Official Game Thread: Hawks at Hornets

[Sothron]

Nate just ranted at them at halftime the previous game. You can't rant every game. It quickly loses its effectiveness especially at the NBA level. 

 

[sturt]

21 minutes ago, Gray Mule said:

They are not this good.  We are not this bad. 

Teams play within ranges of good and bad, of course. The evidence proves that when Charlotte's at their best, and we're something less than our best, they're capable of beating us... their range of performance is high enough, and our range of performance is low enough.

The challenge is to get that low-end on our range of performance higher... winning the ugly games that you should have lost.

Truly, we're capable of blowing them out of the water when our performance is somewhere above that low-end of our range. But it doesn't matter what we're capable of, of course.

We need some element to raise that low-end of our range.

 

So, the conclusion of the matter is this, this Valentine's Day morning, and my personal 21st anniversary... ...

I don't care necessarily who you replace the 14th player on our roster with, as long as you replace him with a veteran who has a reputation as a defensive stopper.

Stanley Johnson? Good.

DeAndre Bembry? Good.

Kris Dunn? Good.

Patrick Beverly, extra good (... but know you're not likely to get him, for a couple of reasons).

Let's go.

[Spud2nique]

3 minutes ago, Sothron said:

Nate just ranted at them at halftime the previous game. You can't rant every game. It quickly loses its effectiveness especially at the NBA level. 

 

Monotone voice, can easily tune it out, like some posters here.  

#lessBS #lessBSlifelessons #GTFO

[NBASupes]

29 minutes ago, shakes said:

Good theory.  I personally think it has more to do with ATL fans don't know what it takes to win and have never followed a winning team.  I have the luxury of having been a die hard Bulls fan living in Chicago during the Jordan era so I know firsthand what it takes to win.  Sure, the Hawks don't have MJ, but MJ was MJ not just because he was more talented than everyone, but because he worked harder and wanted it more than anyone.   Those Bulls teams did everything they could to win and busted their asses on every possession.  

ATL fans don't have the frame of reference so they don't know when their watching a sub-championship effort on a night to night basis.  I do.    After all these years i can definitely say that so far Trae is not a winner, he's a loser player. He shows it night in and night out with his sub par effort in many aspects of the game and his stat driven play.

 

He needs to wake up, grow up, and start LEADING his team by example the right way and you'll see how much that rubs off on the rest of the players.

I don't believe that. We got a smart fanbase. But I agree and will say we just never had a true elite player. Nique wasn't, he was in Carmelo range. Trae isn't, he's Harden lite with a lot more flash so they are very protective. This is more of a star fanbase than others where they seen stars and superstars like the Bulls. They seen guys like Butler, Pippen, Jordan, Rose, so they know what is what.

It's the same when the Falcons had Michael Vick. We were more hyped about that than if we ever had Peyton Manning. Atlanta just loves flash and Trae is the king of flash along with Ja. We made a lot of excuses for Mike as well. 

I agree on Trae though, 100%. He doesn't have the mindset of a winner. He kind of reminds me of Stephon Marbury a lot. I am waiting for his humble moment. It didn't come to Marbury till he was in China. I hope it comes a lot sooner for Trae. 

I think we have to make it as easy as possible for him but he's not an easy player to build around. 

 

[kg01]

5 minutes ago, Sothron said:

Nate just ranted at them at halftime the previous game. You can't rant every game. It quickly loses its effectiveness especially at the NBA level. 

 

Sadly, they look like they're just playing out the string.  This is a lost year.  We'll have a new coach for no other reason than you can't trade everybody.

Even a dummy like me can see it...

[sturt]

6 minutes ago, kg01 said:

Sadly, they look like they're just playing out the string.  This is a lost year.

Hey. I gave up. It was a futile, ill-advised idea to begin with, but I like a challenge as I suppose you do, too.

So, not sure if you were still playing (?), but it was going to be a stiff challenge even if everything went just right these last couple of games. Today, there is no basis for the target finding any bottom, at the risk of stating the obvious.

[JayBirdHawk]

11 hours ago, Jody23 said:

I want to see this team with effective coaching.  Unfortunately, we won't because the objective of staying below the luxury tax is going to mean at least a couple of the team's top guys will be traded this offseason perhaps in Huerter like deals.

