Trae

[benhillboy]

None of you all know a bigger proponent of Steph Curry than me.  This is what I posted the very first time I saw him play:

Almost 13 years later show me one lie.  The experts had him pegged as a Kevin Martin clone smh.

As someone who has watched Trae play about 280 times I simply can’t fathom any comparison or contrast of the two if you understand the nuances of high-usage team leadership.  The gulf will continue to widen as most NBA players have a considerable increase in strength after 4-6 years as a pro.  Trae will continue to be the weakest player in the league until he retires.

Edited December 5, 2022 by benhillboy

[Gray Mule]

I want to smack them in the face - - Hard!  When someone says, "That's all I'm saying on the matter" and the person doing the interview just keeps going on and on.  They need to learn what "Shut your mouth" really means.

All persons will not agree 100% of the time about anything.  If they do, one of them is useless.  They become known as "A yes man!"  It could be your spouse, your children, your parents or your boss.  Sooner or later you will disagree.  Nate and Trae reached that point.  Big deal.  No fist fight.  No bloody nose.  No gun play.

They are over it.  We should be over it too.  Now, on to the game tonight!

GO ATL HAWKS !!

[REHawksFan]

6 minutes ago, marco102 said:

Nope. I want Trae and Murray to run the team properly even when they have it going.  When you see someone rolling to the basket wide open, feed them the ball if it's a higher percentage shot than you are taking. 

This keeps their teammates engaged.  Should Trae and Murray be taking the most shots, most certainly, but they need to feed the hot hand when the other guys have it going and they tend to get away from that from time to time. 

The other guys need to compete more on the defense and rebound, but if you're getting shut out on the offense, it may not make you compete harder. 

Feed the guys every now and then even when they have it going.  It'll improve everything we have going. 

This all sounds great.  But the problem I have is guys like JC, Cap, and even Dre aren't really ball movers.  They are ball stoppers.  And that means the only way they are getting their offense going is if guys like Trae and DJ set them up perfectly. So you end up with a lot of dribbles, little passing, and then either Trae or DJ make a late decision to take a shot or pass for the shot.  It results in a lot of standing around.  

Notice in the Denver game you had Culver and JJ in the game and both were very willing passers so you could play through them and work the ball to find the open shooter.  You don't generally get that with Dre or JC and very little with Cap.  Trae can play that way just like DJ if he's got guys that will continue to pass the ball. 

Here's what I perceive to be true (haven't studied it)... If and when Trae or DJ give up the ball, they don't typically get it back unless it's at the end of the shot clock.  

What I want is an offensive system that allows Trae and DJ to play through the other players on the court and let the ball decide where the open shot is.  Maybe it's Trae. Maybe it's DJ. Maybe it's someone else.  Just move the ball around and run actually offense instead of just dribble, dribble, dribble, pass/shoot.  

[marco102]

5 minutes ago, REHawksFan said:

This all sounds great.  But the problem I have is guys like JC, Cap, and even Dre aren't really ball movers.  They are ball stoppers.  And that means the only way they are getting their offense going is if guys like Trae and DJ set them up perfectly. So you end up with a lot of dribbles, little passing, and then either Trae or DJ make a late decision to take a shot or pass for the shot.  It results in a lot of standing around.  

Notice in the Denver game you had Culver and JJ in the game and both were very willing passers so you could play through them and work the ball to find the open shooter.  You don't generally get that with Dre or JC and very little with Cap.  Trae can play that way just like DJ if he's got guys that will continue to pass the ball. 

Here's what I perceive to be true (haven't studied it)... If and when Trae or DJ give up the ball, they don't typically get it back unless it's at the end of the shot clock.  

What I want is an offensive system that allows Trae and DJ to play through the other players on the court and let the ball decide where the open shot is.  Maybe it's Trae. Maybe it's DJ. Maybe it's someone else.  Just move the ball around and run actually offense instead of just dribble, dribble, dribble, pass/shoot.  

Two things can be true at once. 

I was specifically talking about the Houston game which North was referencing. 

 

[macdaddy]

11 minutes ago, benhillboy said:

None of you all know a bigger proponent of Steph Curry than me.  This is what I posted the very first time I saw him play:

Almost 13 years later show me one lie.  The experts had him pegged as a Kevin Martin clone smh.

As someone who has watched Trae play about 280 times I simply can’t fathom any comparison or contrast of the two if you understand the nuances of high-usage team leadership.  The gulf will continue to widen as most NBA players have a considerable increase in strength after 4-6 years as a pro.  Trae will continue to be the weakest player in the league until he retires.

So what does "I am done" really mean to you?  LOL.

Trae doesn't have to be Steph to be great.   I don't like the comparison either.  Honestly i think Steph might be the most underrated star in quite a while.   

 

[MarylandHawk]

15 hours ago, NBASupes said:

Ya'll let your personal feelings about Nate take away from the fact that every coach would have issues with Trae Young. Every single one

Every single coach will have an issue with every single player. They are coaches. They literally are always trying to get their players to play better or adhere to a system constantly. Nate and Trae are no different. Nate has taken a stand on what ever issue he is trying to get across. Now let’s see if it works.  That does not make Trae a cancer. Just last year the NBA was lauding Trae for being such a team guy unlike that guy in Dallas that got his whole organization shipped off.   

