Official Game Thread: Hawks at heat (Sunday)

[kg01]

29 minutes ago, Peoriabird said:

Huerter is a high quality bench guy not a starter. 

Shhhhhhhhhhhhh ..... listen for it ............ the reason he's starting is .............................................................. Bogd is hurt.

[JayBirdHawk]

Could have cut to the lead to 2 - these are back breakers.  WIDE OPEN....Quality Look.

https://streamable.com/ynkwtn

 

 

[AUhawksfan]

26 minutes ago, Peoriabird said:

So having the league leader in rebounds, 3rd in blocks, 3rd in assist, team that shoots 36% from 3 collectively, leads the league in free throw attempts and makes is a bad hand??? What did Clinton use to say?  "Deal Me in"!

I meant from an injury perspective.  Haven't been able to see how this team works cohesively as a unit.  Having some pieces here and there still don't make the whole.

[NBASupes]

Just now, JayBirdHawk said:

Last Season and this offseason it was JC.

Now it's Trae's turn.

Next up - the guy who'll break the NBA.

I'm here for it all.

Wrong, I never jumped off of the JC train. I was never on the max cat JC train either. I wanted him paid like Sabonis and Turner and I got mad when he turned down big money but I was never like, he isn't what he is. He is what he is. In fact, JC been improving. 

I am literally jumping off of the Trae train or close to it. I am seeing the impact red flags and I don't see it easily changing. I hope it does. It did with Jeff Teague and he redeemed 95% of his assumed value. When I jumped off, I was sure he would only redeem 75% of his value and be a marginal starting PG like Lue or Anthony Johnson but he became a good two way PG. He never became the Kevin Johnson that I had hoped he would be as a prospect but he really became a good player and was big on a 60 win team.

[Peoriabird]

1 minute ago, AUhawksfan said:

I meant from an injury perspective.  Haven't been able to see how this team works cohesively as a unit.  Having some pieces here and there still don't make the whole.

A lot of teams are in the same boat.  We should not lose to teams like Cleveland and OKC

[REHawksFan]

6 minutes ago, JayBirdHawk said:

Thanks for the info. Imagine what it would be if Gallo could hit some, Huerter can be consistent and Cam can stop bottom feeding.  I think that 36% is also bolstered by Snell's 53% from 3

The reality is, if we are talking about the 4th quarter and closing games out, the scoring hasn't been the biggest problem.  They generally rank middle of the pack in most scoring metrics in the 4th quarter.  Not great, could certainly improve, but not fatal either.  Where they lose games is they rank 29th in the NBA in pts allowed in the 4th quarter and 30th in pts per 100 poss.  

And if you want to isolate it further, the Hawks rank 30th in 2nd chance points in the 4th quarter and 29th in defensive rebounding in the 4th quarter.  I can't verify it with the numbers, but it screams taking Clint out is a bad bad idea.  

[NBASupes]

1 hour ago, bleachkit said:

I'll be honest, Trae does kinda give me that Smooth feeling of being a super talented guy that never over comes fatal flaws. Hope I'm wrong.

I do too. It's hard not to see it. Its like, all Trae gotta do is play smarter and f***ing move. You aren't 250 like Harden, why aren't you running non stop off the ball. Why do you always standing, you aren't Westbrook. You don't have that athletic ability he had in his prime

Edited March 1, 2021 by NBASupes

[AUhawksfan]

2 minutes ago, Peoriabird said:

A lot of teams are in the same boat.  We should not lose to teams like Cleveland and OKC

I'm not disagreeing with you.  My point was, the team has dealt with a fair amount of injuries which is nobody's fault including Lloyd. 

 

At the same time, when teams are down this is where you also see a lot of coaches earn their mettle and I haven't seen it with this team.  Plenty of games we should've won if we just had the right strategy.  Many others we could've competed better in as well.  If anything it has made the decisions more glaring whereas if we had a full roster they might have been covered up a little more.

[AHF]

26 minutes ago, JayBirdHawk said:

Could have cut to the lead to 2 - these are back breakers.  WIDE OPEN....Quality Look.

https://streamable.com/ynkwtn

 

 

That was Trae’s fault.  If you look at the pass, it doesn’t hit in hands in a place where he can immediately catch and shoot.  Instead, he ends up without a defender within 10 feet of him which we all know is the most difficult shot.  Then Trae fails to use his telekinetic powers to push the ball through the cylinder.  Had Trae not used them up on Gallo the other night, his telekinesis could have brought us ahead in this one.  Selfish.