Trading talent for picks and lesser talent to reduce cost is just spinning our wheels. We won't get far.

[Spud2nique]

17 minutes ago, NBASupes said:

I don't believe that. We got a smart fanbase. But I agree and will say we just never had a true elite player. Nique wasn't, he was in Carmelo range. Trae isn't, he's Harden lite with a lot more flash so they are very protective. This is more of a star fanbase than others where they seen stars and superstars like the Bulls. They seen guys like Butler, Pippen, Jordan, Rose, so they know what is what.

It's the same when the Falcons had Michael Vick. We were more hyped about that than if we ever had Peyton Manning. Atlanta just loves flash and Trae is the king of flash along with Ja. We made a lot of excuses for Mike as well. 

I agree on Trae though, 100%. He doesn't have the mindset of a winner. He kind of reminds me of Stephon Marbury a lot. I am waiting for his humble moment. It didn't come to Marbury till he was in China. I hope it comes a lot sooner for Trae. 

I think we have to make it as easy as possible for him but he's not an easy player to build around. 

 

This is by far one of the most terrible posts you’ve ever made in your life on squawk. I award you NO points and may god have mercy on your soul.

aka GTFO wit dat and take the Mavs guy wit you, he doesn’t fool anyone I know who he is.

[Spud2nique]

17 minutes ago, kg01 said:

Sadly, they look like they're just playing out the string. 

I don’t think they are, I just feel like they are going through the motions to get to the playoffs. I bet we come back with strong games that change your mind.

[JayBirdHawk]

Every rotation was a step late, every closeout was a half ass effort, we never got into guys, zero ball pressure, no communication on picks or in general. The spacing on the zone was cluttered, lots of scrambling. No ball pressure or ball deny, the Hornets were just stepping into shots. A very lackadaisical effort.

[kg01]

20 minutes ago, sturt said:

Hey. I gave up. It was a futile, ill-advised idea to begin with, but I like a challenge as I suppose you do, too.

So, not sure if you were still playing (?), but it was going to be a stiff challenge even if everything went just right these last couple of games. Today, there is no basis for the target finding any bottom, at the risk of stating the obvious.

Nah, no mas.  No mas. 

[JayBirdHawk]

Tell me what you see on defense:

Hayward:

https://www.nba.com/stats/events?CFID=&CFPARAMS=&ContextMeasure=FGM&EndPeriod=0&EndRange=28800&GameID=0022200857&PlayerID=202330&RangeType=0&Season=2022-23&SeasonType=Regular Season&StartPeriod=0&StartRange=0&TeamID=1610612766&flag=3&sct=plot&section=game

 

Bridges:

https://www.nba.com/stats/events?CFID=&CFPARAMS=&ContextMeasure=FGM&EndPeriod=0&EndRange=28800&GameID=0022200857&PlayerID=1629023&RangeType=0&Season=2022-23&SeasonType=Regular Season&StartPeriod=0&StartRange=0&TeamID=1610612766&flag=3&sct=plot&section=game

 

Ball:

https://www.nba.com/stats/events?CFID=&CFPARAMS=&ContextMeasure=FGM&EndPeriod=0&EndRange=28800&GameID=0022200857&PlayerID=1630163&RangeType=0&Season=2022-23&SeasonType=Regular Season&StartPeriod=0&StartRange=0&TeamID=1610612766&flag=3&sct=plot&section=game

 

Rozier:

https://www.nba.com/stats/events?CFID=&CFPARAMS=&ContextMeasure=FGM&EndPeriod=0&EndRange=28800&GameID=0022200857&PlayerID=1626179&RangeType=0&Season=2022-23&SeasonType=Regular Season&StartPeriod=0&StartRange=0&TeamID=1610612766&flag=3&sct=plot&section=game

 

[Final_quest]

We have a whole thread on how our problem is fit on offense and yet we have no trouble on that end.  Somehow the only person to be held accountable for giving up 140 points to the Hornets is Trae.  And Trae doesn't have game winning attitude because he won't do 3/4 length court shots to end every quarter.  Makes no sense.  

