The cobbled together, stuff we held on to during the playoffs mega super rumor and team direction thread.

[NBASupes]

1. Atlanta and Utah have hit a snag. Utah is looking for more picks and Atlanta isn't willing to even add a future 2nd much less another 1st. I am either expecting for Utah to accept Atlanta counter or simply keep Gobert which could cause a lot of trouble as both want out if the other is still on the roster. (Mitchell). I was told it was gonna take awhile for Gobert talks but Utah is pushing as they know Ayton is a serious threat and they want Atlanta to be in the game. 

2. Teams at the top are still evaluating their options. We don't know what Atlanta will do yet but don't count out Jaden Ivey  to Atlanta yet. 

3. Capela and JC have the same value to teams around the league trade wise. Capela is more valued by non lottery teams while JC is valued by lottery teams wanting to become playoff teams 

4. Atlanta is considering a number of different options for Gallinari. Trades in particular 

5. Hawks been extremely active and have made calls to everybody but a name that has come up is D'Angelo Russell. Atlanta is looking for cheap players who can be stars off the bench. Russell has come up. The issue with Russell is his price tag for a future deal which is why he's on the block for damn near free anyway. Atlanta only inquired, they haven't made an offer and from what he's heard, he doesn't think they will but it shows you Atlanta is checking on EVERYTHING. 

[NBASupes]

7 minutes ago, Dean Walker said:

I’ll give up my hawks fandom if this trade goes down!

absolutely disastrous!

That's an massive overpay. The deal I am hearing is Capela or Collins/Kevin/16.

[DS5]

3 minutes ago, NBASupes said:

1. Atlanta and Utah have hit a snag. Utah is looking for more picks and Atlanta isn't willing to even add a future 2nd much less another 1st. I am either expecting for Utah to accept Atlanta counter or simply keep Gobert which could cause a lot of trouble as both want out if the other is still on the roster. (Mitchell). I was told it was gonna take awhile for Gobert talks but Utah is pushing as they know Ayton is a serious threat and they want Atlanta to be in the game. 

2. Teams at the top are still evaluating their options. We don't know what Atlanta will do yet but don't count out Jaden Ivey  to Atlanta yet. 

3. Capela and JC have the same value to teams around the league trade wise. Capela is more valued by non lottery teams while JC is valued by lottery teams wanting to become playoff teams 

4. Atlanta is considering a number of different options for Gallinari. Trades in particular 

5. Hawks been extremely active and have made calls to everybody but a name that has come up is D'Angelo Russell. Atlanta is looking for cheap players who can be stars off the bench. Russell has come up. The issue with Russell is his price tag for a future deal which is why he's on the block for damn near free anyway. Atlanta only inquired, they haven't made an offer and from what he's heard, he doesn't think they will but it shows you Atlanta is checking on EVERYTHING. 

Glad to hear that Atlanta is not willing to overpay, hopefully that tweet is bs. What’s available for a Gallo trade? And please no Dlo!

[Peoriabird]

9 minutes ago, NBASupes said:

That's an massive overpay. The deal I am hearing is Capela or Collins/Kevin/16.

To me that is a massive over pay...why in hell would the Hawks trade Collins and keep Capela in that trade scenario?

[GameTime]

13 minutes ago, NBASupes said:

1. Atlanta and Utah have hit a snag. Utah is looking for more picks and Atlanta isn't willing to even add a future 2nd much less another 1st. I am either expecting for Utah to accept Atlanta counter or simply keep Gobert which could cause a lot of trouble as both want out if the other is still on the roster. (Mitchell). I was told it was gonna take awhile for Gobert talks but Utah is pushing as they know Ayton is a serious threat and they want Atlanta to be in the game. 

2. Teams at the top are still evaluating their options. We don't know what Atlanta will do yet but don't count out Jaden Ivey  to Atlanta yet. 

3. Capela and JC have the same value to teams around the league trade wise. Capela is more valued by non lottery teams while JC is valued by lottery teams wanting to become playoff teams 

4. Atlanta is considering a number of different options for Gallinari. Trades in particular 

5. Hawks been extremely active and have made calls to everybody but a name that has come up is D'Angelo Russell. Atlanta is looking for cheap players who can be stars off the bench. Russell has come up. The issue with Russell is his price tag for a future deal which is why he's on the block for damn near free anyway. Atlanta only inquired, they haven't made an offer and from what he's heard, he doesn't think they will but it shows you Atlanta is checking on EVERYTHING. 

