Premium Member Diesel Posted July 7, 2017 Premium Member Report Share Posted July 7, 2017 4 hours ago, rd79 said: I disagree here. Sometimes you may be willing to pay a player more than you think he's worth on the field - for a lot of reasons. Because he sells you merch, to keep a working group together, because you need one of his strenght desperately, because you just have money to spend or like the Knicks did in this case to distract the former team from matching. So if we had more money to spend and not tied that much dollars on Baze (and/or Plumlee) one could think about matching, to keep at least a core of young players already familiar with each other, the coach and the system together and build around them Yeah.. but that's wrongheaded. Let's imagine there's no Bazemore and no Bazemore contract. Do you match on the basis of THJrs Ability and Possibilities? If the answer is yes, then we should match. Here's the what if. What if THJr has his coming out party and he becomes a 24/4/3 type player who shoot a very good percentage? Would you feel justified in saying... we couldn't resign him because of Baze's salary? That's the way that Losers think. Losers think about things in a non-basketball way. I'm saying consider THJr free of all these other distractions. Do you think he has the potential to be a player that is as good or better than that contract? If you do.. resign him and when he gets there, if you're still that much concerned with the cap, trade him. Or find a way to trade Baze... but don't let good talent go out the door because you think like a loser. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Member sturt Posted July 7, 2017 Premium Member Report Share Posted July 7, 2017 @ATLien_ I just view any of the three options as non-consequential. A wash. None of the above were going to make a difference, none of the above were going to be part of a young core... and/but THjr stood as good a chance as the other two to make a difference and be part of the core. Just my opinion, but I feel confident to say there is no team that will offer to Oubre or Portis a contract worth ~17% of the cap when either of those get to the same point in their careers. That's just how I see it, though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Member Sothron Posted July 7, 2017 Premium Member Report Share Posted July 7, 2017 Just now, ATLien_ said: I believe in general all rookies are bad defensively. LeBron was not good defensively in year one. Taurean Prince was not good defensively early. There is nothing physically keeping Collins from being a good defender other than elite length. Length helps you block shots doesn't necessarily mean your a good defender. He doesn't have poor feet or athleticism like Kanter or Okafor. He was the primary scoring option on his team. I expect he will become at worst a average NBA defender. His defensive awareness is very poor, but that's what coaching and the bench is for. Lets not plan around his D until we know what he'll be. All of that is true but the only thing right now we have to go by is his college tape. And it is terribad on defense. I'm hopeful he can at least be average on defense at some point but right now? He needs a mobile shot blocking center to help cover for him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ATLien_ Posted July 7, 2017 Report Share Posted July 7, 2017 4 minutes ago, sturt said: @ATLien_ I just view any of the three options as non-consequential. A wash. None of the above were going to make a difference, none of the above were going to be part of a young core... and/but THjr stood as good a chance as the other two to make a difference and be part of the core. Just my opinion, but I feel confident to say there is no team that will offer to Oubre or Portis a contract worth ~17% of the cap when either of those get to the same point in their careers. That's just how I see it, though. Lol the way money is being thrown around who knows, but Taj Gibson is a good comparable to Portis and he just go 14m at 30 plus. Dieng just got broke off too. At the end of the day I never believed in THJ upside. If they believe he's going to breakout they'll match. If they believe he'll continue to be average why match? To your point if all outcomes are about the same why not keep the younger cheaper asset? At the time of trade our team was full of in prime players that we're due big pay days. Cheap assets are the life blood of those teams and we sacrificed 3 years of cheap. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Admin capstone21 Posted July 7, 2017 Admin Report Share Posted July 7, 2017 36 minutes ago, Diesel said: Yeah.. but that's wrongheaded. Let's imagine there's no Bazemore and no Bazemore contract. Do you match on the basis of THJrs Ability and Possibilities? If the answer is yes, then we should match. Here's the what if. What if THJr has his coming out party and he becomes a 24/4/3 type player who shoot a very good percentage? Would you feel justified in saying... we couldn't resign him because of Baze's salary? That's the way that Losers think. Losers think about things in a non-basketball way. I'm saying consider THJr free of all these other distractions. Do you think he has the potential to be a player that is as good or better than that contract? If you do.. resign him and when he gets there, if you're still that much concerned with the cap, trade him. Or find a way to trade Baze... but