Uh oh...Ice vs The Baptist

[terrell]

6 minutes ago, ATLHawks3 said:

This is trending on Twitter right now. I hope the players can have a player only meeting to hash things out. 

NBA Central

 

@TheNBACentral

 

https://ahnfiredigital.com/nba/atlanta-hawks/report-john-collins-called-out-trae-youngs-handling

[HawkItus]

2 hours ago, JayBirdHawk said:

The biggest question I have is who 'Spilled the Beans'

I always say who benefits from spilling the beans?

[terrell]

10 minutes ago, aali34 said:

Luka has issues too if anybody was wondering lol. He isn't much of an offball player either, and his fitness and shooting raises eyebrows. Few players have minimal holes in thier games. It's how the team adjusts to these growing pains and adversity that matters.

Pressure makes diamonds.

Luka doesnt need his shooting to be good as much as Trae does..Much more versatile player..Just sayin..

Edited January 8, 2021 by terrell

[AUhawksfan]

Some observations:

-As @JayBirdHawk mentioned, Pierce is way too rigid and needs to be more situational with his rotations.  We need Trae but he should have never put him back in the 4th of that Charlotte game.  We were close with who we had on the floor and Trae was terrible.

-Trae is young so I feel like this is him taking his lumps.  What I'm more concerned with is how they come back the next couple games from this.  All teams go through it, only the good ones work their way out of it as a team.  Will he bring the team together or isolate himself?  We all know and saw what worked the first few games.

-Rondo needs to start earning his pay here, even if he's not playing.  Show them how this works.

[hylndr11]

Looks like rondo is trying to

[Wretch]

13 minutes ago, aali34 said:

Kevin is a good passer. Deandre, Bogi, and Gallo are decent and make good reads. Rondo is obviously top tier.

John has a chance to prove his worth in this area. He says he's been working on his playmaking and there have been some returns, nothing major though. He still has room for improvement. Alot.

On the plus side, this season he has a positive assist/turnover ratio, something he's never done. He also had 5 assists against Cleveland, a career high.

However, there are some plays where he looks to muscle it in instead of finding open teamates and that has to improve. Sometimes when he drives it to the rim off of a pumpfake he tries scoring over the help when there are open players on the wing. That irks me a bit, but it's something that can change.

Trae isn't the only guy who needs to adapt.

I don't mean to imply that we don't have a team full of guys that know how to pass.  The issue is having someone who is good enough to run the offense while Trae is moving AND having that guy on the floor with him at the same time.  All of those guys (Kev, Bogdan, Danillo) are ok I suppose, but none of them are setting up the offense with a runner like Billups to Rip or Mark Jackson to Reggile Miller - and they're all coming off the bench.  Rondo would be a legit option here if he were a few years younger and several inches taller.  I'm not a fan of smallball.  TBH, this may be more reasoning to start Bogi, but again...we're back to coaching.

I'd also add that they're not going to just let Trae run wild and find open looks.  As long as there is no one else on this team that is reliable in the clutch, they will smother him.  It's the same position we find ourselves in now, except initiated in reverse.  There has to be someone, a solid #2 guy, who can consistently hit that shot and alleviate the pressure on our star.  Historically, we have had that guy, but had the opposite problem in not having a legit #1 option like Trae.  Go figure...lol

[marco102]

3 minutes ago, hylndr11 said:

Looks like rondo is trying to

To do what?

[hylndr11]

Teach the guys, ear his money

[aali34]

4 minutes ago, Wretch said:

I don't mean to imply that we don't have a team full of guys that know how to pass.  The issue is having someone who is good enough to run the offense while Trae is moving AND having that guy on the floor with him at the same time.  All of those guys (Kev, Bogdan, Danillo) are ok I suppose, but none of them are setting up the offense with a runner like Billups to Rip or Mark Jackson to Reggile Miller - and they're all coming off the bench.  Rondo would be a legit option here if he were a few years younger and several inches taller.  I'm not a fan of smallball.  TBH, this may be more reasoning to start Bogi, but again...we're back to coaching.

I'd also add that they're not going to just let Trae run wild and find open looks.  As long as there is no one else on this team that is reliable in the clutch, they will smother him.  It's the same position we find ourselves in now, except initiated in reverse.  There has to be someone, a solid #2 guy, who can consistently hit that shot and alleviate the pressure on our star.  Historically, we have had that guy, but had the opposite problem in not having a legit #1 option like Trae.  Go figure...lol

Good point. 

It looks like the guy best suited to do so is either Bogi or Gallo. Kevin and Cam are still learning and aren't as reliable, but could develop to be. John hasn't shown that capability as of yet. Hunter's better at getting to the rim and attacking right now than either Cam or Kevin, but his ball handling is suspect. 

I think Bogi is best for the job right now, but his play has been poor so far. He'll turn it around though.

[Dynamo]

Lots of blame to go around.It’s up to LIoyd Pierce and the Coaching staff to set expectations and to show that they are accountable.What happened in the team meeting should have stayed in the team meeting.I guess John Collins wants to get his max contract on the back of Trae Young.Actions speak louder than words.