[JeffS17]

11 minutes ago, REHawksFan said:

What I want is an offensive system that allows Trae and DJ to play through the other players on the court and let the ball decide where the open shot is.  Maybe it's Trae. Maybe it's DJ. Maybe it's someone else.  Just move the ball around and run actually offense instead of just dribble, dribble, dribble, pass/shoot.  

This is what I day dream about during meetings 

[JeffS17]

17 minutes ago, benhillboy said:

None of you all know a bigger proponent of Steph Curry than me.  This is what I posted the very first time I saw him play:

Almost 13 years later show me one lie.  The experts had him pegged as a Kevin Martin clone smh.

As someone who has watched Trae play about 280 times I simply can’t fathom any comparison or contrast of the two if you understand the nuances of high-usage team leadership.  The gulf will continue to widen as most NBA players have a considerable increase in strength after 4-6 years as a pro.  Trae will continue to be the weakest player in the league until he retires.

The only thing that makes Trae and Curry similar is their range and size when entering the league.  Trae's game has always been more like a Harden/Nash hybrid, maybe a little AI in there as well at times.  

[Wretch]

Man... I gotta start treating the Squawk like a TV show?  I damn near missed a whole episode! LOL Wow...

Key takeaways for me...

Who put it out there?
Seems more likely that someone tossed a few doubloons at a shady barkeep who in turn said, "Now, ye dinnae come by it from ol' Jeerdan Crowfoot 'ere, but I hear'd..." 

Could be a teammate with an agenda, but to me only a guy who is rooted here would have something to gain from it.  Anyone else would understand that it may not matter to them by the trade deadline or the summer.  None of the players who fit that description seem to be the type to do it. 

It ain't Nate...else he's just cutting his own head off. 

Is it serious?
Yes.

Elaborate!
It's not serious for the team.  All them dudes are good.  Think back to AJ's interview weeks ago.  He loves the team and loves how closely knit they are.  There's an obvious rift between Trae and Nate, but neither has to take this route to draw attention to it.  All Trae has to do is have a discreet conversation with ownership/front office.

Your star player should be sitting on the bench if he's injured - that's just on Nate.  I've seen too much support and positivity over the summer and up to now to lead me to believe there is any kind of player issue in the locker room - especially with how visibly and vocally DJM and Trae support each other.

So, I think serious from our perspective and, as I have been saying since the preseason, serious for Nate.  You can tell a lot just by reading between the lines.  It's what people DON'T say that often says way more.  I'm not an advocate of social media, I think it's mostly trash, but you can learn a lot on Twitter/Instagram watching how these guys move and their close connections.

I will say this last thing about Trae...  He's a knucklehead and if he wasn't a Hawk, he'd be one of those guys that gets under my skin.  He's not a KG type of villain though out here looking for trouble.  Trae is more like Reggie Miller in that he has a giant chip on his shoulder and won't back down. 

More importantly, if you follow him and his dad on social media, you will see the character he's been raised with.  His father has clearly put some values in him.  As a father of four myself, three of them being Trae's age, I have a tremendous amount of respect for the work his dad has poured into him and the fact that he allows Trae to be his own man.

1 hour ago, marco102 said:

I respect Zach for pushing Trae on this. 

 

What I see Trae is trying to be professional and respect the code.  I appreciate both Zach asking questions and Trae doubling down.  To me, this is a statement from Trae that he puts the team first.  Also, there is enough out in the open that we can draw some pretty solid conclusions.  He knows that and he knows that everyone else knows that.

[shakes]

1 hour ago, marco102 said:

I respect Zach for pushing Trae on this. 

 

Trae looks like an ass and that interview only made him look worse.

 

Not happy right now as the resident self proclaimed #1 Trae stan.

 

[JeffS17]

7 minutes ago, Wretch said:

Could be a teammate with an agenda, but to me only a guy who is rooted here would have something to gain from it.  Anyone else would understand that it may not matter to them by the trade deadline or the summer.  None of the players who fit that description seem to be the type to do it. 

JC is the guy that could leak this and it would make sense.  He hasn't had issue talking to the media in the past or raising issues he has with the team.  I know people love to dismiss Kirschner and any friction between Trae and JC, but I'll repeat it again that it's obvious to me they don't like each other, and that is probably the reason JC is on the trade block perennially.  It wouldn't surprise me if he leaked something if his perspective is Trae was being a baby and not respecting Nate or Nate's authority.  JC is a military guy and probably the most culturally congruent with Nate's leadership style.

[skimaskway23]

6 minutes ago, shakes said:

Trae looks like an ass and that interview only made him look worse.

 

Not happy right now as the resident self proclaimed #1 Trae stan.

 

Would you have preferred for him to spill details? Throw someone under the bus?

 

He handled it like, dare I say, a leader?

