2020-21 The Current Ask Supes

[thescout]

2 hours ago, NBASupes said:

I'll believe it when I see it. I was extremely disappointed in JC this playoff run if we are talking this type of contract. If this was 5th man money, I could care less but this is franchise player money. I really don't see that shit with JC. I hope he brings it, because he's going to be expected to. It's not enough to defend him when he's getting franchise player money. It's easy to do it now being that he's on a rookie deal. I don't think Smoove or Al ever got franchise player money from the Hawks. Only Iso Joe and he had to deal with high expectations and obviously Marvin because of where was drafted. 

Collins had his moments in the playoffs good and bad. There were times when the Bucks just dominated  the Hawks on the boards. Where was Collins? Both Capella and JC you didn't even think they were on the floor vs the Bucks who got 2nd,3rd etc shots. Scoring wise games where JC was invisible . The man's almost 7 ft where's his post up game? Get a steady jump shot. If the Hawks are going to pay this kind of money then JC needs to take his game to another level. There are to many players that sign the big contract and don't play up to it. Generally what you see is what you get from players. I hope JC improves and like all the Hawks work on your #%%@ free throws. How many points were thrown away by not making a free throw. 

[thescout]

Just now, thescout said:

Collins had his moments in the playoffs good and bad. There were times when the Bucks just dominated  the Hawks on the boards. Where was Collins? Both Capella and JC you didn't even think they were on the floor vs the Bucks who got 2nd,3rd etc shots. Scoring wise games where JC was invisible . The man's almost 7 ft where's his post up game? Get a steady jump shot. If the Hawks are going to pay this kind of money then JC needs to take his game to another level. There are to many players that sign the big contract and don't play up to it. Generally what you see is what you get from players. I hope JC improves and like all the Hawks work on your #%%@ free throws. How many points were thrown away by not making a free throw. 

I'm also not buying the when Hunter and Reddish come back the Hawks rebounding will get better against elite teams. I'd like to see a big that can get boards. 

[gurpilo]

hace 6 horas, thecampster dijo:

TBH, my concern isn't with the salaries right now or the contract lengths, its with us not taking a center to develop this year for when after Clint's contract is up in 2 years. Either OO's your guy and you need his backup or OO's a F/C and you need a starter/backup. I'm wondering if in free agency we don't take one to develop and one to play.

That point is what I have been missing from Hawks since long time. Good teams always have good bigs developing. The young bigs we have are all small, Knight, Fernando, Okongwu... seems we always have problems to find a C with legit size.

[NBASupes]

28 minutes ago, gurpilo said:

That point is what I have been missing from Hawks since long time. Good teams always have good bigs developing. The young bigs we have are all small, Knight, Fernando, Okongwu... seems we always have problems to find a C with legit size.

Finding bigs with legit size that could play at the pace and tempo of the NBA is extremely difficult and rarely do they go undrafted and if they do, they are raw like E.J. Onu. 

[gurpilo]

hace 21 minutos, NBASupes dijo:

Finding bigs with legit size that could play at the pace and tempo of the NBA is extremely difficult and rarely do they go undrafted and if they do, they are raw like E.J. Onu.

Onu was one guy I wanted us to try on summer league, he is going to Dallas instead. Good teams always try that kind of players.

[gurpilo]

Hartenstein, Tony Bradley, Harry Giles are big projects we could try to develop. 

[NBASupes]

7 minutes ago, gurpilo said:

Hartenstein, Tony Bradley, Harry Giles are big projects we could try to develop. 

How? They aren't going to sign for the E10. They don't qualify for the two-way contract. 

[gurpilo]

hace 7 minutos, NBASupes dijo:

How? They aren't going to sign for the E10. They don't qualify for the two-way contract. 

We have 10 players under contract + 2 rookies, Young, Wright, Cooper, Bogi, Huerter, Hunter, Reddish, Jalen Johnson, Collins, Gallo, Capela, Okongwu. You can sign 1 wing and 2 bigs, one to play significant minutes the other to develop. Then Knight and Mays as 2 way contracts.

Edited August 1, 2021 by gurpilo

[RandomFan]

Here we go again. We're gonna win a championship and people will still be in here talking about, "but yeah, good teams always have big players. If we don't find a really big center soon then we might not win that fifth title in a row. You mark my words."

[NBASupes]

13 minutes ago, gurpilo said:

We have 10 players under contract + 2 rookies, Young, Wright, Cooper, Bogi, Huerter, Hunter, Reddish, Jalen Johnson, Collins, Gallo, Capela, Okongwu. You can sign 1 wing and 2 bigs, one to play significant minutes the other to develop. Then Knight and Mays as 2 way contracts.

