Official Game Thread: Hawks at Lakers

[Gray Mule]

24 minutes ago, Hawkmoor said:

Trae, don't run from him, at least take a swat at the ball.  This defense has to tighten up.  They giving up waay to many points.

Trae stands his ground.  The King runs him over, breaking both arms and both legs.  The King has slight bruises.  Trae's career is over.  Due to his severe injuries, he will never be able to play again.

[Spud2nique]

3 hours ago, Diesel said:

CAPTION THIS....

Dylan:  Hey buddy, she wants to go to the Lakers game tonight. 

Kristen:  I want to go see that Trae guy... he's so cute. 

Leonardo:  I spend all my money to make my hair look like this and you think a little guy with Bedhead is cute??

 

you’re crazy. I like you, but you’re crazy  

[Spud2nique]

29 minutes ago, Gray Mule said:

Trae stands his ground.  The King runs him over, breaking both arms and both legs.  The King has slight bruises.  Trae's career is over.  Due to his severe injuries, he will never be able to play again.

Exactly, smart plays then there’s none headed. Trae shouldn’t take that charge in a game 7 finals game… ok maybe then.. but not in the regular season.

[TheNorthCydeRises]

15 hours ago, benhillboy said:

In a short span Nunn put Trae through two screens for an easy alley oop, cut behind him for an easy layup, and hit a wide open corner three on his 0 effort rotation.  You also do realize you don’t have to score a single point to have a robust +/- don’t you?  I been trying to explain floor game for years to no avail. At some point you have to realize how horrible his ball and man pressure is and how teams salivate to exploit it on the ball, off, and in transition.

 

Bryant scored on a semi transition where he volleyed the ball to himself twice.  Trae was still In the backcourt.  A reporter just specifically asked Nate about Traes defense and he quickly deflected to the team.  He couldn’t hide the disgust on his face initially though lol.

I need a friend like you North.  I can call you a fried right?  Because if I ever went on a murderous rampage I can count on you to let me hide out at your crib, destroy the weapon, and tell authorities you never met me lol.

I know that’s your boy but Its okay to admit he’s one of the worst shooters and defenders this season.  Life goes on bruh.

These are all of Nunn's shot attempts:

https://www.nba.com/stats/events?CFID=&CFPARAMS=&ContextMeasure=FGA&EndPeriod=0&EndRange=28800&GameID=0022200590&PlayerID=1629134&RangeType=0&Season=2022-23&SeasonType=Regular Season&StartPeriod=0&StartRange=0&TeamID=1610612747&flag=3&sct=plot&section=game

 

When I look at those plays where he was guarding Nunn, which all came within about 3 minutes of each other, I can only fault Trae's effort on the back cut and on the screen Bryant set on him, where he could've made more of an effort to recover.  They also attacked Trae again in that quarter, but he got a hand in Nunn's face coming around the screen and Nunn had a shot just rim out. 

But if he gets picked off by Lebron, but still has big help that contests a shot, That's exactly how the coverage should work.  To me, that's just Nunn making a good shot and layups.

 

My thing about the Trae defensive narrative, is that for the most part, he's not the one giving up points on the defensive end.  Trae, on average, is giving up about 11 points a game.  The narrative around here, is that his defense is so bad, that he's responsible for 30+ a game.

Overall, this team is soft.  And we're small.  Trae is a small PG. Collins lacks girth and strength.  OO is only 6-8 playing center. Our biggest guy is Frank.  And even our best defenders like Murray and Hunter aren't great on the ball defenders that stop people. 

And truth be told, it's Murray and Hunter that have to slow down the main scorers on the other side.  When they don't, teams have a field day on us.

