggets have had a regular season winning % of 63% or higher 4 of the last 5 years but more seasons where they didn’t win a game outside of the opening round of the playoffs than years where they threatened.  Unless I’m mistaken the second round is the latest they’ve won a game.  That isn’t particularly close to winning it all.  Being a few % ahead this season doesn’t prove they are legit contenders to me just yet because Jokic has been just as good the past couple of seasons and they have a 5-10 record in the playoffs during that time.  That isn’t a real contender.

[sturt]

1 hour ago, AHF said:

He hasn’t convinced me that the Nuggets are serious contenders for a title.

He has convinced me that he can carry a team in the regular season.

I put that together with the premise that if a guy like that is surrounded by sufficient other talent, that his team can win a title.

[FL_BRYANT]

If the Hawks feel like they have to trade JC can they ship him to GSW for Wiseman and Moody.  I would be Ok with this return.  I haven't checked the logistics but can it work? 

[sturt]

On 1/25/2023 at 10:03 PM, sturt said:

If you make a trade at this point, I'm leaning toward either of two options, depending on how this team performs these next 6 games before the clock runs out on the deadline.

If we see them perform well, you don't mess with the rotation. But if there's a trade that makes some sense for this season that gives you some insurance and an upgrade toward the end of the bench, go for it.

 

On 1/26/2023 at 4:58 PM, sturt said:

But honestly, can't see us being able to dislodge JDay from the roster short of the front office becoming willing to part with draft picks to make it happen... my guess is there's a 10% chance of that

 

For what it matters, my attention is on Utah, and Nickeil Alexander-Walker.

Would represent a considerable improvement over JDay, but conceivably could be had. He's gotten inconsistent minutes, but still, probably more than most would have predicted. NAW also would represent about $1m payroll savings.

 

What would Ainge require?

Well, he already has 3 2023 FRPs (UTH, MIN, and lesser of BRK or PHI), and zero 2nds. Doubt he'd want to bring more than 3 rookies to training camp anyway. Of course, it's entirely plausible that he'll look to use two or maybe all three to move up in the draft, too, which would make having a 2nd a more reasonable thought.

We have our first, and two seconds.

There are a few different ways you could configure it so that there could be something to both sides' satisfaction.

[sturt]

19 minutes ago, FL_BRYANT said:

can it work

No. Those two together make about half what JC does.

[Sothron]

3 hours ago, AHF said:

He hasn’t convinced me that the Nuggets are serious contenders for a title.  That is what contender means to me.  Nuggets have had a regular season winning % of 63% or higher 4 of the last 5 years but more seasons where they didn’t win a game outside of the opening round of the playoffs than years where they threatened.  Unless I’m mistaken the second round is the latest they’ve won a game.  That isn’t particularly close to winning it all.  Being a few % ahead this season doesn’t prove they are legit contenders to me just yet because Jokic has been just as good the past couple of seasons and they have a 5-10 record in the playoffs during that time.  That isn’t a real contender.

I believe Jokic and Murray went to the WCF during the covid bubble.