[marco102]

4 minutes ago, JeffS17 said:

JC is the guy that could leak this and it would make sense.  He hasn't had issue talking to the media in the past or raising issues he has with the team.  I know people love to dismiss Kirschner and any friction between Trae and JC, but I'll repeat it again that it's obvious to me they don't like each other, and that is probably the reason JC is on the trade block perennially.  It wouldn't surprise me if he leaked something if his perspective is Trae was being a baby and not respecting Nate or Nate's authority.  JC is a military guy and probably the most culturally congruent with Nate's leadership style.

Stop putting this fantasy out there.  It wasn't a player that leaked this.  HawksfanTV has contacts with people in the front office and he was tweeting about it days before Shams.

HawksfanTV wants John traded so I'm pretty sure John wasn't the source.

[TheNorthCydeRises]

5 minutes ago, shakes said:

Trae looks like an ass and that interview only made him look worse.

 

Not happy right now as the resident self proclaimed #1 Trae stan.

 

 

This was the sentiment on NBA Radio by Sam Amick.

He says that the players will / have sided with Nate against Trae.

He also elaborated a little more about what he wrote in his Athletic article.  He doesn't think tensions are high, but he also said that Nate is in no jeopardy of losing his job unless something "catastrophic" happens.  He also restated the point about the coaches wanting Trae to be more of a leader.

So unfortunately, this story isn't going away.  The afternoon media will probably blow it up even further, with people siding against Trae and for Nate.

Be prepared for what you see starting with Malika and the NBA Today crew in about 20 minutes.  Then this will continue in the morning.  God forbid that we lose vs OKC and Trae has a bad game.  They'll have a field day with this.

[marco102]

1 minute ago, skimaskway23 said:

Would you have preferred for him to spill details? Throw someone under the bus?

 

He handled it like, dare I say, a leader?

People really don't get that Trae is socially awkward and doesn't know how to articulate things. 

He was obviously annoyed by the question, but couldn't think of a good way of putting his best non-answer out there like a LBJ or Steph Curry would. 

I still respect Zach for pushing for direct answers. I don't have a problem with Trae's non response. 

[marco102]

Just now, TheNorthCydeRises said:

 

This was the sentiment on NBA Radio by Sam Amick.

He says that the players will / have sided with Nate against Trae.

He also elaborated a little more about what he wrote in his Athletic article.  He doesn't think tensions are high, but he also said that Nate is in no jeopardy of losing his job unless something "catastrophic" happens.  He also restated the point about the coaches wanting Trae to be more of a leader.

So unfortunately, this story isn't going away.  The afternoon media will probably blow it up even further, with people siding against Trae and for Nate.

Be prepared for what you see starting with Malika and the NBA Today crew in about 20 minutes.  Then this will continue in the morning.  God forbid that we lose vs OKC and Trae has a bad game.  They'll have a field day with this.

That's why they better win. I'll be in the building tonight!

[TheNorthCydeRises]

1 minute ago, TheNorthCydeRises said:

 

This was the sentiment on NBA Radio by Sam Amick.

He says that the players will / have sided with Nate against Trae . . .

. . . on this issue.

[NBASupes]

5 hours ago, Spud2nique said:

 You made ish up bro.

 

Thank you. 

 

 So you’re basically saying “while I lied about Bud running from Trae”….

 

You remind me of a friend I had in junior high in the late 80’s trying to convince me that Andre Agassi saw him play tennis and thought he was so special he gave him a pair of shoes …

 

I just got my time periods wrong and didn't notice till that point. Ya'll going in on me. I see two posts with my name in it

[Wretch]

5 minutes ago, JeffS17 said:

JC is the guy that could leak this and it would make sense.  He hasn't had issue talking to the media in the past or raising issues he has with the team.  I know people love to dismiss Kirschner and any friction between Trae and JC, but I'll repeat it again that it's obvious to me they don't like each other, and that is probably the reason JC is on the trade block perennially.  It wouldn't surprise me if he leaked something if his perspective is Trae was being a baby and not respecting Nate or Nate's authority.  JC is a military guy and probably the most culturally congruent with Nate's leadership style.

Y'know... 

I used to be a JC hater and I was ready to flip him as a prime asset years ago.  He has since become my favorite Hawk.  I think he's the heart of the locker room and I think he knows it.  I personally think their rift was overblown or that they've otherwise totally buried it - especially after that historic playoff run for us.  I've only seen positive vibes from those two since then.

If anything, I think they have a professional understanding that the team may trade Collins.  Like...I think that all sides - owner, coaches, and players - understand why this trade would happen, but nobody really wants it to.

[NBASupes]

1 minute ago, Wretch said:

Y'know... 

I used to be a JC hater and I was ready to flip him as a prime asset years ago.  He has since become my favorite Hawk.  I think he's the heart of the locker room and I think he knows it.  I personally think their rift was overblown or that they've otherwise totally buried it - especially after that historic playoff run for us.  I've only seen positive vibes from those two since then.

If anything, I think they have a professional understanding that the team may trade Collins.  Like...I think that all sides - owner, coaches, and players - understand why this trade would happen, but nobody really wants it to.

JC shouldn't be traded but he has to be because of that contract.