[TheNorthCydeRises]

Just now, TheNorthCydeRises said:

These are all of Nunn's shot attempts:

https://www.nba.com/stats/events?CFID=&CFPARAMS=&ContextMeasure=FGA&EndPeriod=0&EndRange=28800&GameID=0022200590&PlayerID=1629134&RangeType=0&Season=2022-23&SeasonType=Regular Season&StartPeriod=0&StartRange=0&TeamID=1610612747&flag=3&sct=plot&section=game

 

When I look at those plays where he was guarding Nunn, which all came within about 3 minutes of each other, I can only fault Trae's effort on the back cut and on the screen Bryant set on him, where he could've made more of an effort to recover.  They also attacked Trae again in that quarter, but he got a hand in Nunn's face coming around the screen and Nunn had a shot just rim out. 

But if he gets picked off by Lebron, but still has big help that contests a shot, That's exactly how the coverage should work.  To me, that's just Nunn making a good shot and layups.

 

My thing about the Trae defensive narrative, is that for the most part, he's not the one giving up points on the defensive end.  Trae, on average, is giving up about 11 points a game.  The narrative around here, is that his defense is so bad, that he's responsible for 30+ a game.

Overall, this team is soft.  And we're small.  Trae is a small PG. Collins lacks girth and strength.  OO is only 6-8 playing center. Our biggest guy is Frank.  And even our best defenders like Murray and Hunter aren't great on the ball defenders that stop people. 

And truth be told, it's Murray and Hunter that have to slow down the main scorers on the other side.  When they don't, teams have a field day on us.

That chart is actually Trae's Defensive Dashboard chart.  Overall, he's trending to be an average defender when he's guarding someone, which completely goes against the WOAT narrative.

[TheNorthCydeRises]

16 hours ago, NBASupes said:

Bro, NC don't care. You know the people on this site who care, just talk with them instead of arguing with people who already made their mind up on things.

 

I back up everything I say on this site, sir.  More than most.

I'm not an emotional fan.

[TheNorthCydeRises]

4 hours ago, Atlantaholic said:

I'm not sure that's completely accurate. I think it's obvious we struggle the most when either of them is not in the game, obviously because our bench is perhaps the worst bench in the entire NBA. Trae is struggling with or without DJM in the game and DJM is pretty much putting up the same numbers he did last year (sans the assists).

But that's not to say I disagree we should trade one of them. This team is crap and we need to retool.

 

It's not accurate at all.  The team starts to struggle every time one of them goes out.  That's when the big runs start.  We came out flat, but recovered to start the game.  Trae and Dejounte are a net positive on the floor together.

But as soon as we start mixing the reserves in, that's when the lead ballooned to double digits in that 1st quarter before we briefly got it back under.

This is why I say that Nate may want to take a shot at letting Holiday play the point for a little bit, and see if the team works a little bit better without Trae or Murray with them.

What may be going on here, is similar to what we had to do with Lou Williams and Delon Wright. When Lou got in the game, he was looking for his shot and not moving the ball.  If he was on, great.  If he was off, the offense stagnated mightily.

I think only Diesel mentioned Murray's shooting last night late in the game, when he was 5 - 16 FG.  Remember, he started out 3 - 4 FG.  that means he missed 10 of his next 12 shots. And a lot of those shots came while playing with reserves on the floor.  Murray would make his last 2 shots to end up 7 - 18.

Dejounte's and Trae's 2-man lineups look eerily similar.

Dejounte

 

Trae

 

Dejounte and Trae are ( + ) on the season playing with our starters, and ( - ) on the season playing with most of our reserves.  Trae looks to play better with AJ, while Dejounte looks to play better with A Holiday.

Both of them are HORRIBLE with Bogi.

[TheNorthCydeRises]

2 hours ago, Hawkmoor said:

Trae, don't run from him, at least take a swat at the ball.  This defense has to tighten up.  They giving up waay to many points.

 

All Trae would've done there is either get himself hurt, or fouled Lebron and put him at the line.  Lebron is 6-9 and has to be close to 265 - 270 these days. 

But you want 6-1 .  .180 lb Trae young to step in the gap and challenge Lebron going full speed to the basket?

That's just nitpicking at everything Trae does.

