No Extension for John Collins

[MaceCase]

55 minutes ago, bleachkit said:

Maybe Schlenk told CLP not to run any pick n rolls during preseason to make Collins look bad, so as to undermine his value during sensitive negotiations. Just throwing out some baseless conspiracies for humor of course.

I didn't get the sense there was any plan during preseason but I don't think I'll be able to sleep well at a night if I find out Hawks brass are really Keyser Söze.

[kg01]

1 minute ago, JayBirdHawk said:

............and yet we let them leave for Nothing!

Well they didn't suck like (he thinks) Collins does.  Collins'll be lucky to sign a minimum deal. 

[JayBirdHawk]

9 minutes ago, NBASupes said:

I am 100% convinced he's Josh Smith. 

 

8 minutes ago, NBASupes said:

John Collins is to the Hawks what Jabari Parker was to the Bucks. 

You should really avoid making player comparisons..........these aren't even 1/2 star posts bruh!

[kg01]

2 minutes ago, JayBirdHawk said:

 

You should really avoid making player comparisons..........these aren't even 1/2 star posts bruh!

Who'll be the next player comp?  My money's on Adam Keefe or Cal Bowdler.

[Atlantaholic]

43 minutes ago, bleachkit said:

We aren't trading John unless it's worth it. My guess is John ends up getting a big offer in RFA and we match.

ya, that's the most likely scenario for sure. 

[REHawksFan]

55 minutes ago, bleachkit said:

Here's the thing about trading John. Wouldn't a team just wait for RFA? It's hard to see a trade happening. 

If you wait for RFA you may not get him. You may have to compete with other teams for him to sign the offer sheet and even then the hawks could match.  If you KNOW you want JC, you trade for him with the hawks and then you get the leverage of matching any deal he receives in RFA.  That's why a trade is likely if the Hawks don't want him long term at a max contract. 

[Diesel]

1 hour ago, NBASupes said:

He played PF most of his time at USC. If anything, he's flexible due to his defensive value of being able to guard any position. He said he's been working a lot of his shooting in the offseason. Maybe he is JC replacement at the 4.

The day of the small ball center is about over.  The Lakers are proving that.  You got guys like Val, Joker, KAT, Embiid... and then you have the serviceable ones who can still show some dominance over 6'8 - 6'9 235lb centers.   I hope OO is a legit 250... then he probably could play C. 

 

[JayBirdHawk]

13 minutes ago, REHawksFan said:

If you wait for RFA you may not get him. You may have to compete with other teams for him to sign the offer sheet and even then the hawks could match.  If you KNOW you want JC, you trade for him with the hawks and then you get the leverage of matching any deal he receives in RFA.  That's why a trade is likely if the Hawks don't want him long term at a max contract. 

Bearing in mind that JC's salary for this season is $4.1 million - it makes for a tough trade besides a future pick and a young player.  

The only other option will be to combine his salary with Snell for roughly $17 million outgoing.

[aali34]

3 minutes ago, Diesel said:

The day of the small ball center is about over.  The Lakers are proving that.  You got guys like Val, Joker, KAT, Embiid... and then you have the serviceable ones who can still show some dominance over 6'8 - 6'9 235lb centers.   I hope OO is a legit 250... then he probably could play C. 

 

Okungwu says he's 6'10 so he's not that small.

[NBASupes]

47 minutes ago, JayBirdHawk said:

 

You should really avoid making player comparisons..........these aren't even 1/2 star posts bruh!

It's not a direct comparison 

Josh Smith is a completely different player compared to JC but the way Hawks fans felt about him at this stage mirrors the two considering none was that good as fans thought they were.

Parker was at one time over Giannis, the face of the franchise. Many was willing to die on the Parker hill. Looking back at it, that was stupid to even consider but no one can read the future but even so, Giannis>>>> Parker potential 

Edited December 22, 2020 by NBASupes

[terrell]

4 hours ago, macdaddy said:

Regarding the 'max qualifying offer' that sounds like basically a crappy thing to do to a player like JC.  Seems like it would guarantee him wanting out. 

If our goal is to be a competitive playoff team and hopefully soon a contender then I'm not seeing Gallo and OO as answers at PF.   I mean we don't want to pay JC because of his defensive issues but we think Gallo is the answer?  Not buying that.