[Wretch]

41 minutes ago, NBASupes said:

There is a skill to being an off ball player. Trae showcases none of that. 

Stamina off the ball, nope

Movement BBIQ, nope

the ability to make smart cuts, nope. 

 

Trae just stands around the three point line watching the play unfold. 

Well, I can't argue with any of that.  I would only counter...is it him?  Is it the offense?  Is it the personnel?  If Trae is moving, who is running the offense and what is everyone else doing?  And who is setting him up after all that work?

He's a 3rd year player and has added to his game every season.  He's a pretty heady player and I've no doubt he can figure out how to move without the ball.  However, his strength is dribble penetration, finding open guys, and pick and roll.  There's nothing wrong with that except, like all contenders, we need a reliable 2nd scorer.

TBH...what I'm hearing from everyone is playstyle preference over performance or even statistics.  It's the same "he plays no defense" or "the game has changed and your bigs have to shoot 3's" type of reasoning that people use to devalue otherwise very good players.  In Trae's case, I think we're just getting ahead of ourselves.  When we mature, or he matures, or he matures on a different team we will have a crow feast on the Squawk. 

[Jody23]

 

 

[hawkman]

So, I guess this season is done? I've seen young teams with young stars implode before over contracts and the ball. I can't think of one time those situations ended well. I didn't expect the contract situation to impact the locker room this soon and I didn't expect the "leader" of the team to react to criticism with the lack of maturity I saw last game. While guys are pouting over criticism and contracts and letting it affect their performance on the court, who's focusing on winning games? Is LP going to get this under control? Who the heck leaked this to the media??? I understand this is a young team and maturity will be an issue, but there has to be some structure in place to prevent these kinds of situations from showing up in the media and on the the court. This needs to be handled right now or this season is done after only 8 games. What happened against Charlotte Wednesday night absolutely cannot happen again. 

[benhillboy]

Super-high usage players who defend poorly and do nothing off the ball ultimately become disliked by their teammates.  It’s been inevitable since the days of Adrian Dantley being shipped out of Detroit, and you can best believe Lilliard will leave Portland on bad terms.  This situation developed rather quickly, though.  Damn.  Trae’s petulance is an issue for sure, knowing full well his team is playing 4-on-5 if he isn’t aggressive on ball.

I’m starting to think the Big PGs are the move in this small-ball era.  I’m over here salivating over the many ways Halliburton and Ball can affect the game with moderate minutes.
 

[JayBirdHawk]

2 minutes ago, hawkman said:

So, I guess this season is done? I've seen young teams with young stars implode before over contracts and the ball. I can't think of one time those situations ended well. I didn't expect the contract situation to impact the locker room this soon and I didn't expect the "leader" of the team to react to criticism with the lack of maturity I saw last game. While guys are pouting over criticism and contracts and letting it affect their performance on the court, who's focusing on winning games? Is LP going to get this under control? Who the heck leaked this to the media??? I understand this is a young team and maturity will be an issue, but there has to be some structure in place to prevent these kinds of situations from showing up in the media and on the the court. This needs to be handled right now or this season is done after only 8 games. What happened against Charlotte Wednesday night absolutely cannot happen again. 

I don't think it's just the contract situation since the article also stated that John said this last season:

Quote

This isn’t the first time Collins has raised issues within the team to be more involved, 

Remember the whole - LP doesn't run plays for JC.

[JayBirdHawk]

 

 

[kg01]

Kg's inconsolable.   He's .... intolerable.  He's .... he's incontinent?

Why can't we have nice things?!?

Are we cursed?

[JeffS17]

I hope we can get it together quick.  I've always thought the first natural peak of our rebuild is going to be the 2022-2023 season (given how our contracts line up and how young our team is), and that is still a ways away.  I was hoping this team would have a couple playoff appearances and experience before then, but that's TBD... all this to say we have A LOT of time to sort things out like this.  John not signing this offseason was always going to present these issues and frankly we have too many mouths to feed right now, a problem which only gets worse when everyone is available.

I feel like a large trade is inevitable for this team, so any chemistry issues right now are going to be flipped upside down in the next year/offseason.  I still believe Collins was the centerpiece of a large deal that feel through this past offseason, which is why we were never able to come to agreement on extension terms and that can kept getting kicked.  I will not be surprised at all if we move some pieces before the deadline but that is all likely dependent on how other teams fare the first half of the year.

[gurpilo]

This happened before I thought but I always thought was going to happen at any point. Rondo has a huge job with Trae. John is right, Trae needs to stop trying to be a hero every game, he needs to start playing to win the game and stop playing for himself. That means stop shooting those silly 3 pointers from halfcourt, stop making silly TO, stop throwing passes looking for the highlight of the day, stop playing for his stats, involve the team, begin to make wise choices... A team is better when everyone is playing well instead of just one. He is not effcient enough to enter the playoffs. 

[Wurider05]

I started to write a post on here  the other day after the Cleveland loss about how we have enough talent where is doesn't have to be the Trae Young show all the time. I am not turning anti-Trae but teams appear to be planning for his gimmicks and bag of tricks. I put it on coaching.