[REHawksFan]

19 minutes ago, REHawksFan said:

The reality is, if we are talking about the 4th quarter and closing games out, the scoring hasn't been the biggest problem.  They generally rank middle of the pack in most scoring metrics in the 4th quarter.  Not great, could certainly improve, but not fatal either.  Where they lose games is they rank 29th in the NBA in pts allowed in the 4th quarter and 30th in pts per 100 poss.  

And if you want to isolate it further, the Hawks rank 30th in 2nd chance points in the 4th quarter and 29th in defensive rebounding in the 4th quarter.  I can't verify it with the numbers, but it screams taking Clint out is a bad bad idea.  

To expand on this a little more....

Clint ranks 45th in 4th quarter defensive rebounding with 1.4 per game.  Among Centers, he ranks 28th in Def Reb and 24th in min played in the 4th qtr (min 10 games).  

So it appears Clint also suffers in the 4th but I question how much is due to limited PT and how much is just not playing well in the 4th?  

[JayBirdHawk]

20 minutes ago, NBASupes said:

Wrong, I never jumped off of the JC train. I was never on the max cat JC train either. I wanted him paid like Sabonis and Turner and I got mad when he turned down big money but I was never like, he isn't what he is. He is what he is. In fact, JC been improving. 

 

Somewhere in your Ask Supes thread or somewhere else you said exactly that.  Said you were done and wanted to move on from him. Sign Harrell and draft Obi which was before Collins turned down his deal.  @Peoriabird called you on it.

[NBASupes]

4 minutes ago, JayBirdHawk said:

 

Somewhere in your Ask Supes thread or somewhere else you said exactly that.  Said you were done and wanted to move on from him. Sign Harrell and draft Obi which was before Collins turned down his deal.  @Peoriabird called you on it.

You see why I wanted to draft Obi. Look at the situation we are in with JC and look at how much Harrell got paid. He's making 10 million per. He's a value contract. 

7 minutes ago, REHawksFan said:

To expand on this a little more....

Clint ranks 45th in 4th quarter defensive rebounding with 1.4 per game.  Among Centers, he ranks 28th in Def Reb and 24th in min played in the 4th qtr (min 10 games).  

So it appears Clint also suffers in the 4th but I question how much is due to limited PT and how much is just not playing well in the 4th?  

He always seems tired in the 4th QT. 

[Peoriabird]

8 minutes ago, JayBirdHawk said:

 

Somewhere in your Ask Supes thread or somewhere else you said exactly that.  Said you were done and wanted to move on from him. Sign Harrell and draft Obi which was before Collins turned down his deal.  @Peoriabird called you on it.

Eventually Supes will calm down as usual and forget he ever ranted for 8 hours against one of the players.  We've all seen this movie before right?

[AHF]

39 minutes ago, NBASupes said:

Wrong, I never jumped off of the JC train. I was never on the max cat JC train either. I wanted him paid like Sabonis and Turner and I got mad when he turned down big money but I was never like, he isn't what he is. He is what he is. In fact, JC been improving. 

I am literally jumping off of the Trae train or close to it. I am seeing the impact red flags and I don't see it easily changing. I hope it does. It did with Jeff Teague and he redeemed 95% of his assumed value. When I jumped off, I was sure he would only redeem 75% of his value and be a marginal starting PG like Lue or Anthony Johnson but he became a good two way PG. He never became the Kevin Johnson that I had hoped he would be as a prospect but he really became a good player and was big on a 60 win team.

Re JC, you can see where people didn’t see as you being all aboard his train.

 

On 12/22/2020 at 12:21 PM, NBASupes said:

John Collins is to the Hawks what Jabari Parker was to the Bucks. 

 

On 12/22/2020 at 11:39 AM, NBASupes said:

Gallo is better than Collins. I sooner people accept that reality, the better. 

 

On 12/17/2020 at 11:59 AM, NBASupes said:

1. I clearly like Collins more than [Josh] Smith but I think believe best case outcome is the same.

Being a long term 6th man on a contender. They can start and help pretenders but if you want to win, both are reserves. 

 

[Collins is] extremely productive but he's in the extremely productive but don't mean shit category. I know Hawks fans have in a different category but his production don't mean shit. 

 

 

 

[JayBirdHawk]

9 minutes ago, NBASupes said:

You see why I wanted to draft Obi. Look at the situation we are in with JC and look at how much Harrell got paid. He's making 10 million per. He's a value contract. 

But those were not your arguments back in February, you are hindsighting particularly with Harrell...he played himself out of a big deal in the bubble after all the WAR you presented prior as to why he could play with Capela at $22 million.

You called Collins rubbish, the reason we were losing, he was ONLY a movement player (and this was back in February last year), you compared him to Jabari  Parker.......I could go on, but I'll leave it at that.