Danny Ainge is playing games. Move on from Utah. Focus on Ivey/Ayton, please TS.

1 minute ago, Peoriabird said:

To me that is a massive over pay...why in hell would the Hawks trade Collins and keep Capela in that trade scenario?

Trading Collins, Capela and a 1st for Gobert is getting worse not better.

[NBASupes]

9 minutes ago, DS5 said:

Glad to hear that Atlanta is not willing to overpay, hopefully that tweet is bs. What’s available for a Gallo trade? And please no Dlo!

I have nothing right now. Just that they are looking at all options on Gallo.

 

Dlo was just an inquiry for all I've received 

[NBASupes]

4 minutes ago, GameTime said:

Danny Ainge is playing games. Move on from Utah. Focus on Ivey/Ayton, please TS.

Trading Collins, Capela and a 1st for Gobert is getting worse not better.

I don't believe Danny is leading their trade talks but I could be wrong

It's just a bad trade with all being considered 

[terrell]

9 minutes ago, Peoriabird said:

To me that is a massive over pay...why in hell would the Hawks trade Collins and keep Capela in that trade scenario?

Capela can be moved in a seperate deal?

Edited June 15, 2022 by terrell

[sturt]

40 minutes ago, NBASupes said:

1. Atlanta and Utah have hit a snag. Utah is looking for more picks and Atlanta isn't willing to even add a future 2nd much less another 1st. I am either expecting for Utah to accept Atlanta counter or simply keep Gobert which could cause a lot of trouble as both want out if the other is still on the roster. (Mitchell). I was told it was gonna take awhile for Gobert talks but Utah is pushing as they know Ayton is a serious threat and they want Atlanta to be in the game. 

Is that to say there's no real competition for Gobert? That would be surprising if so.

[benhillboy]

28 minutes ago, bleachkit said:

So in summation, our injuries count. Their injuries don't count. Ok, usually your very objective and unbiased in your analysis, that doesn't appear to be the case this time.

It’s like the runaway leader on this graph (updated through Game 4 of the Finals) wasn’t dealing with a seriously inflamed knee.

[bleachkit]

5 minutes ago, sturt said:

Forgive me if I missed it (... see how it's done?... ) but I think I see you avoided debunking the three reasons provided to you asserting that the MIA series has to be put in context... that it's not valid to extrapolate from it we've hit a ceiling, and are in need of a major overhaul... and to the specific point raised... that there is almost no integrity in alleging that when we hit the wall vs. MIA following our two play-in wins, that somehow demolishes .621--ie, the Real Hawks' outcome in the 60 (not 5) games they played with enough horses for the starting line-up to not have to feature players night after night after night not even considered talented enough to be part of a team's rotation, or yes, not even considered talented enough to be on a team's 15-man roster.

 

And if I'm going to quote you, I"m not going to sit here and be dismissive and/or pretend there's no there there.... which is my preface to say...

THAT game bothered me. It really really did.

What @AHF said is all valid, too, but I really felt like that's got to be a game that our people study hard in the off-season, to fully understand how we didn't even really compete. I don't dismiss any of the plausible explanations, and every single person who played or coached that game should have been interviewed to ascertain some well-grounded answer as to how that one got so out of hand given all of the factors, pro and con.

 

BUT. It's still just one game. There are 60+2+4 others that have to be given appropriate weight in the analysis as well.

 

 

I'm of the opinion there is more wrong with this team than just untimely injuries. 

[sturt]

42 minutes ago, NBASupes said:

it shows you Atlanta is checking on EVERYTHING.

 

 

And like these guys are saying (cued to the comment) just as interested NBA observers... assuming the talk on the street is legit... then, we seem to have no actual purpose here but to make a splash with someone (... my words not theirs).

 

[NBASupes]

1 minute ago, terrell said:

Capela can be moved in a seperate deal?

Yep. Could be. There are teams willing to pay heavily for Clint that have no interest in JC. 

