Official Game Thread: Mavericks at Hawks (6 PM Tip!)

[AHF]

1 minute ago, Diesel said:

Well, Cleveland was hot garbarge but Lebron brought Love and some others with him.   And Lebron is Lebron. 

You got a good point with boston. 

 

Cleveland was hot garbage but it was 3 years of hot garbage with Kyrie with no real change.  By year 3, they had 28 year old Luol Deng, Tristan Thompson, Anderson Varajao, Dion Waiters, Spencer Hawes, Andrew Bynum, Jarrett Jack, etc.  I.e., players who played useful roles on good teams at other points in their career but who didn't amount to anything led by Kyrie.  Cleveland got the #1 overall pick, LeBron returned and the rest was history with Kyrie being a great fit as a shot maker playing second fiddle to James.  And that was the last team that felt like it was really better with Kyrie than without. 

[Spud2nique]

1 minute ago, Diesel said:

Until the Mavs get Wimbeyama. 

Nah, 0.5-3% chance. I wouldn’t put it past Adam the Silver but it would be very unlikely. 

[macdaddy]

2 minutes ago, Diesel said:

Player movement caused the Conference to get much better.  Teams like Cleveland, Boston, Philly, and NY are much better than they were 2 years ago.   We on the other hand have gotten a little better  but our jump isn't as high as theirs.

Because we haven't made moves to get better.   We made one move to improve a need by trading for DJ and then didn't make any other improvements.  in fact we let guys go and banked on journeymen and inexperienced players.  Surprisingly that didn't work.  

[Diesel]

17 minutes ago, AHF said:

Cleveland was hot garbage but it was 3 years of hot garbage with Kyrie with no real change.  By year 3, they had 28 year old Luol Deng, Tristan Thompson, Anderson Varajao, Dion Waiters, Spencer Hawes, Andrew Bynum, Jarrett Jack, etc.  I.e., players who played useful roles on good teams at other points in their career but who didn't amount to anything led by Kyrie.  Cleveland got the #1 overall pick, LeBron returned and the rest was history with Kyrie being a great fit as a shot maker playing second fiddle to James.  And that was the last team that felt like it was really better with Kyrie than without. 

Well Injury and foolishness disrupted the last Brooklyn team.. and maybe Kyrie is suited to be a good second fiddle.   But I don't lay everything going on in Dallas on Kyrie's feet.   A big part is Luka himself.  Too much, too soon.   He was crowned by the NBA but nobody told him that Embiid, Jokic, Giannis, Steph are still in the league.   They got time to meditate. 

[Spud2nique]

@Diesel caption this (my new avatar)…

 

The Hawks did all NBA fans a favor last night by beating these cupcakes .

[Diesel]

16 minutes ago, macdaddy said:

Because we haven't made moves to get better.   We made one move to improve a need by trading for DJ and then didn't make any other improvements.  in fact we let guys go and banked on journeymen and inexperienced players.  Surprisingly that didn't work.  

No matter how you look at it, the Kev Trade was as dumb as it comes.   And getting nothing for Cam . all falls in the category of moves that don't move you towards championship. 

Bey was a steal.   And we're still trying to figure out how to play DJ to be his most effective. 

 But we can't make moves to save money cna consider ourselves a championship team.   We're just a nursing team at that point.   We're trying to hold down a space... not move forward. 

 

[Spud2nique]

Luka: Wait, we aren’t even in the play in? We only have 3 games left???? We r fcked I HATE DALLAS!!! THERE ARE A LOT OF BAD THINGS GOING ON BEHIND CLOSED DOORS IN THIS ORGANIZATION!!!

Kyme: I stood up for what’s right. I don’t like it here in Dallas. I want a trade!!! 
 

[Diesel]

CAPTION THIS..

 

Luka:  I Can't believe he just fouled Trae!

Trae:  Yeah... he went for the bait!  Works everytime!!

Irving:   What the hell am I doing.. I don't even play defense!!!

[Spud2nique]

 

Trae: The Mavs agony is my (AND MY BOI SPUD’S) pleasure! 

[Spud2nique]

1 minute ago, Diesel said:

CAPTION THIS..

 

Luka:  I Can't believe he just fouled Trae!

Trae:  Yeah... he went for the bait!  Works everytime!!

Irving:   What the hell am I doing.. I don't even play defense!!!

YAAAAAAA!!!! FCK YA GIMME MORE OF THAT GOOD STUFF BABY!!!! 

[Diesel]

Caption This...

 

Irving:  This Jersey don't even fit... I hate Dallas!!

Trae:  Simon Said Put both Hands on the top of your head.  Actually, take the right one down...

Luka:  Damn... He got me.

 

[JeffS17]

DJs game has really grown on me over the course of the season, he's so good working in all the space between the restricted area and 3P line.  I think Saddiq can be a championship piece, as can Okongwu.  JJ/AJ have the talent but need a lot of development.  I'm really not sold Hunter can be a starting wing on a contender.  He reminds me so much of Tobias Harris -- just O.K.at everything and doesn't look like they give 100% every night.  JC I'm 50/50 on.  He's been shooting better lately.

 

Looking forward to seeing what Snyder and the FO does this offseason, personnel moves and new schemes.