don't let good talent go out the door because you think like a loser. Baz contract or not I don't match this offer. I believe this is a huge overpay and the Knicks made a big mistake by giving this to hTimmy. Hardeway is really a sixth man microwave type player in this league. He bring some instant scoring and some fun dunks but I don't see him much more then this. He isn't a difference maker ... he isn't great on d although isn't horrible... he doesn't really make others around him better ... he has a pretty suspect shot selection ... but he can score. He is not worth the almost 18 per year for 4 years contract that is almost untradable due to the kicker. Knicks really wanted to make sure it wasn't matched. I think his talent can be replaceable and it even can be someone like Bembry who does it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JTB Posted July 7, 2017 Author Report Share Posted July 7, 2017 hahaha THJ to stay???!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Member cam1218 Posted July 7, 2017 Premium Member Report Share Posted July 7, 2017 If we have somebody that will take Baze, sure? It doesn't make sense otherwise. That also sounds like we planned on matching but didn't expect to pay that much money... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theheroatl Posted July 7, 2017 Report Share Posted July 7, 2017 Nope. There were reports that they were expecting around $11-12 million a year... Don't think Schlenk will want to match $19 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Admin capstone21 Posted July 7, 2017 Admin Report Share Posted July 7, 2017 That tweet reads they were planning to match offers until this crazy one came in 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ATLSmith Posted July 7, 2017 Report Share Posted July 7, 2017 I'm not the forum police or anything, but could this have neen posted in the current THJ thread instead? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
REHawksFan Posted July 7, 2017 Report Share Posted July 7, 2017 9 minutes ago, JTB said: hahaha THJ to stay???!!!! That's not at all what that tweet says. It clearly says the Hawks had planned to match any offer but now they're tested because of the extreme magnitude of this one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Admin capstone21 Posted July 7, 2017 Admin Report Share Posted July 7, 2017 Just now, ATLSmith said: I'm not the forum police or anything, but could this have neen posted in the current THJ thread instead? And the title is misleading 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bankingitbig Posted July 7, 2017 Report Share Posted July 7, 2017 46 minutes ago, REHawksFan said: That's not at all what that tweet says. It clearly says the Hawks had planned to match any offer but now they're tested because of the extreme magnitude of this one. I don't recall seeing much written or said about the Hawks saying they planned to match any offer for THJ. I don't think Sam Amick is in the know. That said, it is always in the best interest of a team to say that they will match any offer no matter what to scare teams away from tying up their salary cap for a RFA. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wolvetigers Posted July 7, 2017 Report Share Posted July 7, 2017 5 hours ago, h4wkfan said: This would be the worst defensive time of all time. This team is far from perfect that includes Defense but we are not starting from scratch in this proposed model...If we are going to tank completely it will be 4 to 5 years before we reach viable status again...I mean do you guys remember the BK years? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ATLSmith Posted July 7, 2017 Report Share Posted July 7, 2017 I'm just going to leave this here... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wolvetigers Posted July 7, 2017 Report Share Posted July 7, 2017 9 hours ago, 615Hawk said: So glad we have Hawks University so we can continue to develop players for other NBA teams to overpay for. At least we have Baze! Sad but true...I do like THJ as a future piece of the Hawks but F#cK the Knicks - 4yr/71mill is pretty crazy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators AHF Posted July 7, 2017 Moderators Report Share Posted July 7, 2017 7 minutes ago, ATLSmith said: I'm just going to leave this here... Post-season highlights are here: 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ATLSmith Posted July 7, 2017 Report Share Posted July 7, 2017 2 minutes ago, AHF said: Post-season highlights are here: You forgot to.... Ooohhh.... Still the kid can play. Not sure if I'm qualified to say he's worth the match on the Knicks offer but if the Hawks do sign him it's not all bad. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators AHF Posted July 7, 2017 Moderators Report Share Posted July 7, 2017 Just now, ATLSmith said: You forgot to.... Ooohhh.... Still the kid can play. Not sure if I'm qualified to say he's worth the match on the Knicks offer but if the Hawks do sign him it's not all bad. I wanted him back and prefer him to Baze but he isn't worth $71M with a 15% trade kicker. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thecampster Posted July 7, 2017 Report Share Posted July 7, 2017 Yes but THj resigned does free lock up a roster spot and free us up to move Baze if need be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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