 

I wasn't told if Utah preferred one over the other. I know both were offered a the main piece but not as a pair 

[Threezus]

40 minutes ago, NBASupes said:

That's an massive overpay. The deal I am hearing is Capela or Collins/Kevin/16.

Capela, Kevin, 16 and you got me on that trade im willing to do that for Rudy.    Collins added in and im not taking it he needs to be paired with Rudy or were gonna be destroyed on the boards unless we can get a really good PF from somewhere else to pair with Rudy.  Jalen might can be that guy but i dang sure wouldn't hold my breath on it this season.  He is still to fresh because nates lack of playing time to take over completely imo.

To me Collins pairs with Rudy wonderfully as he can be the stretch 4 with above avg defense Rudy needs next to him to make him work perfectly in a scheme.    To me thats always been the move is to upgrade capela without hurting the 1 thing that is your best asset next to capela or rudy.  

[JayBirdHawk]

56 minutes ago, NBASupes said:

Atlanta is looking for cheap players who can be stars off the bench. Russell has come up.

Contradictory here....cheap players but yet Russell at $31 million?

Or is it players we can get for cheap??

[RedDawg#8]

2 minutes ago, Threezus said:

To me Collins pairs with Rudy wonderfully as he can be the stretch 4 with above avg defense Rudy needs next to him to make him work perfectly in a scheme.    To me thats always been the move is to upgrade capela without hurting the 1 thing that is your best asset next to capela or rudy.  

Boom, I agree. And there has to be a way we ca upgrade the 2 with out moving JC for a pick. 

And honestly, if we get Gobert, I am interested and just running it back with the remaining pieces just to prove he is not good enough to make up for the lack of perimeter defense on the roster by himself.

 

[JayBirdHawk]

1 hour ago, NBASupes said:

1. Atlanta and Utah have hit a snag. Utah is looking for more picks and Atlanta isn't willing to even add a future 2nd much less another 1st. I am either expecting for Utah to accept Atlanta counter or simply keep Gobert which could cause a lot of trouble as both want out if the other is still on the roster. (Mitchell). I was told it was gonna take awhile for Gobert talks but Utah is pushing as they know Ayton is a serious threat and they want Atlanta to be in the game

1. Thought there were 'many' suitors for Gobert?

2. What's Atlanta's offer for Ayton?

[bleachkit]

I wouldnt do a Gobert trade if we are giving up 16 in the deal. A pick swap is the best I would do.

[sturt]

3 minutes ago, bleachkit said:

I'm of the opinion there is more wrong with this team than just untimely injuries. 

It's America. You get to do that.

But you just have to face the music--and you've mainly been dancing around it (see what I did there )--that you cannot not appreciate that .621 is .621.

What you've done at every turn in this exchange as far as I've participated in it is rhetorical whack-a-mole (can't debunk that .621 happened, and of course you can't... so you push the spotlight on the MIA series, and ignorantly (by the dictionary definition of the term) call me out as-if I've been disingenuous on that part... and then when that lazy accusation proves hollow and a fuller discussion of the MIA context is laid out, you move move the spotlight backward as-if to zoom out from the close-up examination given to just repeat the broad assertion as-if that's somehow compelling.

I'll do one better.

This team even with injuries to its most major assets STILL went .621. The vast majority of this past season, even just analyzing the 60 Real Hawks' games were played with one or more of BogBog, JC, Hunter, Capela taking a DNP.  We only had every one of our rotation players for a handful of games.

That's a damn strong team, I'm sorry, not sorry.

Could it be better? Well, it has to try because Gallo's contract demands some modifications. And certainly one has to wonder if this team had been even in the range of the middle of the pack in terms of defensive metrics, could .621 have been .671?

Theoretically? Yes. But who knows whether the defensive improvement wouldn't also correlate with an offensive correction? Hard to say, but it's cool to think about.

 

 

[RedDawg#8]

2 minutes ago, JayBirdHawk said:

Contradictory here....cheap players but yet Russell at $31 million?

Or is it players we can get for cheap??

I hope it's the latter. As that means maybe we can offload a couple of contracts like Gallo+Bogi and they actually go for it with out trying to win the trade