8 players

2 rookies 

JC and Lou Williams 

Vet center 

13 players

 

Technically,  the Hawks could sign Cooper, Mays, and Knight to long term minimum contracts

Edited August 1, 2021 by NBASupes

[thecampster]

8 hours ago, MarylandHawk said:

I don’t why you get upset about money, it means nothing in the soft cap NBA. Only thing that matters is are we winning. Don’t mess with the winning formula. NBA teams can do what they want. Did you ever think you would see what you are seeing in LA and Brooklyn. Let’s not even mention Golden State. The cap is at 132 Mil this year before paying luxury tax. We are nearly 40 mil under that. Schlenk has already set the math up in future years so that we maintain good cap flexibility even with John and Trae’s extension.  Let that man get his. Plus he is the type of guy that won’t let the money change him and will still be a good team guy, spokesman, and leader for the franchise. 

We're gonna finish with a salary of 125 to 130ish. That's why he's worried. He would like to keep the other 3 players pushing us there (Clint, Gallo, Bogi) as long as we can.  There have been media reports of us giving up on one of the 5 (Trae, JC, Reddish, Hunter, Huerter). If we keep all 3 of the first 3, we would have problems keeping the last 5. He's seeing the future.  Supes is much more of a talent, rumors guy and has been getting up to speed on the cap stuff in the last year. His concerns are valid though still a new realm for him to be thinking of so he may not be able to see every angle like Jaybird, myself, Sturt and a few others on the board. He's much more of  "how they all fit" guy and not a "how they all fit under the cap guy" but to his credit, he's made an effort the last year + to learn that stuff.  This isn't the stuff you casually learn in a year. The CBA is a complicated mess and I'll admit I don't like reading it. We have a few lawyers on the board and they don't like reading it, because its that long.  There's some reading a few pages back and in the salary cap thread on this. Sturts' got a spreadsheet and I have Summary sheet that show why he (Supes) is expressing concern.

[thecampster]

2 hours ago, NBASupes said:

Finding bigs with legit size that could play at the pace and tempo of the NBA is extremely difficult and rarely do they go undrafted and if they do, they are raw like E.J. Onu. 

cough, cough, Queta......oh yah we passed on him.

[gurpilo]

hace 45 minutos, thecampster dijo:

cough, cough, Queta......oh yah we passed on him.

Jejeje, well I think everybody agrees Cooper was a no brainer

[gurpilo]

hace 49 minutos, thecampster dijo:

We're gonna finish with a salary of 125 to 130ish. That's why he's worried. He would like to keep the other 3 players pushing us there (Clint, Gallo, Bogi) as long as we can.  There have been media reports of us giving up on one of the 5 (Trae, JC, Reddish, Hunter, Huerter). If we keep all 3 of the first 3, we would have problems keeping the last 5. He's seeing the future.  Supes is much more of a talent, rumors guy and has been getting up to speed on the cap stuff in the last year. His concerns are valid though still a new realm for him to be thinking of so he may not be able to see every angle like Jaybird, myself, Sturt and a few others on the board. He's much more of  "how they all fit" guy and not a "how they all fit under the cap guy" but to his credit, he's made an effort the last year + to learn that stuff.  This isn't the stuff you casually learn in a year. The CBA is a complicated mess and I'll admit I don't like reading it. We have a few lawyers on the board and they don't like reading it, because its that long.  There's some reading a few pages back and in the salary cap thread on this. Sturts' got a spreadsheet and I have Summary sheet that show why he (Supes) is expressing concern.

The only player worth resigning after his contract is over is probably Capela. Gallo will be finished and Bogi probably as well. Their value will be much less, probably Capela maintains it.

The issue here is maintaining talent through draft to find replacements for this players, we made it great this draft, awesome!! We found Gallo replacement.

Now we need to go for Capela replacement, or Okongwu replacement when he is promoted to starting role and Bogi replacement. 

[RedDawg#8]

20 minutes ago, gurpilo said:

Jejeje, well I think everybody agrees Cooper was a no brainer

 

1 hour ago, thecampster said:

cough, cough, Queta......oh yah we passed on him.

Im pretty sure Queta went before Cooper.

Yup, says he went 39th.

 

[thecampster]

13 minutes ago, RedDawg#8 said:

 

Im pretty sure Queta went before Cooper.

Yup, says he went 39th.

 

We have 2 barrels full of future assets. There was no reason we couldn't jump up and take both.  Queta is the perfect bench big. Solid post D, shot blocker, long, some offense, can pass out of the post.  Won't dazzle you or shoot from 3 but you really don't need that 12 minutes a night. Just need a solid interior player to stop other teams from going on runs.

Edited August 1, 2021 by thecampster

[JayBirdHawk]

9 hours ago, bleachkit said:

Yea, but the problem with having the whole core on their second contract is we will not be able to afford to bring in quality vets, like we did with Gallo and Bogi. 