That's the truth.

Gallo is a 2 yr stopgap...Hopefully no one said he was the longterm answer..lol

[REHawksFan]

8 minutes ago, JayBirdHawk said:

Bearing in mind that JC's salary for this season is $4.1 million - it makes for a tough trade besides a future pick and a young player.  

The only other option will be to combine his salary with Snell for roughly $17 million outgoing.

It's a great point.  They can obviously maximize the return by including Snell or even Snell + Huerter if they chose to go that route for an all star.  The point being though is that a trade is certainly doable if the Hawks decide they aren't keeping him at a max deal.  To me, if he's playing to a max contract by mid year that means the Hawks are likely doing very well as a team so I probably would just wait til the summer and sign him to a max.  The real problematic scenario is if he's struggling and there's no real market for him (not likely). In that case, what do you do?  Over pay to keep him or let him walk?  The easy scenario is him playing very well and deserving a max contract. Benefits everyone. 

[JayBirdHawk]

9 minutes ago, NBASupes said:

It's not a direct comparison 

Josh Smith is a completely different player compared to JC but the way Hawks fans felt about him at this stage mirrors the two considering none was that good as fans thought they were.

Parker was at one time over Giannis, the face of the franchise. Many was willing to die on the Parker hill. Looking back at it, that was stupid to even consider but no one can read the future but even so, Giannis>>>> Parker potential 

You are making my point, the comparisons are flawed and absolutely no one is debating JC as a franchise player vs another player. so stop..please!

[NBASupes]

5 minutes ago, JayBirdHawk said:

You are making my point, the comparisons are flawed and absolutely no one is debating JC as a franchise player vs another player. so stop..please!

I disagree. If you think he's a max cat, comparing him as an potential all star to ballers like Donovan Mitchell, and trying to make him a franchise player, it's pure foolishness and why I say he's this generation Josh Smith 

[kg01]

8 minutes ago, JayBirdHawk said:

You are making my point, the comparisons are flawed and absolutely no one is debating JC as a franchise player vs another player. so stop..please!

You stop.  Collins is the modern-day Doug Edwards.  Would you pay Doug Edwards a max extension?

I rest my case.

(OK, I'll stop now.  Just wanna see his head explode again.)

[JayBirdHawk]

1 minute ago, NBASupes said:

I disagree. If you think he's a max cat, comparing him as an potential all star to ballers like Donovan Mitchell, and trying to make him a franchise player, it's pure foolishness and why I say he's this generation Josh Smith 

1. I've never thought/said he was a max contract player - ever

2. you've never heard anyone here refer to JC as a franchise player.

[macdaddy]

You guys are crazy.   JC is obviously JC....as in JChill.   Expect Collins to be in Greece next season.

[NBASupes]

9 minutes ago, JayBirdHawk said:

1. I've never thought/said he was a max contract player - ever

2. you've never heard anyone here refer to JC as a franchise player.

Are you reading the posts in this thread? One poster literally mentioned JC name with Donovan Mitchell 

[JayBirdHawk]

18 hours ago, Buzzard said:

Collins had just as many chances the past two seasons to make a All Star game as Mitchell. If you are not a All Star, you are not a max player. I like Collins a lot but that is a harsh reality. His camp knew this but they were probably using Fox as a example. The Kings are the last team I think Schlenk wants to emulate.

 

8 minutes ago, NBASupes said:

Are you reading the posts in this thread? One poster literally mentioned JC name with Donovan Mitchell 

In the context above by Buzz? This is what I found, unless I missed other posts....but please explain how does this come even close to what you are trying to suggest? So are you reading the actual post and the context?

But even so - 1 poster out of the many is what you are commenting on.  It's like you are the 1 poster that thinks JC is only worth $10 million - there are extremes to both sides.

[AHF]

2 hours ago, bleachkit said:

Here's the thing about trading John. Wouldn't a team just wait for RFA? It's hard to see a trade happening. 

Here is a strong argument for why a team would trade for him:  They want him and don't think he would sign with them.  

When they trade for him they get the right to match any contract.  That control has real value.  There is a big difference between trading for a RFA and trading for an UFA in the last year of their contract if you view them as a long-term piece.