[Diesel]

1 minute ago, JeffS17 said:

DJs game has really grown on me over the course of the season, he's so good working in all the space between the restricted area and 3P line.  I think Saddiq can be a championship piece, as can Okongwu.  JJ/AJ have the talent but need a lot of development.  I'm really not sold Hunter can be a starting wing on a contender.  He reminds me so much of Tobias Harris -- just O.K.at everything and doesn't look like they give 100% every night.

 

Looking forward to seeing what Snyder and the FO does this offseason, personnel moves and new schemes.

 

People give DJ a lot of crap because he had the slump.   I watched him before the slump.   He's a good player and a good compliment to Trae... we just need more creativity in our offense.   We tend to want to gravitate to what's efficient.

It really shows in our out of bounds plays.   We suck. 

The one thing that I would like to see DJ work on (well two things):  1.  His ball handling.  He's very loose with the ball.  Against good defenders, it gets stolen.  2.  His man defense.

We're asking Dj to do a lot.  He's expected to be an OG and he doesn't have OG size.   He's got the frame to put on more weight and i think he should. I would like to see him add 25 lbs of muscle.   A good 205.   205 won't look bad on 6'4".  I mean Marcus Smart is 223 and he knows how to use all that weight.   205 would put him about Zach Lavine neighborhood... I'd even take 200. 

 

[sturt]

49 minutes ago, macdaddy said:

Because we haven't made moves to get better.

 

Would you say that's because we didn't want to get better?

Or because no other opportunity arose that, in the view of the authorities, would have made us better?

 

I believe that Tony has set us up for failure in some ways that I've explained over the last few weeks, but I don't for a minute doubt that Tony is passionate about seeing the team his group owns succeed.

I believe that it's extremely difficult to get better through trades for the simple reason that other teams also ordinarily want to get better. And in the subset of those deals that would irrefutably would make us better, that comes at a cost of salary, luxury taxes, constraints as a consequence of being in the luxury tax, and/or sacrificing future injection of young talent through the draft.

 

What we can say with some confidence is that we did  make a deal that made us worse than we otherwise would have been in 2023. There can be no legitimate argument that having Kevin Huerter on the roster instead of Justin Holiday would have been a plus... not only in terms of talent in a silo but in terms of chemistry. What gain emerged from obtaining Murray was somewhat neutralized by dispatching Huerter.

[Sothron]

I have said for yeeeears that Kyrie is the most overrated player in the NBA. His handle is the only elite thing he has. He's a terrible defender, not a good passer and is streaky af when it comes to shooting. 

But if you listen to BSPN he's just amazing! 

[Final_quest]

14 hours ago, kg01 said:

It wasn't a win.  It was a non-loss.

Our real record is like 20-39-19.

It's a W/L/nL line 'cause about 19 of our wins are non-losses where we tried like the dickens to give it away.  But the opponent hot-potatoed the W back to us 'cause they suck too. 

I'm keeping the 50/50 mantra, you could also say we had 19 non-wins due to poor officiating.  Those would be games we would have won if the calls were accurate.  So the record is more like 20-20-19-19, W/L/nL/nW.  

I thought last season was weird.  This season is like being in purgatory.

[JeffS17]

28 minutes ago, Sothron said:

His handle is the only elite thing he has.

His finishing around the rim/layup package is second to none in the entire NBA.

For what it's worth, agree with you on everything else, passing/vision is underwhelming and defensively he's horrible

[macdaddy]

57 minutes ago, sturt said:

 

Would you say that's because we didn't want to get better?

Or because no other opportunity arose that, in the view of the authorities, would have made us better?

 

I believe that Tony has set us up for failure in some ways that I've explained over the last few weeks, but I don't for a minute doubt that Tony is passionate about seeing the team his group owns succeed.

I believe that it's extremely difficult to get better through trades for the simple reason that other teams also ordinarily want to get better. And in the subset of those deals that would irrefutably would make us better, that comes at a cost of salary, luxury taxes, constraints as a consequence of being in the luxury tax, and/or sacrificing future injection of young talent through the draft.

 

What we can say with some confidence is that we did  make a deal that made us worse than we otherwise would have been in 2023. There can be no legitimate argument that having Kevin Huerter on the roster instead of Justin Holiday would have been a plus... not only in terms of talent in a silo but in terms of chemistry. What gain emerged from obtaining Murray was somewhat neutralized by dispatching Huerter.

I think we wanted to stay under that tax.  That was goal #1 and goal #2 was be as good as possible while doing that.  This is it.   .500.    I think most teams have the desire to win but not necessarily the stomach to spend like is necessary.  

Like you said, just trading Kev for nothing.  Trading Gallo and not replacing him.   Relying on a bench with very little experience and no elite bucket getters or plus defenders.   

Sixers brought in Harden,  Cavs got Mitchell, Knicks got Brunson.    We got DJ but had a net talent loss.  They all passed us.  

Celtics brought White and Brogdon to an already contending team.   You have to keep adding to move up.  We just tried to shuffle talent and lost. 

[Gray Mule]

15 hours ago, Peoriabird said:

Sacramento ain't winning sh-t this year

Too late!  They already have!  Made the playoffs for the first time in years!

[macdaddy]

2 minutes ago, Gray Mule said:

Too late!  They already have!  Made the playoffs for the first time in years!

Yes.  I wish we were having their success.