If anything, Lebron may kick that out to the corner where they have a guy wide open for a 3, who Trae was initially guarding before he saw Lebron charging to the basket.

If Lebron kicks that ball out and they make a 3, ya'll would blame Trae for that too.

[NBASupes]

33 minutes ago, TheNorthCydeRises said:

 

I back up everything I say on this site, sir.  More than most.

I'm not an emotional fan.

Bro, you are extremely bias to Trae Young. We are all bias, I know I am but I own it. Many deny it and think it's facts when it's not. It is what it is. I like everyone here outside of two posters. 

[TheNorthCydeRises]

4 hours ago, Gray Mule said:

Nope.  You are not alone.  This old man has been asking for the Hawks to trade for Mark Williams, rookie, on the Hornet's roster.  He's a center, 7' + and about 245 lbs.  They will not give him away - He was a 1st round pick last summer - but we might trade for him.

 

Remember Jock Landale?  The guy who we acquired in the Murray trade, but ended up releasing him?  He would be an ideal "energy big" to have on this team, because he has the ability to make a 3, and he has some post moves.  Most important, he can rebound the basketball and hold his own at the defensive end.

 

 

But Ressler and Schlenk was so set on keeping a roster spot open ( which we still have open ), that they neglected the need for a big like Landale, and settled on a finesse shooting big like Frank Kaminsky.

[TheNorthCydeRises]

4 minutes ago, NBASupes said:

Bro, you are extremely bias to Trae Young. We are all bias, I know I am but I own it. Many deny it and think it's facts when it's not. It is what it is. I like everyone here outside of two posters. 

And I still back up every single word that I say with more than just blank words and emotion.  I make a point to let everyone know what my thought process on things are.  Hell, I overdo it most times.

With the Hawks being small and soft, we pretty much have to do all of the little things right.  Whether it's defensive coverages, or holding onto rebounds, this team has to play close to perfect to win games.  It's not just one player that is wrong with this team.  Even when Capela comes back, our defense will be better, but he'll miss close put back shots that stagnate our offense, with Collins disappearing again. 

So to always focus on Trae's defense ( or lack thereof ), and act like that's the major problem with this team, is ridiculous.

I'll even go to say that Trae's cross court turnovers that lead to fast break points on the other end, are more of a detriment to our defense, than anything Trae does on or off the ball in the half court.  Some of his quick shots lead to points going the other way too.

We're purposely hiding the dude on the spot up shooter in the corner, so he's not under nuclear attack every night on the defensive end.  What he has a tendency to do, is drift toward the lane and leave his man open.  Sometimes he gets burned on it.  Most times, he doesn't.  It's when the opponent gets all of the Hawks moving and rotating, is when we tend to leave shooters wide open.   That's a scheme and BBIQ issue by the entire team.

You guys just do lazy analysis.  I at least give @benhillboy for citing the plays that he saw Trae not giving what he thought was maximum effort on defense.

But the guy has been trying lately.  Really trying.  So he won't get any major criticism from me if he's making more hustle plays on defense and at least jumping out at shooters.

Trae's 3 steals last night.

https://www.nba.com/stats/events?CFID=&CFPARAMS=&ContextMeasure=STL&EndPeriod=0&EndRange=28800&GameID=0022200590&PlayerID=1629027&RangeType=0&Season=2022-23&SeasonType=Regular Season&StartPeriod=0&StartRange=0&TeamID=1610612737&flag=1&sct=plot&section=game

[NBASupes]

11 minutes ago, TheNorthCydeRises said:

And I still back up every single word that I say with more than just blank words and emotion.  I make a point to let everyone know what my thought process on things are.  Hell, I overdo it most times.

With the Hawks being small and soft, we pretty much have to do all of the little things right.  Whether it's defensive coverages, or holding onto rebounds, this team has to play close to perfect to win games.  It's not just one player that is wrong with this team.  Even when Capela comes back, our defense will be better, but he'll miss close put back shots that stagnate our offense, with Collins disappearing again. 