 

A lot of the worst takes come after bad losses.  Forgiven.  There is a lot of justified finger pointing at the moment.  

[NBASupes]

1 minute ago, Final_quest said:

We have a whole thread on how our problem is fit on offense and yet we have no trouble on that end.  Somehow the only person to be held accountable for giving up 140 points to the Hornets is Trae.  And Trae doesn't have game winning attitude because he won't do 3/4 length court shots to end every quarter.  Makes no sense.  

 

A lot of the worst takes come after bad losses.  Forgiven.  There is a lot of justified finger pointing at the moment.  

We were efficient as we should be, they suck on defense but we never made them uncomfortable on offense. Never putting their bigs like PJ in foul trouble. Forcing them to play scrubs. They were comfortable defending us even if they weren't good at it. 

[JayBirdHawk]

10 hours ago, Sothron said:

It isn't fair to ask DJM to be on the best guard every possession and then come down and be the 1a option on offense behind Trae. DJM has done a good job this season. Trae's defense has improved this season. This is the best defense he's ever played in his career

On the flip side, we can't except Trae to be perfect on offense while still stopping every player on defense (since it's ALL his fault we suck ). YES, he still needs to be focused, locked in and give effort but he's always going to be at a disadvantage given his size.

What I want is for the lengthy BIG WIINGS and the Bigs in general to play Big and Tough!

[shakes]

3 minutes ago, Final_quest said:

We have a whole thread on how our problem is fit on offense and yet we have no trouble on that end.  Somehow the only person to be held accountable for giving up 140 points to the Hornets is Trae.  And Trae doesn't have game winning attitude because he won't do 3/4 length court shots to end every quarter.  Makes no sense.  

 

A lot of the worst takes come after bad losses.  Forgiven.  There is a lot of justified finger pointing at the moment.  

Trae doesn't have a winning attitude because he's not willing to do all the little things that can help lead to victory.  Not that hard to understand.  We all have eyes, we can all see it.   Not taking buzzer beaters, not getting back on  defense when he'd rather berate a ref, getting into personal battles, etc.    

 

You don't think it effects the rest of the team when they see their star player refusing to do the little things?    It's basically sports common sense.

[NBASupes]

1 minute ago, JayBirdHawk said:

On the flip side, we can't except Trae to be perfect on offense while still stopping every player on defense (since it's his fault we suck). YES, he still needs to be focused, locked in and give effort but he's always going to be at a disadvantage given his size.

What I want is for the lengthy BIG WIINGS and the Bigs in general to play Big and Tough!

Do we hold Trae to unrealistic offensive expectations? Honestly, most of us are very fair to Trae on that end outside of Hots and Terrell who have higher expectations. 

[kg01]

11 minutes ago, Final_quest said:

We have a whole thread on how our problem is fit on offense and yet we have no trouble on that end.  Somehow the only person to be held accountable for giving up 140 points to the Hornets is Trae.  And Trae doesn't have game winning attitude because he won't do 3/4 length court shots to end every quarter.  Makes no sense. 

A lot of the worst takes come after bad losses.  Forgiven.  There is a lot of justified finger pointing at the moment.  

You've summed up things quite well.

[JayBirdHawk]

14 minutes ago, Final_quest said:

We have a whole thread on how our problem is fit on offense and yet we have no trouble on that end.  Somehow the only person to be held accountable for giving up 140 points to the Hornets is Trae.  And Trae doesn't have game winning attitude because he won't do 3/4 length court shots to end every quarter.  Makes no sense.  

 

A lot of the worst takes come after bad losses.  Forgiven.  There is a lot of justified finger pointing at the moment.  

[AHF]

1 hour ago, shakes said:

For no reason?  Are you kidding me?    Keep drinking the kool-aid.

Unfortunately, it is super common for people not to shoot these.  And it isn't a secret.  Kevin Durant has openly admitted he doesn't shoot them if they will hurt his shooting %s in a given game.

Shane Battier addressed this back when he was playing in a characteristically thoughtful way:

Quote

If you're a true shooter, those shots add up...[Although] the heave is a plus-play. But unfortunately we're not judged on the plus-plays. We're judged on (shooting) percentages. I think they should take the heave out of the stat book. It's common sense.