[NBASupes]

Just now, AHF said:

Re JC, you can see where people didn’t see as you being all aboard his train.

 

 

 

 

1. Is true which is why Atlanta is letting him go

2. Gallo was clearly better last year. His regression has been massive. Maybe CP3 was more valuable than we think. He had a lot of good defensive players around him in OKC. In Atlanta, outside of the bigs, Hunt, and Cam. We got nothing. Dunn hasn't played yet. 

3. We are still waiting on #3. We will find out soon. He has his moments when he looks exactly like I said. 

[NBASupes]

3 minutes ago, JayBirdHawk said:

But those were not your arguments back in February, you are hindsighting particularly with Harrell...he played himself out of a big deal in the bubble after all the WAR you presented prior as to why he could play with Capela at $22 million.

You called Collins rubbish, the reason we were losing, he was ONLY a movement player (and this was back in February last year), you compared him to Jabari  Parker.......I could go on, but I'll leave it at that.

Milwaukee Parker. Not Atlanta Parker.

I know what I said and yes, I don't take back nothing even if I was wrong on Harrell and admitted so. Harrell was worse than I stated. 

 

[Peoriabird]

3 minutes ago, JayBirdHawk said:

But those were not your arguments back in February, you are hindsighting particularly with Harrell...he played himself out of a big deal in the bubble after all the WAR you presented prior as to why he could play with Capela at $22 million.

You called Collins rubbish, the reason we were losing, he was ONLY a movement player (and this was back in February last year), you compared him to Jabari  Parker.......I could go on, but I'll leave it at that.

Unnecessary roughness.  No pilling on @NBASupes!  He is having a bad 24 hours

[AHF]

10 minutes ago, NBASupes said:

1. Is true which is why Atlanta is letting him go

2. Gallo was clearly better last year. His regression has been massive. Maybe CP3 was more valuable than we think. He had a lot of good defensive players around him in OKC. In Atlanta, outside of the bigs, Hunt, and Cam. We got nothing. Dunn hasn't played yet. 

3. We are still waiting on #3. We will find out soon. He has his moments when he looks exactly like I said. 

JC is wayyy better than Milwaukee Parker.

It was obvious JC was better and we were bringing in Gallo to come off the bench for quality depth.  The regressions has been way worse than anyone predicted but even before then JC was going to be the top guy.

You may be the only one on the planet who isn’t decided yet whether JC is a long term starter or bench player.  You are definitely the only one on his train who still doesn’t think he is at least a legit starter.

[Threezus]

3 hours ago, NBASupes said:

 Can someone explain to me why the hell they want Sewell at #4 when the 4th best player on offense is an LT in his prime? Are you telling me you want to draft Sewell at 4 to be a freaking RT? We don't even need another tackle outside of for depth.

Give me one of the 4 QBs and I'll even consider Mac at 4. Other than that, it would be a massively wasted pick on the same level of passing on Luka but instead of for Trae, for Marvin.

I would put Matthews or Sewell at LG(a position that needs a massive upgrade) and the other at LT although im not the biggest mcgary fan at all but he should get 1 to 2 more years in this system to improve hopefully.  Also as for the QB's i really don't care for taking a QB at 4 and not have him play for the next 2 to 3 years if i don't have to when i can get a better player in Sewell and upgrade one of our biggest problems we have had for Ryan's entire career.   Im guessing you are not a Ryan fan and want to move on from him while i am not.  To me the earliest you can move on from Ryan would be 2023 to actually gain some really usable cap space and that means Wilson or Fields would be sitting for 2 years atleast and if Ryan performs to his top 5 like self again in a system that fits him best under Smith.  Then you might not even move on from Ryan then and could very well be drafting a QB that would sit for the next 4 to 5 years and that my friend would be a wasted pick at 4.  The fact you would take a QB in Mac at 4 when he's not even expected to go in the top 10 to 15 picks over the #2 player in the entire draft that actually upgrades a huge problem on the O-line is absurd to me.  Thats the complete opposite of what you are saying of the Luka thing.  Luka would be taking the BPA and using him but we settled for less talent in trae which would be what we do with Mac. 

I can atleast hear you out on Wilson and Fields as they are expected to go top 5 as more talented QB's and i wouldn't hate the picks i just would hate watching the #4 pick not be used for the next 3 or 4 years possibly and then you can't say taking a LT/LG that early is a bad thing because if you go BPA both of those positions have gone that early i don't see how anyone would not want to take a Quenton Nelson at 4 type of player and Sewell is supposed to be as good if not better than him when you actually have a big need for that.