So to always focus on Trae's defense ( or lack thereof ), and act like that's the major problem with this team, is ridiculous.

I'll even go to say that Trae's cross court turnovers that lead to fast break points on the other end, are more of a detriment to our defense, than anything Trae does on or off the ball in the half court.  Some of his quick shots lead to points going the other way too.

We're purposely hiding the dude on the spot up shooter in the corner, so he's not under nuclear attack every night on the defensive end.  What he has a tendency to do, is drift toward the lane and leave his man open.  Sometimes he gets burned on it.  Most times, he doesn't.  It's when the opponent gets all of the Hawks moving and rotating, is when we tend to leave shooters wide open.   That's a scheme and BBIQ issue by the entire team.

You guys just do lazy analysis.  I at least give @benhillboy for citing the plays that he saw Trae not giving what he thought was maximum effort on defense.

But the guy has been trying lately.  Really trying.  So he won't get any major criticism from me if he's making more hustle plays on defense and at least jumping out at shooters.

Trae's 3 steals last night.

https://www.nba.com/stats/events?CFID=&CFPARAMS=&ContextMeasure=STL&EndPeriod=0&EndRange=28800&GameID=0022200590&PlayerID=1629027&RangeType=0&Season=2022-23&SeasonType=Regular Season&StartPeriod=0&StartRange=0&TeamID=1610612737&flag=1&sct=plot&section=game

You wrote all of that when everyone knows that you a relentless Trae stan. I didn't even read what you wrote. I am pretty sure it's guilty talk. When I think of extreme fans, I think of you, me, Terrell, Hots, SHAKES, etc. 

I don't see you in the reasonable tier with AHF and lw3.

I don't see you in the extreme Hawks fan tier with Spud and Jay either. 

 

You basically with us my guy. 

Edited January 7, 2023 by NBASupes

[Spud2nique]

35 minutes ago, NBASupes said:

I like everyone here outside of two posters. 

Who?  

Name names!!!

Hash that ish out

[NBASupes]

2 minutes ago, Spud2nique said:

Who?  

Name names!!!

Hash that ish out

Lol, you know who they are. One is blocked and the other always gets me in trouble.

[AHF]

7 hours ago, BrazilianHawk said:

One of them has to go. We're almost 40 games into the season and they still play like crap together. 

 

The experiment has failed. 

I agree with you that if we are sticking with Nate then we have a good idea how the two of them will play off each other in his offense.  In fairness to them the starters are doing just fine playing together but overall I think Nate’s offense has them adding up to less than the sum of their parts.  Rolling the ball out and saying “take turns” just isn’t enough to optimize them together.

[TheNorthCydeRises]

29 minutes ago, NBASupes said:

You wrote all of that when everyone knows that you a relentless Trae stan. I didn't even read what you wrote. I am pretty sure it's guilty talk. When I think of extreme fans, I think of you, me, Terrell, Hots, SHAKES, etc. 

I don't see you in the reasonable tier with AHF and lw3.

I don't see you in the extreme Hawks fan tier with Spud and Jay either. 

 

You basically with us my guy. 

 

You dang right I'm a Trae fan.  He's easily the best and most impactful player that's been on this team since Dominique. And I've ben watching this team for 40 years.  And when people try to nitpick at everything he does, I'm going to balance all of that negativity out with what he does well.

It's amazing that people would have a problem with me defending one of the best players in franchise history.

It is what it is though.  I just hope I get to enjoy him for at minimum another 4 years, before people try to run him out of town.

 

[kg01]

29 minutes ago, Spud2nique said:

Who?  

Name names!!!

Hash that ish out

You and burd.  Haha.... 

[JayBirdHawk]

4 minutes ago, kg01 said:

You and burd.  Haha.... 

 

[JayBirdHawk]

 

 

 

[kg01]

10 minutes ago, JayBirdHawk said:

 

 

 

See how well and thoughtful that was explained.

Light-years more insightful than the usual 'Trae don't play no defence' and 'Collins is trash' stuff.