This is where Schlenk will have to add another layer to his GMing. He's shown he can draft, early on he used our capspace to get assets to move up in the draft (Hunter) and to trade for talent (Clint). He had foresite to then use capspace to sign quality vets (Gallo and Bogi) to help us win - all before any of the young core was due a pay day. Now we are here.  He's going to have to now show that he can find the vets on those MLE/Min deals once the core gets to their second contract. 

As of today, Trae is the only one that has earned the right to his rookie early designated max. He was that guy from the start.  Hunter started showing something early in year 2, now we are 2 knee surgeries later and Cam remains as consistent as ever. They both have a lot to prove.

[marco102]

8 hours ago, thescout said:

Collins had his moments in the playoffs good and bad. There were times when the Bucks just dominated  the Hawks on the boards. Where was Collins? Both Capella and JC you didn't even think they were on the floor vs the Bucks who got 2nd,3rd etc shots. Scoring wise games where JC was invisible . The man's almost 7 ft where's his post up game? Get a steady jump shot. If the Hawks are going to pay this kind of money then JC needs to take his game to another level. There are to many players that sign the big contract and don't play up to it. Generally what you see is what you get from players. I hope JC improves and like all the Hawks work on your #%%@ free throws. How many points were thrown away by not making a free throw. 

Pretty sure it was Pat C. getting most of those offensive rebounds or another of their guards or wings getting them.  Our bigs were busy with help defense.  This is why I believe Hunter and Reddish will help defensive rebounding because they are much bigger bodies,  better perimeter defenders which will allow JC and Capela to stay in better position, and both have shown the ability to be plus rebounders for their position.

Collins  in 29.8 minutes had rebound totals of 15, 8, 8, 7, 8 and 11.  That's an average of 9.5 rebounds per game in slightly less than 30 minutes.  Collins rebounded fine.  

Capella was at 10.3, but most of that was do to the 19 in game one. 

I'd just like to see how we do with Hunter and Reddish before declaring we need to revamp our entire front court when Milwaukee's been one of the best rebounding teams for the past three years.  That's not saying I don't want to add a bigger center, I do. I just hate all this blaming specific players for losing to the NBA champs.  There's more going on than just the bigs. If they are out of position helping our porous perimeter defense, it's not necessarily the bigs fault the offensive rebound was given up.

 

Edited August 1, 2021 by marco102

[sturt]

36 minutes ago, JayBirdHawk said:

This is where Schlenk will have to add another layer to his GMing.

This is my one disappointment with this draft, but it feels hyper critical to say so.... ie, part of the ingenuity that kept SAS relevant for as long as they were is they were arguably the most aggressive Eurostash team for lo those many years. For a team that expects to be drafting late for a few years, accumulating some extra 2nd rounders and using those to pick up some European developmental pieces ends up acting as a supplement year after year as those fruits ripen.

[MarylandHawk]

2 hours ago, thecampster said:

We're gonna finish with a salary of 125 to 130ish. That's why he's worried. He would like to keep the other 3 players pushing us there (Clint, Gallo, Bogi) as long as we can.  There have been media reports of us giving up on one of the 5 (Trae, JC, Reddish, Hunter, Huerter). If we keep all 3 of the first 3, we would have problems keeping the last 5. He's seeing the future.  Supes is much more of a talent, rumors guy and has been getting up to speed on the cap stuff in the last year. His concerns are valid though still a new realm for him to be thinking of so he may not be able to see every angle like Jaybird, myself, Sturt and a few others on the board. He's much more of  "how they all fit" guy and not a "how they all fit under the cap guy" but to his credit, he's made an effort the last year + to learn that stuff.  This isn't the stuff you casually learn in a year. The CBA is a complicated mess and I'll admit I don't like reading it. We have a few lawyers on the board and they don't like reading it, because its that long.  There's some reading a few pages back and in the salary cap thread on this. Sturts' got a spreadsheet and I have Summary sheet that show why he (Supes) is expressing concern.

Yeah the cap is a complicated mess and is so flexible that the really smart GM’s can manipulate to their benefit.  I understand Supes, but I don’t want him getting mad at John. The market is determining John’s value not just his play. He is the most valuable power forward on the market today and he will get paid as such. As far as his performance, we have seen him put up historical numbers with his efficiency and we have seen him been key piece on a winning team. We have so many good players on this team his numbers are impacted. I also think he still has upside we haven’t seen.  He has earned this. The other point I was trying to make is as long as there is a path to winning it all, owners will pay whatever it takes but if there isn’t a path to winning they are not going to keep paying. Long story short is, once you find the guys you can win with and they want to be here, keep them here. If you start losing move whoever you have to move to get back to winning.